TTL or non-TTL?

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robbo

Robbo
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Not content with buying a 35 'cron ASPH, I'm thinking about an M6 to replace my M4-P. However, being fairly new to Leicas, I need advice from M6 users about which version to go for, hence the title. Price is not the issue, ease of use and long ownership is. Once I make the move, I want it to be for good. Common sense tells me to get the newest I can. Do you know different?
 
The TTL version is a few years younger but they're all built to last.

There are a few small differences; the exposure meter indicator in the viewfinder (<o> on the TTL, <> on the plain M6), the direction and size of the shutter speed selector (bigger on the TTL). The TTL is also a few mm higher (2mm I think).

The only reason to upgrade as I can see is the built-in light meter in the M6's. How comfortable are you with your current M4 and a handheld meter?
 
Good point EmilGil about the current M4. I was raised on this type of photography, so am used to referring to a hand held meter (which I shall keep). However, There are times when it would be better to be able to check 'in the finder' so to speak, hence my thoughts about changing. I realise the M6 meter is, in essense, a spot meter, but I will still have the Sekonic for more difficult lighting situations.
 
Keep in mind too that the TTL shutter speed dial rotates in the reverse direction of the M4-P or the M6c (Classic). Might not be a big deal for some, deal breaker for others. I have a very early M6c and love it. I do not find any big advantages other than the built in meter, but that's enough for me to make my M6 my main camera.

B2 (;->
 
Well, young as I am, I'm not really used to (gu)estimating the exposure so exchanging my first M4-2 for my present M6TTL was a relief. The only thing I don't like is the colour, I'd much prefer a silver chrome one instead of my black one (just vanity! :rolleyes:)

Even if I have the built-in meter in the M6, I'm probably getting a small handheld meter anyway. I need it mostly for my Hasselblad kit but I'm sure it'll join my Leica as well.

Anyone up for a trade, silver for black? :)
 
Thanks B2. You've summed up my thinking. The inbuilt meter is the major difference that I'm looking for. I suspect I could get used to the TTL shutter dial quite quickly as it would be rather like using my old Nikon F Photomic in that I would make adjustments with the camera raised to my eye instead of at chest/waist level. I'm not sure how important the age isue is between the two versions though.
 
Another minor point or two. The M6TTL meter is one EV more sensitive than the M6, as I recall. (I'm traveling and don't have the book with me to verify). The TTL is the obvious choice if you do a lot of flash work, but you can get good flash images with the M6 by using a flash in auto mode. In the latter case, you need to input more info into the flash (ISO, f stop). Personally, I rarely use a flash with the Leica Ms. Available light is the M's forte. Either used camera may need a CLA, but the chances of the newer TTL needing it are a bit lower just due to the age.
 
Funnily enough, that's what got me thinking of a change in the first place. I wear glasses and was wondering about a .58 'finder. However, when I chatted to my usual dealer, he made me realise that the .72 was ok as I only shoot as wide as 35mm, but would find focussing my 90 more difficult. The final encouragement to change was when I discovered what my M4-P was worth as a trade against an M6. Considering I paid £380 for it a year ago, I was being offered £500 against M6s costing £750 - £950.
 
Yes Mike, my earlier comment about age was, in fact, related to the CLA issue. I cannot foresee me using a leica for flash photography at all. I would use digitalfor that I think.
At the moment, all things being equal, the M6 TTL is coming out as favourite.
 
robbo said:
Funnily enough, that's what got me thinking of a change in the first place. I wear glasses and was wondering about a .58 'finder. However, when I chatted to my usual dealer, he made me realise that the .72 was ok as I only shoot as wide as 35mm, but would find focussing my 90 more difficult. .
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I wear thick glasses (7 diopters or so) and I find the .72 of my M6 perfect for a 35mm lens. It seems to me as if the camera was built for a 35 mm lens - it's very natural to see these framelines and the capture about the entire field of view when I look through the VF. The 28mm framelines are hard to see (to me) and the 50mm are a bit small.

The choice of magnification factor should be according to the lens you use most. You can add VF magnifier for narrow angels (no perosnal experience) or external VF if you still want to use super wide angles.
 
I find the TTL shutter speed dial quite a bit easier to manipulate, particularly with my eye at the finder, and the orientation of the dial is more intuitive to use with the built-in light meter. I like my TTL.

Ryan
 
Thanks everyone. Some sound and useful advice here. I'm tending towards the TTL version, but am open-minded enough to wait and see how each version looks and feels before making a final decision.
The last few months have been quite a revelation to me. After several years of 'digital frenzy', I'm now shooting more film than anything! The D200 is rarely in use despite being a great piece of kit. I think the immediacy of digital can give it a rather ephemeral quality that is ultimately unsatisfying. Or maybe I'm returning to my roots when I used a Werra and a Leningrad with a Weston light meter!
 
I like my M6TTLs so much I have two of them... And-unimaginable heresy here-I use my SF20 flash with them for fill. It's a good system and I recommend it.
 
As long as the camera you buy is freshly CLA'd and ready to shoot, I would suggest your decision should be based on price.

Also keep in mind that with the M6TTL, if your batteries are dead, along with the meter, all flash capabilities are gone too.
 
The rangefinder is the perfect platform for flash photography. No mirror block out, you see a preview of what you get without taking your eye from the finder.

I used my M4-P for flash work for years very happily.

B2 (;->
 
waileong said:
I can't see why anyone wouldn't want TTL, even if the TTL isn't sophisticated.
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Both cameras have built-in light meters, it's just the flash metering that differs. At the same price, I would go for the TTL even if I don't use flash because of the larger shutter speed selector. The classic is usually slightly cheaper so you have to estimate how much the extra features are worth to you.
 
BillBlackwell said:
Also keep in mind that with the M6TTL, if your batteries are dead, along with the meter, all flash capabilities are gone too.
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Meaning its flash capabilities with dead batteries are then exactly the same as the M6 non-TTL, so you don't lose anything.

Also note that if you lug around not only spare film, but also a flash unit, then taking a spare battery for the M6 isn't going to mean any significant extra load. Saying that the M6TTL's flash won't work with a dead battery is like saying your car can't do 500 miles overland if you forget to fill the tank.

Philipp
 
rxmd said:
Meaning its flash capabilities with dead batteries are then exactly the same as the M6 non-TTL, so you don't lose anything.

Also note that if you lug around not only spare film, but also a flash unit, then taking a spare battery for the M6 isn't going to mean any significant extra load. Saying that the M6TTL's flash won't work with a dead battery is like saying your car can't do 500 miles overland if you forget to fill the tank.

Philipp
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No, the flash won't fire at all if you don't have a battery. On the plain M6 there is a mechanic trigger circuit, on the TTL an electronic one.
 
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