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M-body for under $1k = fantasy?
- Thread starter Horatio
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I
itsjustaride
Guest
I may have been the lucky winner. I just got an UGLY m4-p from KEH for $744+tax a couple weeks ago. I needed an m body because I have the canon 28 2.8 ltm and haven’t enjoyed a lens more. I also have a requirement that YYE needs to be able to repair if needed as his service has been the best of experiences. With the crazy prices these days I thought I’d never find something so when I saw it, I thought about their excellent return policy (I’d only be out shipping) and purchased it without thinking more than 30 seconds.
I was expecting a filthy finder or even fungus. Clean. Curtains look good. Speeds are accurate to ear and not one issue using tri-x. Some wear from the strap clasps, the tiniest ding on the top (brass top). Functionally it is perfect and I haven’t put it down. I would not hesitate to purchase an UGLY m body from KEH if I had a reason going forward.
shawn
Veteran
Nice, congratulations. If I hadn't just bought a M3 I would have grabbed it. Most times I find KEH's ratings are *very* conservative. Other places seem to be much more variable.
Shawn
I
itsjustaride
Guest
steveyork
Well-known
Keep an eye out on the various auction sites. M2''s, M4's, DS M3's can come in at the 700-900 range at times, and some are in good shape. Some parts of the year are better then others. Don't chase a deal; let it come to you. If you are patient, and aren't possessed with the need for immediate satisfaction, you'll find them at the right price. The camera will likely need a CLA, and that's another 250 or so.
J
jmonat7
Guest
THIS. The best time of the year to buy an M is winter. People get out and about in the warmer months and this causes camera sales to rise. But it seems that yesterday was the best time to get an M in the current market. Prices are rising faster than ever.
MrBern
Member
Ebay
Ebay
Not bragging but I got a 1959 M3 on eBay for$750 just this pass Memorial Day wknd.
Try keeping an eye on anything closing the next long holiday wknd.
Labor Day is coming soon.
Good Luck.
Ebay
Not bragging but I got a 1959 M3 on eBay for$750 just this pass Memorial Day wknd.
Try keeping an eye on anything closing the next long holiday wknd.
Labor Day is coming soon.
Good Luck.
fti
Established
hmmm in NL I see second hand (cla-ed) prices of M6 going for 2K EUR. I get a feeling that they are over priced in NL.
Fraser
Well-known
Everything has gone up in price, the time to buy I reckon was when digital came along and Leica had nothing digital so Leica owners were trading in film stuff, but what happened when the M8 and M9 came out owners started to think about a film body to go with the digital stuf and since then prices have kept increasing.
My fist Leica film M about fifteen years ago was a mint M3 with a goggled summaron 2.8 which I paid from a dealer around £800, then a couple of years later M6ttl .85 for £900, another couple of years MP for £1800 then M2 again from a dealer which I still have £300 best buy only a few years ago a broken M4p without a base for £120ish on ebay another £150 for repairs and a base. The only other M I have kept which I got a few years ago is a black paint M4 which I'm not sure I could ever justify the cost to replace.
Bargains are out there but maybe not in the places they used to be.
My fist Leica film M about fifteen years ago was a mint M3 with a goggled summaron 2.8 which I paid from a dealer around £800, then a couple of years later M6ttl .85 for £900, another couple of years MP for £1800 then M2 again from a dealer which I still have £300 best buy only a few years ago a broken M4p without a base for £120ish on ebay another £150 for repairs and a base. The only other M I have kept which I got a few years ago is a black paint M4 which I'm not sure I could ever justify the cost to replace.
Bargains are out there but maybe not in the places they used to be.
Horatio
Masked photographer
Any cons to the M-1?
shawn
Veteran
No rangerfinder, it is scale focus only.
Sahwn
Sahwn
raydm6
Yay! Cameras! 🙈🙉🙊┌( ಠ_ಠ)┘ [◉"]
Also check out the Leica MDa and MD-2 if you want to do the scale/zone focus thing. But, you would need to buy an appropriate focal-length auxiliary viewfinder - unless of course you want to guesstimate your framing.
Some RFF Threads... Leica MDa, complete guess work. I love it.
Horatio
Masked photographer
Oh yeah. Doh! I read that somewhere. Not for me.
twvancamp
Thom
Great advice. Figure out exactly what you want and what you're willing to pay. Set up an alert if possible and keep an eye on various for sale pages. You'll see plenty of sub-1k M bodies. And I'd agree with Steve, better to save up for 6 more months or w/e and get something that won't need serviced for a while. Good luck!
Godfrey
somewhat colored
My (likely last ever) film M is a Leica M4-2 that I bought in "bargain" condition from KEH for $720 in 2012. I had the viewfinder cleaned, collimated, and adjusted for accuracy (about $100 at the local camera tech), and it otherwise looks like new-ish. The shutter is slightly off at 1/1000 second but on the money everywhere else.
I don't see much in way of build quality differences between it and my once-was M4, M3, M2, M6, or M6TTL bodies. The viewfinder on the early M4-2 has exactly the same optics as the M4 and thus no flare, unlike later examples and models. The M4-2 was the first M to be able to take a factory motor winder and they went to steel film drive gears to withstand that additional torque safely, so they might not have exactly the same feel as the brass gears that are in the M4 and earlier models, but that doesn't mean they are any more poorly made.
Some of the first run bodies did ship with factory defects in workmanship, for sure. Most have been taken care of by now ... that was nearly 45 years ago, after all, and most defects were nothing that a good hand-overhaul can't take care of. There are a few parts that were improved in later years, and in general it's not a problem to retrofit them to the M4-2 as well. 🙂
The big thing that made the M4-2 and later models different from the earlier models was that Leica changed the manufacturing process to simplify some assemblies and sub-assemblies in order to reduce the cost of manufacture. If the parts are in spec and the camera is assembled correctly, this difference makes no noticeable difference in the finished camera's feel, reliability, or durability.
My best feeling M was an M4-P that was the personal property of a New York Times reporter, and which had been completely overhauled by Sherry Krauter shortly before he sold it to me. I had that one around about 1998 or so; it was a 1981 body. I sold it in 2004, wish I still had it. But my current M4-2 I actually like more because of its simpler viewfinder and lack of flare on the focusing patch.
G
I don't see much in way of build quality differences between it and my once-was M4, M3, M2, M6, or M6TTL bodies. The viewfinder on the early M4-2 has exactly the same optics as the M4 and thus no flare, unlike later examples and models. The M4-2 was the first M to be able to take a factory motor winder and they went to steel film drive gears to withstand that additional torque safely, so they might not have exactly the same feel as the brass gears that are in the M4 and earlier models, but that doesn't mean they are any more poorly made.
Some of the first run bodies did ship with factory defects in workmanship, for sure. Most have been taken care of by now ... that was nearly 45 years ago, after all, and most defects were nothing that a good hand-overhaul can't take care of. There are a few parts that were improved in later years, and in general it's not a problem to retrofit them to the M4-2 as well. 🙂
The big thing that made the M4-2 and later models different from the earlier models was that Leica changed the manufacturing process to simplify some assemblies and sub-assemblies in order to reduce the cost of manufacture. If the parts are in spec and the camera is assembled correctly, this difference makes no noticeable difference in the finished camera's feel, reliability, or durability.
My best feeling M was an M4-P that was the personal property of a New York Times reporter, and which had been completely overhauled by Sherry Krauter shortly before he sold it to me. I had that one around about 1998 or so; it was a 1981 body. I sold it in 2004, wish I still had it. But my current M4-2 I actually like more because of its simpler viewfinder and lack of flare on the focusing patch.
G
Horatio
Masked photographer
Thanks for the details on the M4-2 @Godfrey. I’m leaning towards a black M4. Time to start selling some vintage bike stuff.
maartenmoerman
Established
Get a konica hexar RF, takes M lenses, has aperture priority and 4000/sec shutter speed, and you can see if you have a film in it 🙂 Still available for around 650. Beats Leica if you ask me.
Horatio
Masked photographer
Thanks, Maarten. I'll consider it, but I'm really trying to avoid older camera electronics. I want something that doesn't depend upon a battery.
I
itsjustaride
Guest
I’ve had an m4, CLE, cl, m4-2, one of the bessas, M5, and now m4-p.
If rank them: m5, m4-p/M4-2, m4, cle, Bessa, CL
Tom R
Established
I use two M4-Ps for a variety of reasons ... . But since you brought up electronics, the M4-X bodies have hot-shoe as well as PC plugs. Don't know if this is helpful.
TR
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