WoolenMammoth
Well-known
Since Cowboy Kate has been recently re-published, figured Id bring this up as perhaps a wider audience might have some insight...
Anyone have any idea what film stock the bulk of that book was shot on? Its been driving me nuts lately, more so because the book was originally published in 1964 and there couldnt have been much to chose from... I got to see many of the images in the book on silver prints and its frightening what those prints looked like. The grain structure and contrast is fully what Im after and while its easy enough to do with TMZ its not this look, its too perfect looking.
To be honest, Im not even too overly concerned with what someone did so long ago, whatever film was available then, it sure aint available in the same formula now... Im more curious about what direction to head in to get the smooth yet chunky grain going on, like Haskins was clearly in control of with that series of work. Ive not had too much success getting tri-x to break apart like that. Did they even make tri-x in 1963?
anyhow, wondering if anyone has any thoughts. If you havent ever seen the book, go out of your way to take a peek, there's some moments in there that can redefine some things...
Anyone have any idea what film stock the bulk of that book was shot on? Its been driving me nuts lately, more so because the book was originally published in 1964 and there couldnt have been much to chose from... I got to see many of the images in the book on silver prints and its frightening what those prints looked like. The grain structure and contrast is fully what Im after and while its easy enough to do with TMZ its not this look, its too perfect looking.
To be honest, Im not even too overly concerned with what someone did so long ago, whatever film was available then, it sure aint available in the same formula now... Im more curious about what direction to head in to get the smooth yet chunky grain going on, like Haskins was clearly in control of with that series of work. Ive not had too much success getting tri-x to break apart like that. Did they even make tri-x in 1963?
anyhow, wondering if anyone has any thoughts. If you havent ever seen the book, go out of your way to take a peek, there's some moments in there that can redefine some things...
40oz
...
thanks for pointing this out. I've never seen it, it looks interesting.
R
rich815
Guest
I have a recent issue of some B&W magazine that discusses this book with photos and such. I cannot remember if they mention the film used. I'll dig it up and get back.
sepiareverb
genius and moron
I don't know the book- but your description of the grain 'breaking apart' might point to the Forte films, run in HC-110b. I've had some beautiful grain effects with this combo- the 100 speed especially, strangely enough. I have some of the 400 in the freezer that I've been meaning to play with for just this effect (if we're thinking about the same thing)
This is Forte 100 in HC110b, shot with the Contax G 45mm lens. Don't think my scanning ability is up to what I'm trying to show, but here's something to get an idea.
This is Forte 100 in HC110b, shot with the Contax G 45mm lens. Don't think my scanning ability is up to what I'm trying to show, but here's something to get an idea.
Attachments
WoolenMammoth
Well-known
you'll have to reference the work Im speaking of, in comparison your photo is exceptionally tight grained.. Thats a nice looking film though.
rich, if you dig up that article, let me know what/where it was published, would love to read it!
rich, if you dig up that article, let me know what/where it was published, would love to read it!
atelier7
Well-known
can't answer your question, but i drove all the way to canberra from sydney a few months ago to see a sam haskins exhibition. Also saw the book on sale at borders bookshop in sydney recently.
IGMeanwell
Well-known
This is one of my favorite books I own
I know exactly what you speak of in terms of grain structure....
For those who need a point of reference (probably NSFW)
http://www.haskins.com/CbyKate/Kate_p01.html
though you need to see the pictures full size to get the impact factor
I know he used a Pentax 6x7 for the shoot
I can't seem to find any information for the type of film ... I would say whatever he used, he developed it in a high contrast developer which emphasized the grain.
Article with Sam: http://www.popphoto.com/americanphotofeatures/3198/cowboy-kate-rides-again.html
I know exactly what you speak of in terms of grain structure....
For those who need a point of reference (probably NSFW)
http://www.haskins.com/CbyKate/Kate_p01.html
though you need to see the pictures full size to get the impact factor
I know he used a Pentax 6x7 for the shoot
I can't seem to find any information for the type of film ... I would say whatever he used, he developed it in a high contrast developer which emphasized the grain.
Article with Sam: http://www.popphoto.com/americanphotofeatures/3198/cowboy-kate-rides-again.html
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Jocko
Off With The Pixies
IGMeanwell said:
I think that's the crucial point - the "look" lies in the development. At the time Haskins' produced Cowboy Kate many commercial photographers still tended to affect ignorance as to the craft element, leaving all the dirty work to some nameless darkroom drudge
. In his particular field Haskins was really rather unusual in his appreciation of the pictorial qualities that processing could lend images.Cheers, Ian
Michael I.
Well-known
now I want one !
zuikologist
.........................
Thanks for the reference - great stuff.
Michael I.
Well-known
I ordered one.
WoolenMammoth
Well-known
wow, I didnt think this stuff was 6x7, but looking at it it makes sense...
I thought more people would have known his work. suprising.
I thought more people would have known his work. suprising.
WoolenMammoth
Well-known
wow, I didnt think this stuff was 6x7, but looking at it it makes sense...
I thought more people would have known his work. suprising.
I thought more people would have known his work. suprising.
venchka
Veteran
Sam Haskins. There's a name I haven't heard since forever. I know I've seen the book back in the Land Before Time. I don't own it. I will put it on my Christmas list. Thanks!
EDIT to Add: Tri-X was indeed around in the 1960s. However, as many have pointed out, modern Tri-X is a different animal. Did Mr. Haskins work in Australia? Where he worked might point to film & developer combinations. Using what was available locally. Back then Agfa, Fuji & Ilford weren't readily available in the U.S. Don't know about Oz.
Clue:
I'll also add: I unearthed my negative file over the weekend. The only notes in the whole binder were 3 rolls of Tri-X from my Koni-Omega 100 and 90mm lens. Developed in D-76, 1:1. I have 3 8x10s and my nephews have a 4th from that series. There is no grain. None. Whatever Sam did, he did in the darkroom. My 6x7 Tri-X negatives don't show any grain.
EDIT to Add: Tri-X was indeed around in the 1960s. However, as many have pointed out, modern Tri-X is a different animal. Did Mr. Haskins work in Australia? Where he worked might point to film & developer combinations. Using what was available locally. Back then Agfa, Fuji & Ilford weren't readily available in the U.S. Don't know about Oz.
Clue:
Maybe he was working in London? Ilford-Kodak-Agfa maybe.
I'll also add: I unearthed my negative file over the weekend. The only notes in the whole binder were 3 rolls of Tri-X from my Koni-Omega 100 and 90mm lens. Developed in D-76, 1:1. I have 3 8x10s and my nephews have a 4th from that series. There is no grain. None. Whatever Sam did, he did in the darkroom. My 6x7 Tri-X negatives don't show any grain.
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gns
Well-known
Read on a really good new photo book blog (http://5b4.blogspot.com/)
that Christies auctions recently sold the photographer's original maquette for the book. Price- $90,000.00!
Gary
that Christies auctions recently sold the photographer's original maquette for the book. Price- $90,000.00!
Gary
Camera5
Newbie
Cowboy Kate was not shot on Pentax 6x7 because the book pre-dated the P67 by several years. Sam's medium format work prior to P67 was done on Hasselblad and Rolleiflex. Also Cowboy Kate was not shot in London, this is a common misconception. Sam emigrated with his family to London in April 1968. All four of his seminal works in the 60s; Five Girls, Cowboy Kate and other stories, African Image and November Girl were all shot while his studio was based in a light industrial building in downtown Johannesburg called Bersol House on the corner of Jeppe and Nugget.
As for his famous grainy prints I cannot understand why nobody simply asks him. The man is alive and well, aged 81, working from his new home in Australia. He works on select fashion assignment for major international journals while concentrating on book production. His next title will be a history of his fashion photography due for publication in 2008.
He did use a combination of media and techniques to 'paint with grain' and was possibly the first modern photographer to do so consciously as part of the creative process. Since a lot of this rendering magic was created in long sessions alone in his Johannesburg darkroom* the best thing to do would be to ask the guy.
*Sam continued to print all his own black and white in London (1968 - 2001) but currently prints all his work digitally, again in-house and without assistants. He has until now continued to shoot with his P67 but is considering his first all digital shoot in November 2007 on assignment for Australian Harper's Bazaar.
He can be reached here:
sam@haskins.com
...a good reliable chronology of his career can be found here...
http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Haskins
...and his rich and weekly updated blog can be found here...
http://www.samhaskinsblog.com
Enjoy!
As for his famous grainy prints I cannot understand why nobody simply asks him. The man is alive and well, aged 81, working from his new home in Australia. He works on select fashion assignment for major international journals while concentrating on book production. His next title will be a history of his fashion photography due for publication in 2008.
He did use a combination of media and techniques to 'paint with grain' and was possibly the first modern photographer to do so consciously as part of the creative process. Since a lot of this rendering magic was created in long sessions alone in his Johannesburg darkroom* the best thing to do would be to ask the guy.
*Sam continued to print all his own black and white in London (1968 - 2001) but currently prints all his work digitally, again in-house and without assistants. He has until now continued to shoot with his P67 but is considering his first all digital shoot in November 2007 on assignment for Australian Harper's Bazaar.
He can be reached here:
sam@haskins.com
...a good reliable chronology of his career can be found here...
http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Haskins
...and his rich and weekly updated blog can be found here...
http://www.samhaskinsblog.com
Enjoy!
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