DownRange
Newbie
Hi everyone. I am new to this site and forum. Rangefinder cameras fascinate me. I am not going to go back to film, but I was wondering if the M8 with Leica glass will deliver image quality that is:
A. better
B. equal, or very close one way or the other
C. inferior
* I intend to use the camera strictly for street photography, and the Nikon is great, but too much of a target for theft in the busy streets (read very dangerous) in the foreign countries that I shoot in (almost exclusively), and obviously more cumbersome.
A
A. better
B. equal, or very close one way or the other
C. inferior
* I intend to use the camera strictly for street photography, and the Nikon is great, but too much of a target for theft in the busy streets (read very dangerous) in the foreign countries that I shoot in (almost exclusively), and obviously more cumbersome.
A
Shadowplay
Established
What do you do with the final product? Print it?
The image quality isn't going to be much different between the two at normal ISOs for all intents and purposes, but it will be at probably 640+ (with the Leica losing the edge). In my opinion there really is no contest if you factor size/usability into the equation. The M8 wins out hands down. I have a 1DsIII, 5D, and fast canon primes and I don't even use them, opting for the MP or M8.
The image quality isn't going to be much different between the two at normal ISOs for all intents and purposes, but it will be at probably 640+ (with the Leica losing the edge). In my opinion there really is no contest if you factor size/usability into the equation. The M8 wins out hands down. I have a 1DsIII, 5D, and fast canon primes and I don't even use them, opting for the MP or M8.
kdemas
Enjoy Life.
Welcome aboard! I actually own both and they are my primary cameras.
I use the M8 for my street photography, beautiful IQ especially for B&W. Generally not noticed as easily I find it gives me a little more in the stealth department.
The D300 is fantastic and the high ISO (over 1250) is really something. I use mine primarily for sports.
Anyway, both are fantastic cameras but for me the ability to use wide open Leica lenses on an M8 works great for the street.
Enjoy!
Kent
I use the M8 for my street photography, beautiful IQ especially for B&W. Generally not noticed as easily I find it gives me a little more in the stealth department.
The D300 is fantastic and the high ISO (over 1250) is really something. I use mine primarily for sports.
Anyway, both are fantastic cameras but for me the ability to use wide open Leica lenses on an M8 works great for the street.
Enjoy!
Kent
DownRange
Newbie
Shadowplay and kdemas:
Thanks for the quick responses. I do intend to print the photographs. I concur that the 1600 ISO on the D300 is amazing. I frequently use it with my 70-200 VR and the low noise is amazing--looking forward to the Leica though for sheer portability.
Thanks for the quick responses. I do intend to print the photographs. I concur that the 1600 ISO on the D300 is amazing. I frequently use it with my 70-200 VR and the low noise is amazing--looking forward to the Leica though for sheer portability.
Avotius
Some guy
Its hard to give a good response without knowing more details about how the cameras will be used and what would be expected of their end result. For overall image quality though I think you will find a M8's file to be "sharper looking" but that there is actually more information that can be used from a D300 file and with the proper sharpening techniques can almost look as sharp as a M8 file. The D300 is without a doubt better at high ISO and overall is a fantastic camera. The M8 is significantly smaller but could also be thought as significantly more limited as a system but for someone like me I would not find that such a problem. Just the other day I was in the shop fondling a D700 again, geeez modern competent DSLR's are big.
I would not bother to think about taking a camera into a "dangerous country" because it doesnt mater what you got on you, if someone is going to take it they are going to take it. Its foolish to think a thief would do a brand check before taking your camera.
I would not bother to think about taking a camera into a "dangerous country" because it doesnt mater what you got on you, if someone is going to take it they are going to take it. Its foolish to think a thief would do a brand check before taking your camera.
kuzano
Veteran
So, let me get this straight....
So, let me get this straight....
One of your primary reasons is that a thief would much rather glom onto a larger NIKON over a Leica that will fit easily under a jacket or in a coat pocket. Clearly you do not know many thieves.
1) Theft is best directed at a concealable item if done in public
2) Theft is most rewarding if the item has significant value
3) Theft is based on a return calculated on a percentage of the "fence-able" value. Hence the Nikon (dime a dozen) DSLR loses on that score.
The Leica, if revealed where it can be gotten to, will be gone long before the Nikon.
As a non-owner of either of the cameras, I cannot tell you which one is better for street photography, although I am inclined to say neither.
However, as a person who fantasizes about Thievery a great deal, I can tell you which one I would grab first.
So, let me get this straight....
One of your primary reasons is that a thief would much rather glom onto a larger NIKON over a Leica that will fit easily under a jacket or in a coat pocket. Clearly you do not know many thieves.
1) Theft is best directed at a concealable item if done in public
2) Theft is most rewarding if the item has significant value
3) Theft is based on a return calculated on a percentage of the "fence-able" value. Hence the Nikon (dime a dozen) DSLR loses on that score.
The Leica, if revealed where it can be gotten to, will be gone long before the Nikon.
As a non-owner of either of the cameras, I cannot tell you which one is better for street photography, although I am inclined to say neither.
However, as a person who fantasizes about Thievery a great deal, I can tell you which one I would grab first.
Last edited:
kuzano
Veteran
Whereas, you sir, think that????
Whereas, you sir, think that????
You state that criminals and thieves do not do brand checks, and would just as soon lift a Holga as a Leica any day.
You also need to start hanging out with some professional "snatch and grabbers".
Whereas, you sir, think that????
You state that criminals and thieves do not do brand checks, and would just as soon lift a Holga as a Leica any day.
You also need to start hanging out with some professional "snatch and grabbers".
NIKON KIU
Did you say Nippon Kogaku
WHERE ARE THOSE DIME A DOZEN NIKONS???
KIU
KIU
Nh3
Well-known
Edit: I think this guy is just looking to create a flaming war so I deleted my original post.
Last edited:
Avotius
Some guy
You state that criminals and thieves do not do brand checks, and would just as soon lift a Holga as a Leica any day.
You also need to start hanging out with some professional "snatch and grabbers".
heh shows what you know about this part of the world.
DownRange
Newbie
Wow. I never thought the conversations on this forum would get so heated......Ok, I confess I am not a professional thief, and do not consort with thieves, but i still maintain that it is safer to do street photography in Sao Paulo, and Bogota with a pocket sized camera. I travel professionally 250 days a year, and know how to handle myself and my gear, but in these ciities it is not only the gear they want.....they dont like to leave witnesses either.
If nothing else, it only becomes visible to the public when you shoot......a big advantage of keeping it hidden from the thief in the first place.
I already have a D300 and have a plethora of great Nikkor lenses (primes, and VR zooms).
I do not take the photographs for vacation, so image quality is at the top of my list and my primes are much sharper and consistent than my zooms (not to mention a hell of a lot lighter).
If the M8 indeed has so many issues, then I guess I will do more homework before buying one. I swore off film cameras but I might make an exception for an earlier M model that does not have issues. Who wants to weigh in on that one?
If nothing else, it only becomes visible to the public when you shoot......a big advantage of keeping it hidden from the thief in the first place.
I already have a D300 and have a plethora of great Nikkor lenses (primes, and VR zooms).
I do not take the photographs for vacation, so image quality is at the top of my list and my primes are much sharper and consistent than my zooms (not to mention a hell of a lot lighter).
If the M8 indeed has so many issues, then I guess I will do more homework before buying one. I swore off film cameras but I might make an exception for an earlier M model that does not have issues. Who wants to weigh in on that one?
DownRange
Newbie
Someone mentioned in a post that it had some technical issues that needed to be worked out (firmware, etc.) but since then may have deleted the post, so I really dont know. That is why I creaated the thread. Thanks to all for the comments.
kuzano
Veteran
Whoops....
Whoops....
I should have clarified that I was talking resale value and not MSRP.
Whoops....
I should have clarified that I was talking resale value and not MSRP.
kuzano
Veteran
OK... you caught me on that one...
OK... you caught me on that one...
You are right about me not knowing about your part of the world.
No Crime?
OK... you caught me on that one...
You are right about me not knowing about your part of the world.
No Crime?
Pablito
coco frío
Roma
Well-known
Iraq or not, a $5000 camera has to be at least reliable. I'm not even talking about features.
The M8 I tried somehow slowed me down compared with my film Ms and I was constantly worried about the meter. It's a lot louder than the film Ms too. I really think it needs a serious revision.
The M8 I tried somehow slowed me down compared with my film Ms and I was constantly worried about the meter. It's a lot louder than the film Ms too. I really think it needs a serious revision.
yanidel
Well-known
Taking a M8 or any visible valuable in Sao Paulo is pure non-sense. Not for the gear, but for your life.
Same applies to most big metropolitean areas of South America.
Unless you restrict yourself to the ghettos/high security areas of town, which are few, and not a good depiction of normal life in these countries.
I lived in Monterrey, Mexico which was not as bad as Mexico City, yet there were simple rules to respect. But keep in mind you are playing with more than your gear while visiting some of these cities. Be it a M8, a D700; Ixus II or a $20 rolex imitation.
As for comments on the easiness to conceal a theft by thieve being a factor, I don't take it. More important is their ability to run fast... happened to me in my car in Paris when a guy used a base-ball bat to blow up my passenger window (I was in the car). He snatched my jacket with wallet and when I realized what was happening, he was running the 100meter dash of his life. Nobody stopped him.
Same applies to most big metropolitean areas of South America.
Unless you restrict yourself to the ghettos/high security areas of town, which are few, and not a good depiction of normal life in these countries.
I lived in Monterrey, Mexico which was not as bad as Mexico City, yet there were simple rules to respect. But keep in mind you are playing with more than your gear while visiting some of these cities. Be it a M8, a D700; Ixus II or a $20 rolex imitation.
As for comments on the easiness to conceal a theft by thieve being a factor, I don't take it. More important is their ability to run fast... happened to me in my car in Paris when a guy used a base-ball bat to blow up my passenger window (I was in the car). He snatched my jacket with wallet and when I realized what was happening, he was running the 100meter dash of his life. Nobody stopped him.
Last edited:
chippy
foo was here
sheeze!! amazing...
then it got me to thinking..so what is the French summer sport anyway, not cricket and i dont hear about the french mad on their baseball.....crocket? prob not or you would hear more about people getting beat up with those malets...hmm i digress