briandaly
Established
My local supplier has stopped stocking Rodinal Special so I need to try a new developer. Having ruined a few rolls trying to achieve the best results with this developer, I want to pick one developer and stick with it a while and learn how to get the most from it.
I will be using mainly HP5+, Neopan 400 and to a lesser extent, Acros 100.
My main priorities are:
1. Reasonably fine grain
2. Medium contrast
3. Longevity - developing one or 2 films a week, I need it to keep fresh even when opened
4. No sudden failure - because I intend to use the developer over an extended period, I need it to deteriorate slowly and with obvious signs (I've heard of XTOL failing very suddenly)
Any advice on a single developer to pick would be appreciated.
Brian
I will be using mainly HP5+, Neopan 400 and to a lesser extent, Acros 100.
My main priorities are:
1. Reasonably fine grain
2. Medium contrast
3. Longevity - developing one or 2 films a week, I need it to keep fresh even when opened
4. No sudden failure - because I intend to use the developer over an extended period, I need it to deteriorate slowly and with obvious signs (I've heard of XTOL failing very suddenly)
Any advice on a single developer to pick would be appreciated.
Brian
hans voralberg
Veteran
Your best bet would be Ilford DD-X, it lasts a very long time, at least mine last for 6 months without any sign of deterioration. Fairly fine grain with HP5, can be very smooth with Neopan.
XTOL wont fail suddenly with care, but then I dont have much experience with it.
XTOL wont fail suddenly with care, but then I dont have much experience with it.
Bruin
Noktonian
Like Hans said, since you're in Ireland, DD-X is a good choice. Clayton F76+ is another good one if you're in the US. I bet someone will also make a plug here for HC-110 and Diafine.
For all my opened bottles of chemistry, I purge the air from the top with "canned air" (for dusting) after use and before recapping them. This is less fiddly than adding marbles to raise the liquid level, and those accordion-like bottles are porous to oxygen.
For all my opened bottles of chemistry, I purge the air from the top with "canned air" (for dusting) after use and before recapping them. This is less fiddly than adding marbles to raise the liquid level, and those accordion-like bottles are porous to oxygen.
mcgrattan
Well-known
For Neopan and Acros I've had great results with Adox ADX A+B. It's a two part developer, you mix part A and part B with water immediately before use. Apparently this prevents the developer failing as the two parts are kept separate until used. Comes in two small bottles that do a LOT of film [50 35mm films from the standard pack].
I find the results are excellent with the Fuji films and extremely consistent. Very smooth tonal range, good contrast control, decent sharpness. I've not used it much with other film. It's not really for high-speed films, though. You get a one-stop speed decrease on Neopan 1600 and Delta 3200.
DD-X is great, but very expensive by comparison.
I find the results are excellent with the Fuji films and extremely consistent. Very smooth tonal range, good contrast control, decent sharpness. I've not used it much with other film. It's not really for high-speed films, though. You get a one-stop speed decrease on Neopan 1600 and Delta 3200.
DD-X is great, but very expensive by comparison.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I highly recommend Xtol for Neopan ... long term storage can be an issue I've heard but I use old wine bladders and any developer seems to keep a long time in those due to the lack of air contamination. Another ok way is to split your developer up into several small bottles and keep unused solution in completely full (no airspace) bottles in a dark cool place.
maddoc
... likes film again.
Another vote for XTOL 
. Works very well for ACROS, HP5, NEOPAN 400PR from my experience. Even ACROS accidentally underexposed 2 stops (thought that I had loaded NEOPAN and exposed ACROS at 400ISO):bang: came out fine in XTOL 1:1 plus Rodinal 1:100...
No problems with storage life but you need to make 5 liter stock solution at once.
. Works very well for ACROS, HP5, NEOPAN 400PR from my experience. Even ACROS accidentally underexposed 2 stops (thought that I had loaded NEOPAN and exposed ACROS at 400ISO):bang: came out fine in XTOL 1:1 plus Rodinal 1:100... No problems with storage life but you need to make 5 liter stock solution at once.
briandaly
Established
No votes for D76?
mr_phillip
Well-known
I beg to differ. I really like XTOL (although not as much with HP5+ as with the Neopans) and it can have a decent shelf-life if mixed using distilled water and stored in good air-free containers (my record is eight months and still going strong, my worst was four). The problem is that when it goes (and it will go at some point) it does so very suddenly and with no visible indication — it's clear when it's good; it's clear when it's dead. So one day you develop a film as usual and it comes out fine, a week later you develop another and you're looking at a metre and a half of blank film. If you decide to go with XTOL I'd suggest that, once the developer passes the three-four month mark, you test it for strength before use – just to be on the safe side.
DD-X gives very similar results to XTOL (maybe a little more contrasty, especially with Acros), but the 1ltr bottles are more convenient if you're not doing so much development. It is quite expensive if used 1+4 though (1+9 is more economical at the expense of a tiny bit more visible grain).
HC-110 is great with HP5+ and really nice with Acros rated at 80asa. I didn't like it as much with Neopan 400, but some experimentation with the speed rating of the film and different dilutions of the developer would likely yield something decent. The real advantage of HC-110 is that it's very economical and it's life-span is measured in years not months.
mr_phillip
Well-known
Ooops, forgot to say that my personal preference would be for dilute Perceptol. Used 1+3 or less it gives exceptionally fine grain with great sharpness. It's also economical, comes in handy 1ltr quantities and keeps well once mixed (lifespan's about the same or slightly better than XTOL, but you'll get through it much faster so it's less of an issue). The downside is that you'll lose between one-third to a full stop of film speed.
sircarl
Well-known
I agree. I use a slightly different process (diluted 1:2, developed at 24 C for 12 minutes), for HP5+ underrated by 1 to 1 1/3 stops in most lighting situations. But the results with Perceptol are outstanding.
ITD
Member
I've always been concerned about using Xtol for the reason that it would be impossible to tell when it was off. How would you go about testing it? Is there a way of doing this that doesn't involve a full 8-10 mins development process?
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I had no luck with D76 and Neopan ... the negs were always 'almost there but not quite' sort of syndrome. I changed times, dilutions, agitation etc but it never clicked for me! It was good with HP5 though.
like2fiddle
Curious
D76 1:1 and HP-5 happens to be the very best film/developer combination I've ever used if you're looking for the best over all combo. for tonal range and fine grain. The thing about D76 is that you won't get the longevity you seem to be looking for. I've never tried D76 with Neopan 400 or Acros.
briandaly
Established
Just been shopping and bought a bottle of DD-X - longevity is important for me.
I was told that in the meduim term, they are looking to one of the Fotospeed developers to replace Rodinal Special.
Thanks for all the input.
Brian
PS This stuff is expensive - 15 Euro for 1 Litre which makes 5 Litres of solution (at 1:4).
I was told that in the meduim term, they are looking to one of the Fotospeed developers to replace Rodinal Special.
Thanks for all the input.
Brian
PS This stuff is expensive - 15 Euro for 1 Litre which makes 5 Litres of solution (at 1:4).
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kaiyen
local man of mystery
All liquid concentrate devs will be expensive, relatively speaking, as you are dealing with paying for all that water, whereas powder is just a lot lighter. Having said that, DDX is known for being abnormally expensive.
I don't think that XTOL fails in the way it used to - I've had friends keep it in five 1 liter bottles for a year total no problem. But, as others have said, there is no color change, so when it's bad...you can't tell. But you can get good life out of it.
I love Perceptol at higher dilutions as well, and also use higher temperatures to combat the very long dev times.
And contrast is about exposure and dev time, remember. Not developer, per se.
I don't think that XTOL fails in the way it used to - I've had friends keep it in five 1 liter bottles for a year total no problem. But, as others have said, there is no color change, so when it's bad...you can't tell. But you can get good life out of it.
I love Perceptol at higher dilutions as well, and also use higher temperatures to combat the very long dev times.
And contrast is about exposure and dev time, remember. Not developer, per se.
jan normandale
Film is the other way
I tend to use developers that work with the speed of the film. 'One size fits all' is a less than optimum choice unless you are just testing the water with these combinations. You have two full stops difference in ISO for these three films.
Currently I use Rodinal for film <200 ISO, HC110 for >200 ISO and DDX for Delta 3200 ISO. If you read a bit here and elsewhere you will see the reasons without going into a dissertation here. Also read the profiles of some of the recommended developers, at their sites. This onsite data in PDF form can be very helpful.
Currently I use Rodinal for film <200 ISO, HC110 for >200 ISO and DDX for Delta 3200 ISO. If you read a bit here and elsewhere you will see the reasons without going into a dissertation here. Also read the profiles of some of the recommended developers, at their sites. This onsite data in PDF form can be very helpful.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Good question and thread.
But I think this question (and the responses) need to be read carefully.
The problem is the subjectivity of "good results". Each of us have our own preference as to what is "good."
So, maybe posting a picture or two of your favorite combination will minimize the subjectivity somewhat.
What do y'all think?
I'm still looking for some spare time to develop my two rolls of HP5 in my Clayton F67+... (sigh!).
But I think this question (and the responses) need to be read carefully.
The problem is the subjectivity of "good results". Each of us have our own preference as to what is "good."
So, maybe posting a picture or two of your favorite combination will minimize the subjectivity somewhat.
What do y'all think?
I'm still looking for some spare time to develop my two rolls of HP5 in my Clayton F67+... (sigh!).
Colman
Established
Who's your supplier? Gunns, or is there someone else in the city with a decent range of stuff?
briandaly
Established
Correct.
They are the only only retailer I've come across with a wide range of film paraphernalia and expert knowledge. Prices on film are good too.
BJ Bignell
Je n'aurai plus peur
I'm also a fan of DD-X; it's a very nice and versatile developer which can give a lot of speed but it's not really long-lasting.
According to the packaging, you'll get up to 24 months for an unopened bottle, but only 3 months in an opened bottle. You might stretch that to 6 months if you use a collapsible bottle. As soon as it starts to turn yellow, you are better to toss it than risk your photos.
According to the packaging, you'll get up to 24 months for an unopened bottle, but only 3 months in an opened bottle. You might stretch that to 6 months if you use a collapsible bottle. As soon as it starts to turn yellow, you are better to toss it than risk your photos.