Got an M6

[Assaf]

After a few month of abandoning my Canon DSLR and shooting cheap fixed focal RFs I stumbled upon a classic M6 and impulsively bought it.

The camera was bought from and RFF member, has hardly any signs of use. It was CLA'd and had its VF modified only a month ago, and was sold at a very good price.

I didn't plan this purchase, it was completely impulsive and spontanious, but I'm very happy with it.

Now, like many other guys in the forum, I need a lens....

I apologize for asking questions that were asked before.... but anyone wishing to comment will be appreciated....

I want to buy a new and been considering the following options:
1) Ultron 35/1.7
2) 35/2.5 Pancake II M
3) Nokton 40/1.4
4) 40 Rokkor
5) 40 Summicron-C

Yesterday I shot with the Ultron and Nokton of my friends. Haven't yet seen the outcomes. Now I have the following dilemmas:

1) 35 or 40?
Actually I like 40mm. It was the focal length on my cheap RFs and I found it satisfying for almost all purposes. However, the 40mm lens brings up the 50mm framelines which I found really annoying.

The lens can be hacked so that it would bring up the 35mm framelines, however I checked (opened the camera back, put a semi opaque paper and opened lens in bulb, looked at the reflection and compared to framelines) and found that the 35 framelines are pretty tight for 35, so will be too loose for 40.

In light of that, I don't understand how people use the 35 framelines for composing 40mm. Or am I missing something?

Should I really mind the framelines or will I eventually virtually see the actual frame after some practice?

From the "educational" point of view - wouldn't you thing that it's better to take a standard 35 lens as the first lens?

2) I shot the Nokton at wide open and liked the results. How does the Ultron perform at 1.7? Anybody has some examples in 1.7?

3) I prefer the focus ring of the Ultron rather than the focus lever of the Nokton. On the other hand the Ultron is a bit bulky and intrudes part of the frame.

4) I mostly shoot night street photography, so I need a fast lens. As long, of course, as it performs well at open apertures and has pleasent looking out of focus regions. I shoot mostly black and white.

5) If I add the pancake to the consideration (thought it's a stop slower) how does the new version -Pancake II M perform with respect to the Ultron. Previous versions of this lens were said to be too contrasty.

6) Should I consider the 40 Rokkor or 40 Summicron-C? They are in the same price level and there are currently a few copies availabel in KEH.

OK, hope someone was patient enough to read my length thread and is willing to respond 🙂

Good night
Assaf

 

[ocean7]

I was in the same situation two weeks ago. I got myself a nice used M6 and I had to find a lens. I opted for a 40 Rokkor from KEH. It was rated EX+ and I would rate it like new minus! Glass is perfect and I have only shot two rolls of slides so far but this lens is really impressive. I have a lot for L glass for my Canon DSLR (haven't sold this one yet... I just don't dare) and I doubt one of the L's is as sharp as the old little Rokkor. I couldn't afford a Summicron 35 otherwise I would have gone this way. I purchased the Rokkor after I read a lot of reviews on photo.net and I am not disappointed, plus it feels a bit like Leitz glass 🙂

I must add I have no trouble using the 35mm framelines, just remember that what will be recorded on film will be framed a bit tighter.

Good luck and all the best,

Philippe.

 

[Assaf]

Hi Philippe!
Thanks for you answer!
How do you get along with the framing?
Does it bring up the 50mm or is it hacked to bring up 35mm?

Can you tell me (roughly) how much it cost you, I want to know if the current price in KEH (484$) is reasonable.
Thanks

Assaf

 

[ocean7]

I filed the thing to bring the 35mm framelines. Instructions here :
http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00CcwG

I did not care for the Leica. The lens I got is the Rokkor 40/2 for CL. There is a debate over the cam of the Rokkors that could not be the same as on the Leica, and another one about the coating. I am no expert but the 40/2 CL I have (Minolta that is) appears multicoated, and I have had no problem focusing it far and near.

One advantage of the Rokkor vs the Leica is that the Rokkor uses std 40.5mm filters.


I paid about US$ 350 for the lens and it's in beautiful condition. A bit expensive but I did not want to wait for a nice sample to show up on _bay, plus I had a return privilege with KEH.

 

[Ben Z]

Can't help you with lens choices but congrats on the M6. I'm looking forlornly at mine, bought last year for <$900 from KEH in "bargain" (but conservatively would've been EX anywhere else), and though I know I could get more than that now, and could really use to fill the gaping hole in my net worth created by the M8, and doubt I'll ever shoot much film anymore, I still can't bring myself to let go.

 

[Assaf]

Thanks guys!

Ben - great shots in your gallery! Do yourself a favour and load a roll into your M6 🙂

Phillipe - I see that you preferred the Rokkor over the Nokton, even though it's slower and more expenssive. However, I read in this forum that it's considered a much better lens.
How do you manage with the framing? Any examples?

all the best
Assaf

 

[Monz]

Hi Assaf,
If you are looking at 35 and 40mm lenses, you should also consider the Zeiss Ikon 35mm Biogon. I recently got a nice used one for my M6 - it really is a very impressive lens. There are lots of examples of photos taken with this lens in my gallery.
All the best.

--
Monz

 

[Benjamin Marks]

It will take you a little while to figure out what lens matches the way you see. If you are really going to be using the lens to do street photography, I would opt for the 40/1.4. It is probably the best deal on reasonably fast glass out there (C/V 50/1.5 also worth considering). Shoot with it for six months and see whether you find yourself "taking a step backwards" when you compose. I have both the 40/1.4 and the 40/2 Summicron. Both are excellent lenses. Some folks do not care for the boke of the Nockton wide open, others (Sean Reid comes to mind) have found that there is some focus shift with this lens when stopping down from 1.4 to 2.8. I have never found that either issue affects my pix. Most folks find that they gravitate to a certain field of view when choosing a favorite lens. My weakness is for 50s. If after six months, you aren't happy you can sell the lens you chose and try something else.

Ben Marks

 

[ocean7]

Phillipe - I see that you preferred the Rokkor over the Nokton, even though it's slower and more expenssive. However, I read in this forum that it's considered a much better lens.

I did consider the Nokton but for whatever sentimental reason (long story) my heart went to the Rokkor.

How do you manage with the framing? Any examples?

I still have to purchase a scanner, but I can drop a slide in the mail for you if you want 😀

 

[Assaf]

thanks!
Monz - I considered the Zeiss glass, but it seems out of my budget limit in the meantime.....

Benjamin - you're reply really helps me with putting things together.
Actually I really like 40mm. My previous RF is a Canonet having 40mm and I really liked its angle of view. 50 seems to narrow to me (and too small in the M6 VF) and 35 a bit too wide.

On my DSLR I always shot street on 17 (~28 for film) but I think it's a bad habbit shooting too wide, and making myself life too easy....

Can you please tell me how you composed 40mm on M6? The 35 lines seem too loose and 50 too tight.

 

[HSI]

Just use the 50 framelines, its nice to be able to guess outside instead of compensating inside. The Rokkor 40 is a superb lens, incredibly sharp and contrasty and small to boot.

 

[35mmdelux]

You didn't ask about the 50, but don't under-estimate the 50mm Summicron for reasonably fast one lens kit. The latest model considered one of Leicas best in terms of sharpness and bokeh. These days I use it for street as well as portraits. I've got a chrome 50 latest and when mounted on my MP I know I've got one of the best setups in the world. If your leaning to one lens, don't compromise. good luck-

The Rokkor and Cron-C well known for its bokeh.

 

[Krosya]

I have Rokkor 40, Ultron 35/1.7, Summicron 50, Planar 50, etc. I use them all on M6 (among others) and for Rokkor - at first I did use 50mm frame, but later filed it to bring up 35mm as I think it's closer to 35mm than 50mm. Just matter of practice. I like both Rokkor and Ultron, but for different reasons. If you want faster - get Ultron. I have never used CV 40/1.4, but from photos taken with it it didn't seem to deliver the look I like. Rokkor is a very good lens, very smooth and sharp at the same time. Fluid. Handles flare well. Small and light. Yet, I seem to be more of a 50mm shooter, so I don't use my Ultron or Rokkor as much as I do my 50mm lenses - and I have several of those. I also dislike focusing tabs (only one I like is on Planar 50/2), so I added a small ring of leather to my Rokkor's focusing ring, where tab is and use it that way.
If you chose to go 50mm route - Planar is a great lens. Only reason not to get C-Cron 40/2 is - it's more expensive usually and has hard to find filter/hood ring size. Rokkor beats it there. But otherwise its about the same, really.
Anyway - good luck with your quest - it's usually tough and fun at the same time.

 

[Chris Lynch]

i just got a BGN 40 M-Rokkor CLE version from KEH, as my first M lens for the Hexar, and i totally love it. Fantastic lens at a great price (i paid $225).

 

[Assaf]

Hi guys,
many thanks for the answers!

Phiippe - I'll wait till you have a scanner.... don't want the slide to get lost in mail 🙄

from what I see by now. The Nokton seems a good starter lens. It's easy to find, relatively not expensive and fast. I'm also used to 40 and its a good starter compromise between 35 and 50.

I believe that other lenses perform better, but since I'm a novice Leica shooter, I think that Ben was right and it's better to practice on it for a few months and then consider what I'm lacking and develop.

Another novice question - I've always used a UV filter on my SLR/DSLR lenses.
However, I see that many RF used do not use protecting filters. What do I loose from using a neutral filter? Will it mess up the flares shooting light sources at night?

How about a hood? is it that improtant?

Another out of the blue question 😕 - not that I'm going to do it - but is it possible to modify the M6 and replace the 28 framelines with 40?
I don't think I'll ever use the 28 since its to wide for my use and I can also hardly see it (wearing thick glasses)

I think I'll be able to with 35/50 framelines, just wondering....

Thanks again
you've all been really helpful!
Assaf

 

[JNewell]

However, I see that many RF used do not use protecting filters. What do I loose from using a neutral filter? Will it mess up the flares shooting light sources at night?

You add another pair of glass surfaces with the increased possibility of flare when shooting toward light sources.

How about a hood? is it that improtant?

Hoods reduce the chances of flare and provide some phyiscal protection.

Another out of the blue question - not that I'm going to do it - but is it possible to modify the M6 and replace the 28 framelines with 40?

Unfortunately not.

 

[Assaf]

another question if I may 🙂
in exposures longer than 1/60 there is some additional noise after the shutter noise closes. It's very noticable in 1second exposure
I guess that's not a bug since the camera was recently CLA'd
does anyone know the explanation?

 

[Benjamin Marks]

thanks!
Can you please tell me how you composed 40mm on M6? The 35 lines seem too loose and 50 too tight.

With the 40, I use the 50 lines as a general guide to what will be in the center of the frame . . experience will teach you how much "extra" you have. You will have to modify this for the way you shoot and process film. 1 hour labs, for instance, often crop the edges of the frame to print 135 film on standard paper sizes. I tend to print full format in my own darkroom or scan negatives and print from a computer. Another thing to consider is that modifying the mount on the 40/1.4 to bring up the 35 framelines may affect re-sale value, in the event that you decide the lens is not for you.

Ben Marks

 

[Benjamin Marks]

Slow speed escapement

Slow speed escapement

another question if I may 🙂
in exposures longer than 1/60 there is some additional noise after the shutter noise closes. It's very noticable in 1second exposure
I guess that's not a bug since the camera was recently CLA'd
does anyone know the explanation?

Assaf: That's normal, there's a slow-speed governor that produces a whirring sound on slower speeds after the shutter has closed. Do not wind on until the whirring has stopped.

Ben

 

[Assaf]

Thanks Ben!
really helpful 😎 !