Leica M7 '5000' flashing

[Huss]

I was shooting Cinestill 800 in my M7. It doesn't have DX coding so I had to manually set the speed to 800.
Interestingly enough, '5000' was flashed in the VF everytime the camera was switched on, while my SF24D flash correctly showed 800 in TTL mode.

Researching this, it seems that some non DX film canisters can cause this. Apparently it has no effect on the actual ISO set manually, just looks unnerving. Exposures seemed correct.

An FYI to anyone who sees this.

 

[Robert Lai]

I had the same issue with Portra 160 DX encoded. The film speed would not read, and it showed 5000. Even with the flash unit attached the flash unit was given an ISO of 5000 by the camera. Leica replaced a circuit board for me.

 

[Huss]

I had the same issue with Portra 160 DX encoded. The film speed would not read, and it showed 5000. Even with the flash unit attached the flash unit was given an ISO of 5000 by the camera. Leica replaced a circuit board for me.

Well that doesn't sound like fun!

From my googling:

"An ISO of 5000 in the range/viewfinder means the sensors are reading 5 conducting surfaces in the fim speed section. Keep in mind the 6th surface which is the 1 next to where the spool comes out of the cartridge always is conductive on both the film speed side & the film length/film latitude side....Your non DX coded cartridge may be somehow registering as the series: B,B,B,B,B,B which is the code for ISO 5,000...I've used it with both 100 and 160 DX coded film so far and both of these have registered fine. On the Rollei film there is black company contact information written in place of the barcode and black/silver DX contacts and the wrap is a light grey colour so i think you must be right that this is confusing the M7 and causing it to show 5000. "

I'll put in a regular DX roll and see what happens, in both DX and manual ISO setting modes.

 

[Huss]

I put in an old roll of Kodachrome 40 that I use to test film loading etc as I can't get it developed (it's how I tested the # of rolls of film my F6 with Watson batteries would run - but I digress). It is DX coded and the M7 correctly showed '40' when turned on.
So yep, it's weird behavior with Cinestill 800 cartridges.

 

[sanmich]

so it's one of the issues with the older electrical DX reader?
I wonder if Leica is still replacing them free of charge...

 

[Archlich]

An older M7 of mine occasionally insists a roll of Superia 400 being shot at "1600", no matter how I set the ISO, manual or DX.

Just wonder why a supposed-to-be-simple DX reader could be plagued with so much trouble.

 

[Huss]

My M7's serial # is in the 330XXX range, so it is not one of the older ones. The Cinestill 800 roll has a whole bunch of writing, colours etc all over it, while a regular roll of film has only the DX pattern. It seems by the way the DX reader in the M7 works, it is thrown off by non DX rolls .
The thing is, it is just an annoyance because the ISO with non DX rolls is determined by setting the ISO manually, which overrides anything that the DX reader may read. What you set manually, which is what you have to do with non DX rolls, is what the camera actually uses. This was demonstrated when my flash showed the correct ISO reading.
Cinestill is the only film stock I have that is non DX coded. Funny cuz even my ancient expired film - like the Kodachrome 40 - is DX coded!

 

[quejai]

Try putting some tape on the canister, so the electrical contacts don't touch anything conductive when the film is loaded.

 

[Ronald M]

Automation = trouble

 

[Huss]

Automation = trouble

Thing is, I think everyone would have preferred it if Leica did not implement ANY Dx reader. We are but simple folk, getting an AE mode was enough..
😉

Of course cameras like the Nikon F6 work perfectly whether DX film or not is loaded.

 

[Huss]

Forgot to mention - got my film back and it was perfectly exposed. So the manual setting of the ISO is what mattered.

 

[Robert Lai]

If the film is not DX coded, the camera is supposed to default to 100, not 5000.

In my case, the strange behavior occurred AFTER I had Leica upgrade the camera to the optical film speed reader. It would not respond to the ISO dial on the back of the camera either.

Leica USA still performs the upgrades to the optical reader for FREE.

CLA + Upgrade to MP type rangefinder was about $600.

 

[Huss]

If the film is not DX coded, the camera is supposed to default to 100, not 5000.

Yes, if you do not set the ISO manually. If you set it manually - which you would as it is ISO 800 film - with the Cinestill 800 it flashes 5000 even though it actually uses the correct manually set value for the meter reading.
It's because the Cinestill rolls have designs on them that confuse the M7's DX reader to think that it actually is 5000 ISO film.

 

[sepiareverb]

Just loaded some Rollei Ortho 25 into my M7, after adding one of those Cripps DX coding labels for 25 to the non-coded cassette. But alas, it reads 5000.

 

[sepiareverb]

After finishing the roll and rewinding I loaded the same roll of Ortho with the Cripps DX coding label of 25 into another M7 that has the old DX reader and it read 400. Useless waste of money those labels.

 

[Huss]

Just loaded a roll of Silberra Orta50 which has DX coding. Camera flashes 5000. So I set it manually.
The DX coding on the Silberra film is not printed onto the canister like with mainstream mfgs, but looks like a sticker. So that must be why.

 

[Huss]

Finished that roll, put in a roll of Lomo 800 where the DX coding is printed onto the canister and the DX reader works fine.
So it seems that the camera cannot read those sticker DX labels.
Also all the DX labels on every other roll of film I have are silver and black. (Kodak, Fuji, Ilford, Lomo, Arista etc).
On Silberra they are copper and black. I bet that is the issue.

 

[sepiareverb]

That dang DX reader has been the most annoying part of my shooting M7 bodies. I had an a la carte (second hand) that was in NJ two or three times and could never work flawlessly. My current bodies are generally fine, other than the occasional hiccup with known problem film cassettes.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Automation = trouble

If it lies within legendary German engineering of Leica.
Any other manufacturer doesn't allow drinking beer at work.

 

[css9450]

I think they're trying to persuade everyone to push their film to ASA 5000. An easy task if you're shooting Delta 3200, but all those Panatomic-X shooters are probably gagging over their f-stops!