Canon LTM Why RF can't have lens over 135mm

Canon M39 M39 screw mount bodies/lenses
I also have (and use occasionally) Komura 200/4.5 that Brian mentioned. I believe it is the longest out there with direct rangefinder coupling. The lens is telephoto design, so it is about 12cm long. It has good oldschool Japanese build and is single coated. Marginally longer focal length than Olympic Sonnar, but must be a tad easier to focus being 1.5 stops slower.

Still, focusing it on close (if you consider 7m "close") to medium distance with 0.72 finder is a challenge. As I don't have a 200mm finder the framing is also a problem: the RF patch approximates the inner third of image, with borders somewhere out there between it and 135mm frameline.

But for some reason I use it more than 135mm lens. Which is not to say much.
 
> Canon made 200mm through 1000mm lenses for the S-Mount including an
> 800mm Serenar back in 1953 - See Page 9 - only $796

CANON made a 135/2.5 "M" (stands for Mirror Box 2) and a 200/3.5 "M", pictures and history here

If they had thought lenses of these speeds could be rangefinder-focussed they (or LEICA) would have left away this kind of device.
 
framing 200mm

framing 200mm

varjag said:
I also have (and use occasionally) Komura 200/4.5 that Brian mentioned. I believe it is the longest out there with direct rangefinder coupling. The lens is telephoto design, so it is about 12cm long. It has good oldschool Japanese build and is single coated. Marginally longer focal length than Olympic Sonnar, but must be a tad easier to focus being 1.5 stops slower.

Still, focusing it on close (if you consider 7m "close") to medium distance with 0.72 finder is a challenge. As I don't have a 200mm finder the framing is also a problem: the RF patch approximates the inner third of image, with borders somewhere out there between it and 135mm frameline.

But for some reason I use it more than 135mm lens. Which is not to say much.
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Same experience here. Focussing on my M4-2 is not really a problem. Framing is between the 135 and RF frames. On the Canon VT framing is within the circular RF window. So both work fine.
 
varjag said:
I also have (and use occasionally) Komura 200/4.5 that Brian mentioned. I believe it is the longest out there with direct rangefinder coupling. The lens is telephoto design, so it is about 12cm long. It has good oldschool Japanese build and is single coated. Marginally longer focal length than Olympic Sonnar, but must be a tad easier to focus being 1.5 stops slower.

Still, focusing it on close (if you consider 7m "close") to medium distance with 0.72 finder is a challenge. As I don't have a 200mm finder the framing is also a problem: the RF patch approximates the inner third of image, with borders somewhere out there between it and 135mm frameline.

But for some reason I use it more than 135mm lens. Which is not to say much.
Click to expand...
Dear Eugene,

Again, a lens I'd heard of but never seen. The TEWE finder goes from 35mm to 200mm and I'd long wondered if there were any other 200mm lenses. Or was it a 'by-prducr' of the TEWE design being available for ciné too?

The TEWE has both parallax compensation and field-of-view (zoom) compensation, like a Linhof.

Cheers,

R.

Cheers,

R.
 
There's a nice Leica finder (ref SQTOO) for using a 400mm lens without the Visoflex attachment:

0000323.jpg

Picture linked from the Foto-Hobby Auction site

This finder was designed to be used with a Telyt 400mm lens on an extension tube. Of course, there was no rangefinder coupling, so this combo was pretty much limited to infinity shots. But it proves that 135mm, or even 200mm, is not the longest focal length usable on a rangefinder.

Cheers!

Abbazz
 
Roger, I've seen TEWE finder before too, but have no idea for which lens 200mm mark was originally intended. I know that Komura 200mm was normally sold with its own dedicated 200mm finder.

Here is one such lens. I got mine last year on eBay for half the price.



Abbazz, it is true you can slap about any long focus lens in front of RF, but in such scenarios the actual rangefinder becomes useless. The 400mm setup you describe can be as well used on MD or Bessa L. So it becomes increasingly quirky, like using old ultra-wides on SLRs with mirror locked up.

It is interesting that the 400 finder seems to have knob for lateral adjustment at right: probably because even slightly misaligned accessory shoe will throw the framing way off. Just another point to how quirky it is really.
 
The Komura 200mm f4.5 that Eugen's post links to was cleaned up considerably and needed major adjustment though it is substantially an OEM lens in original but used condition. I was pleasantly surprised by the results using color print film on such a rugged (still beautiful) piece of optics!
 
The Komura 200mm f4.5 that Eugen's post links to was cleaned up considerably and needed major adjustment though it is substantially an OEM lens in original but used condition. I was pleasantly surprised by the results using color print film on such a rugged (still beautiful) piece of optics!
 
Note there are two Komura 200mm lenses with LTM mount. The f4.5 version has rangefinder coupling. The f3.5 version is a Uniadapter mount (same thread, different registration). The second can be used on SLRs or the Komura reflex housing or Viso II/III with an adapter.
Canon made the prototype / limited production? of an RF coupled 200mm. (Kitchingman page 188.)
There were production lenses from various manufacturers that were direct mount without rangefinder coupling.
 
As others have indicated, the challenge is focusing accuracy, framing and,of course, handling. While the 180 optics for the Contax are well-known, the Kodak Ektra was the RF camera designed to handle long lenses. There was a 150mm Ektar sold, plus the camera was designed for even longer lenses (a 250mm, if I remember correctly).
It would have be able to handle such an focal length because it 1) had the longest RF base length of any 35mm camera ever built 2) It used a split-image rangefinder (best accuracy-same as used to sight guns on a battleship and 3) it has a zoom finder that magnifies the framing image.
Reflex housings never realized their potential. The best ones (Visoflex IIa, Novoflex, Panflex, type II) work well, but suffer from the need to work with pre-set or manual diaphragm lenses. Still, they often offer a better focusing image than SLRs which frequently suffer from mirror cutoff and screens designed more for faster and shorter lenses. WES
 
Jerry Rigged ... US soldier slang.. WWII

Jerry Rigged ... US soldier slang.. WWII

BillP said:
Maybe so, but I would still take exception with that - there is nothing impermanent or expedient about a Visoflex ;)

Regards,

Bill
Click to expand...

During WWII, the germans were commonly called "Jerry's" by US and other Allied soldiers.

"Jerry Rigged" came to mean badly built items used in the field of battle that were "Jerry Rigged". My dad came home with that one from Europe in 1945. Being a mechanic all his life, he thought of all poorly built german automobiles as "jerry rigged".

quite a common phrase if you did duty against the German Military, warranted or not. Very biased and a negative connotation all around.
 
Here's to the real men, like DDD, who just turned 100, who shoot (or shot) 135s all the time on their rangefinders.


Thinking About It by unoh7, 135/3.4 APO on M9
I shot my 135 APO this afternoon, and my hit rate was no different than with the 50 cron.

Today few do.
 
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