Jenni C
Newbie
This is my first post here so Hello Comrades!
I like to do things on the cheap, which sometimes means I do things the hard way. I'm trying to figure out if there's a way to take macro shots by holding a diopter in front of the lens of my Fed 2. I use mainly toy and vintage cameras and have used this technique with my Lubitel and Holga cameras with lots of success. One question I have is if I hold the diopter in front of the rangefinder window and try to focus, will it translate when I hold the diopter in front of the lens? I might give this a try anyways as I have a few frames left to burn through my Commie Camera Day roll. Thanks for your help!
I like to do things on the cheap, which sometimes means I do things the hard way. I'm trying to figure out if there's a way to take macro shots by holding a diopter in front of the lens of my Fed 2. I use mainly toy and vintage cameras and have used this technique with my Lubitel and Holga cameras with lots of success. One question I have is if I hold the diopter in front of the rangefinder window and try to focus, will it translate when I hold the diopter in front of the lens? I might give this a try anyways as I have a few frames left to burn through my Commie Camera Day roll. Thanks for your help!
le vrai rdu
Well-known
how will you compensate parallax ? if you don't move the camera your eye won't see the same thing as your lens
If you move the camera, considering the very small DOF, you won't have any chance
The best solution is a SLR for macro, RF are not designed to make macrophoto (okay, there is visoflex etc, but, well, a slr is much simpler )
If you move the camera, considering the very small DOF, you won't have any chance
The best solution is a SLR for macro, RF are not designed to make macrophoto (okay, there is visoflex etc, but, well, a slr is much simpler )
paul beard
Member
With macro, you would be so close to the subject anyway, the viewfinder may be superfluous. I'd say try it and see what results you get. I have a set of diopters here that might be pressed into service if you have any luck.
wolves3012
Veteran
Holding a lens in front of the RF will achieve nothing. The RF/VF system does not translate to the taking lens at all, so no to your question. Guesswork is the only way you'll do it! With something as strong as +10, focus will be super-critical and parallax will make the VF useless, so composition will be a pure guess too. The only way to do this accurately is to take the camera back off, put a ground-glass screen on the film rails and focus and compose with that, then load film (without moving anything) to take the shot - hardly a practical method, especially as the FED 2 has a tripod mount fitted to the camera-back!
Sorry to pour cold water on the idea but it's well known that RFs are particularly poor tools for macrophotography. The easy way is to use the better tool - an SLR. Heck, why not try it if you're determined though, you may get lucky. If you want to stay cheap and russian, there are plenty of Zenits out there...
I forgot to add: welcome to the forum!
Sorry to pour cold water on the idea but it's well known that RFs are particularly poor tools for macrophotography. The easy way is to use the better tool - an SLR. Heck, why not try it if you're determined though, you may get lucky. If you want to stay cheap and russian, there are plenty of Zenits out there...
I forgot to add: welcome to the forum!
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Blake Werts
Established
Hi Jenni C, welcome to the Rangefinder forum.
Since I've also learned that rangefinders are not very good tools for macro work, I've simply used my old SLR to do that type of shooting. However, coming over from the ToyCamera forum as you have, I can suggest something that I've done with one of my Holgas and a diopter set.
1. take your FED2 and remove the back cover off of it as of you were loading up some film.
2. tape a piece of wax paper across the film plane where the film passes behind the shutters--basically you are making a "wax paper film" that can be used to view images on.
3. with your 10x diopter on the camera lens, set both the camera and a burning candle on a table in a relatively dark room. Place the candle approximately 12-15 inches from the camera lens.
4. looking at the wax paper that you've taped to the back of the FED2, you should be able to see the image of the burning candle on the wax paper itself.
5. move the candle to and fro, doing your best to get the sharpest image as you possibly can.
6. once you are satisfied that you've gotten the clearest, sharpest image possible, leave the camera and candle still, turn on some lights, and make a measurement of the distance from the film plane (where your wax paper is) to the candle flame. This distance will be your ideal distance between the camera and your subject with that lens/camera/diopter setup.
7. cut a piece of cardboard to length that you've just discovered and use for quick measuring purposes.
This has worked very well for me and my Holga.
Also, while you are playing with the candle and wax paper, getting the clear image and all--now is the time to get used to the viewfinder parallax issues. Position the candle flame to be in the center of your "wax paper film," then look through the viewfinder while keeping the camera still. What you see in the viewfinder will be what you will be looking for when you are trying to compose an image for macro. It "ain't pretty" but it will work.
Hope this helps,
Blake
Since I've also learned that rangefinders are not very good tools for macro work, I've simply used my old SLR to do that type of shooting. However, coming over from the ToyCamera forum as you have, I can suggest something that I've done with one of my Holgas and a diopter set.
1. take your FED2 and remove the back cover off of it as of you were loading up some film.
2. tape a piece of wax paper across the film plane where the film passes behind the shutters--basically you are making a "wax paper film" that can be used to view images on.
3. with your 10x diopter on the camera lens, set both the camera and a burning candle on a table in a relatively dark room. Place the candle approximately 12-15 inches from the camera lens.
4. looking at the wax paper that you've taped to the back of the FED2, you should be able to see the image of the burning candle on the wax paper itself.
5. move the candle to and fro, doing your best to get the sharpest image as you possibly can.
6. once you are satisfied that you've gotten the clearest, sharpest image possible, leave the camera and candle still, turn on some lights, and make a measurement of the distance from the film plane (where your wax paper is) to the candle flame. This distance will be your ideal distance between the camera and your subject with that lens/camera/diopter setup.
7. cut a piece of cardboard to length that you've just discovered and use for quick measuring purposes.
This has worked very well for me and my Holga.
Also, while you are playing with the candle and wax paper, getting the clear image and all--now is the time to get used to the viewfinder parallax issues. Position the candle flame to be in the center of your "wax paper film," then look through the viewfinder while keeping the camera still. What you see in the viewfinder will be what you will be looking for when you are trying to compose an image for macro. It "ain't pretty" but it will work.
Hope this helps,
Blake
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
Welcome, Jenni!
Starting with what Blake suggests is a good idea, I think.
I would add to it and suggest making a frame of some kind to indicate the field of view of your set up.
After you have figured the optimal distance but still have the back of the camera off and the wax paper or ground glass on the camera, put a large piece of paper, parallel to the film plane, at that optimal distance and mark the paper at the corners of the FOV--based on what you can see on the wax paper. You could then make a frame of some kind--coat hanger wire is probably good for this--that size and attach it to your camera the correct distance from the film plane. Then in use, you would be able to set the frame around your subject to get the field of view and get the distance right at the same time.
I know I have seen pictures/drawings of what I'm trying to relate to you. I'll see if I can find a link or two to ilustrate this better.
Rob
Starting with what Blake suggests is a good idea, I think.
I would add to it and suggest making a frame of some kind to indicate the field of view of your set up.
After you have figured the optimal distance but still have the back of the camera off and the wax paper or ground glass on the camera, put a large piece of paper, parallel to the film plane, at that optimal distance and mark the paper at the corners of the FOV--based on what you can see on the wax paper. You could then make a frame of some kind--coat hanger wire is probably good for this--that size and attach it to your camera the correct distance from the film plane. Then in use, you would be able to set the frame around your subject to get the field of view and get the distance right at the same time.
I know I have seen pictures/drawings of what I'm trying to relate to you. I'll see if I can find a link or two to ilustrate this better.
Rob
Jenni C
Newbie
Wow! Such informative and quick responses! Thanks for all the great advice. I totally want to get a Zenit and it sounds like that may be the best vehicle for macro. I may try the diopter trick, but it sounds like it could be an exercise in frustration. I'll post my results if they're any good.
fidget
Lemon magnet
This post reminded me of when I played with rangefinder M39 lenses on my L39 lens mount Zenit 3c. (really cheap but neat SLR). Whilst the M39 lenses were unusable at normal distances, they made great macro lenses on the SLR body.
Dave...
Dave...
mh2000
Well-known
if you make a wire frame that screws into your tripod mount to give you the distance and framing of your focus you can use it very well. it's not as versatile as an SLR, but will get good results and is easy to use.
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
I haven't found a photo/illustration of what I was trying to describe but here is a link to a page that may be useful:
http://www.alanwood.net/photography/close-up-lenses.html
There are several tables of information about various diopters and how that affects working distance and subject size. With a +10 diopter, the working distance is stated as 100mm for a 50mm lens focused at infinity. And a subject area of 72 X 48 mm. So, if you make a frame that size and distance from the front of the lens(that's how I read "working distance"), you have a starting point anyway. Not very big image area but could be interesting!
Rob
http://www.alanwood.net/photography/close-up-lenses.html
There are several tables of information about various diopters and how that affects working distance and subject size. With a +10 diopter, the working distance is stated as 100mm for a 50mm lens focused at infinity. And a subject area of 72 X 48 mm. So, if you make a frame that size and distance from the front of the lens(that's how I read "working distance"), you have a starting point anyway. Not very big image area but could be interesting!
Rob
Sylvaticus
Established
This is how it was done in the 1950s.
The diopter lens would be the right size to fit your regular filter holder for your camera. Or you would have one in its own filter holder. They often cam in sets, filters and close-up lenses.
To focus you would consult the tables that came with the lenses, or were included in photo handbooks. This would give distance from lens front to subject, usually with lens set at infinity. Distance measured with tape measure.
Camera on tripod - to maintain the set distance and to allow longer exposures.
To counter paralax, experiment, measure the offset you're getting and work out where to aim. Or square up the whole system so you know where the lens was pointing.
It was the only way, for any camera in those days. Before 1950, there was only the Exakta SLR in 35mm, a few others in rollfilm. Leica had a mirror accessory to put behind the lens. There were people still using bellows cameras for macro work, taking on plates or film backs, and focusing on the ground glass.
The diopter lens would be the right size to fit your regular filter holder for your camera. Or you would have one in its own filter holder. They often cam in sets, filters and close-up lenses.
To focus you would consult the tables that came with the lenses, or were included in photo handbooks. This would give distance from lens front to subject, usually with lens set at infinity. Distance measured with tape measure.
Camera on tripod - to maintain the set distance and to allow longer exposures.
To counter paralax, experiment, measure the offset you're getting and work out where to aim. Or square up the whole system so you know where the lens was pointing.
It was the only way, for any camera in those days. Before 1950, there was only the Exakta SLR in 35mm, a few others in rollfilm. Leica had a mirror accessory to put behind the lens. There were people still using bellows cameras for macro work, taking on plates or film backs, and focusing on the ground glass.