Ken Rockwell says Electro 35 better than Leica & Nikon RF's

Trius: You nailed that one. My first two 35mm cameras were both fixed-lens Yashicas: a second (third?)-hand 5000E Lynx, and, when I couldn't stand the breakdown rate of that Lynx, a second-hand Electro 35 GTN (black, with case and pair of auxiliary lenses, with flash-shoe mounted eyepiece!). I liked both cameras, when they worked, and they did (and still do) offer mucho bang-for-the-buck, but calling them superior to Leica and Nikon RFs is more than a bit of a stretch. The focal-plane shutters in the Nikons and Leicas might have seemed "primitive" relative to the Yashicas, but those cameras were tested through Hell and back, with pictures to prove it.

It's not about electronics vs. mechanical cameras (I've been shooting with a pair of highly-electronic Hexar RFs for years, under ideal and less-than-ideal conditions, so I know how capable they are), or brand snobbery (the same outfit, later on, brought us the Contax RTS and G series cameras, no?), but simply the fact that the Electro 35, in relatively extreme conditions, isn't everything you might want in a camera, whereas a Nikon S-series or Leica M has what you need, when you need it, almost without question.

I can say good things about almost any camera I've put five or so rolls through. It's after 150 rolls or so that tells the true tale.


- Barrett
 
That camera looks exactly what I need. I hope I can find one some where.

I always shoot AP and rarely use AE. I couldn't think of a better focal lenghts for a RF.

If any of you're selling this, PM me. :)
 
Adjust the ISO dial

Adjust the ISO dial

which is large, where shutter dials usually are.


Anupam Basu said:
"Specifications with Commentary" is code for "I haven't used the camera, only read the specs, but I'll have my say anyway."




Forget that. How do you set exposure on an Electro? Fixed lens RFs that can be put on manual I can still understand. But how people can use an AE only camera with ancient center weighted meter I'll never know. The whole world is middle gray, apparently.
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I guess looking back that was a very good P&S for the time and it is still so. I was quite surprised by the results it gives but taken aback by the huge size and weight. Also the RF could have been better given the vast space available in the camera.

I got one from a colleague that had not used it in 10 yrs or so, light seals were gunk and I replaced them with a JonGoodman kit, battery was old mercury type and thanks to a thread here was replaced by 4x1.5V silver batteries.
Then run a couple of cheapo color film thrugh it and got brilliant pictures. The color rendition of the lens is very good and the focusing was accurate.
Even the exposure was very good in tricky conditions.

But for me it is a novelty, not an everyday camera.

Anupam Basu said:
But how people can use an AE only camera with ancient center weighted meter I'll never know. The whole world is middle gray, apparently.
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that "ancient center weighted neter" which is not even TTL is BRILLIANT and easily outperforms (statistically speaking) a new fancy multi-segment honeycomb bla bla meter.

Trust me, it does.

I used plenty of slide film in GSN's and as long as you keep your finger off the meter window, it nails the exposure.
If you really want to twist it, indeed just set the film speed to something else.
 
I would rather do without a meter than give up full control or fool around with the ISO. Plus the RF was crap when I had the camera. They are nice P&S cameras - granted. But this better than an M or a Nikon rhetoric that goes around every now and then is way over the top.
 
A couple of weeks ago I placed a bid on a nice black Yashica 35, but got outbid by a considerable amount. Nice cameras, but better than a Nikon RF? Come on, get real. If owning a Nikon RF is for geriatric collectors, he's just plain wrong. If someone thinks I am a geriatric Nikon RF user at the tender age of 43, fumbling around with archaic things like film, filters and external viewfinders, I really don't care. :D

I didn't read the whole article, so Ken will excuse me for not sending him 5 dollars.
 
There are a lot of good writers on photography on the web. But what puzzles me, is that those people never get a 'thank you for your wisdom' post on sites like dpreview. Ken gets those all the time. Just makes you wonder...

I'd rather eat my M2 than taking anything he says seriously, but I guess he has the last laugh. He presumably makes some money about all this and if he has a narcisistic streak he will love all the attention, good or bad.
 
One of the best reviews I have read on one of my favorite cameras. Ken's photos of the Electro are pretty good! I had to sell my Electro for 2 reasons. I didn't like not knowing what exposure the camera had decided on, and the lens was a actually a little too sharp. If you took a head shot sometimes the edges were so defined it looked like you had cut and pasted the face onto the background. But for the price it is definitely a winner, and if you are willing to put a little gaussian blur on your portraits so they don't show every tiny pimple it is a fine camera.

To answer you question on how do you change the lens Trius, the short answer is you don't. It lives on the camera full time.
 

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jan normandale said:
this is not really news.. our man Nick Trop already put this forward in our very own RFF Forums
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Eh - Rockwell's late to the party. But it's nice he sees the value of this camera. He's spot on when he says that it gives you what you need, and only what you need, so other stuff doesn't get in the way.

If you treat this like a "linear programming" (if you're familiar with operations management) equation or model -visualize it as a graph on plotted paper, the Electro GSN finds the "optimal" point where it:

1. Maximizes speed of operation
2. Maximizes image quality
3. Maximizes creative control (aperture vs shutter priority)
4. Minimizes cost

Hence, "anecdotally" (obviously, I didn't plug these constraints into LINDO PC) the Yashica Electro is the best camera ever made because it maximizes the important aspects of a camera (above) within a cost constraint unmatched by other cameras. Period.

Even with "price is no object" cameras it holds its own. Many would prefer it. I would prefer it. It has the "correct" level of automation.

Nice to see Rockwell recognizes this but he's late to the party, as I said.

Now can I have my $5.00 (to buy another Electro)??
 
PS I'm giving my GSN away incidentally to a aspiring young (like 16 or so) photography student who's anxious to get it. I can always get another and I have the CC for an Electro fix (along with many other cameras... all of the "cheap" (but fun/good) variety :)

Maybe my next Electro, I'll spring for the black GTN. I know, I know... but they do look cool.
 
By the way - this is the Wiki entry on Linear Programming to those who might be unfamiliar...

In mathematics, linear programming (LP) problems involve the optimization of a linear objective function, subject to linear equality and inequality constraints.

Put very informally, LP problems determine the way to achieve the best outcome (such as maximum profit or lowest cost) given some list of requirements represented as linear equations.

More formally, given a polytope (for example, a polygon or a polyhedron), and a real-valued affine function

f(x_1, x_2, \dots, x_n)=a_1x_1+a_2x_2+\cdots +a_nx_n+b\,

defined on this polytope, the goal is to find a point in the polytope where this function has the smallest (or largest) value. Such points may not exist, but if they do, searching through the polytope vertices is guaranteed to find at least one of them.

Linear programs are problems that can be expressed in canonical form:

Maximize \mathbf{c}^T \mathbf{x}
Subject to A\mathbf{x} \leq \mathbf{b}

\mathbf{x} represents the vector of variables (to be determined), while \mathbf{c} and \mathbf{b} are vectors of (known) coefficients and \mathbf{A} is a (known) matrix of coefficients. The expression to be maximized or minimized is called the objective function (\mathbf{c}^T \mathbf{x} in this case). The equations A\mathbf{x} \leq \mathbf{b} are the constraints which specify a convex polyhedron over which the objective function is to be optimized.

Linear programming can be applied to various fields of study. Most extensively it is used in business and economic situations, but can also be utilized for some engineering problems. Some industries that use linear programming models include transportation, energy, telecommunications, and manufacturing. It has proved useful in modeling diverse types of problems in planning, routing, scheduling, assignment, and design...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_programming
___________________________________________

Optimize (or minimize) X (cost, profit, whatever)
Subject to the following constraints:
X < $300
A > 15, < 5
R = 1

Whatever...


The reason why I think the Electro is the best camera is that it's as if the Yashica engineers used Linear Programming back in the 60's to come up with a camera that optimizes all of the positive features of a RF camera, maximizes speed of operation and image quality, subject to an aggressive cost constraints.
 
I have next week off from work and I plan to log a lot of time roaming my city with a GSN and some TriX. Then hitting the darkroom. Man, I can' t wait!!!
 
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