How does this sound for starting B&W development?

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SebC

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Hi All,

I'm thinking about starting doing my own black & white development (35mm only) at home (with no darkroom, so no printing - hopefully I'll get a scanner soon). I've been doing a lot of reading, but I'm sure you'll agree there is a lot of information to digest. I was hoping people could shed some light on my proposed setup and point out better/cheaper/easier options! This is mainly as a way to shoot more an pay less - it costs me £7 to have a roll of B&W developed. I figured if I can get a setup cheaply enough then I can save that in about 10 rolls...

I'm considering getting this kit - it looks to be pretty good value to me:

http://www.firstcall-photographic.c...ocessing-equipment/0/ap/ap-darkroom-film-kit/

As I have no darkroom I assume I'll need a changing bag to load the tank, perhaps this?:

http://www.firstcall-photographic.c...ent/0/firstcall/firstcall-changing-bag-small/

Then for chemicals I figured a Rodinal-type setup:

http://www.firstcall-photographic.c...-r09-film-developer-previously-rodinal-500ml/

For film, I found a pretty good deal on rebranded APX100 (Rollei branded) - which I understand works well with Rodinal (what with them both being Agfa formulations, essentially)?

As a side question - whenever I read about Rodinal development there is no mention of stop bath or fixer - just develop, rinse and hang to dry. Is that right, or am I missing something (like is it so obvious that you still do other steps that nobody feels the need to mention them)?

Is there anything I've forgotten?

Many thanks in advance for any help!

Seb
 
Looks good to me, but you might want a patterson developent tank. I use a kodak stop bath but alot of people just use water and I would recommend a fixer. Agefix, etc. Also look at the freestyle photo website in the usa.
 
You'll need stop bath and fixer for sure. You can use water as a stop bath but you'll definitely need fixer for any B&W film.
 
You don't need a changing bag if you have a light-tight bathroom or closet. To 'test' it, though, hang out in there in the dark for five minutes with your eyes closed. When you open them, you may be surprised to find that it's not quite as dark as you originally thought. In my bathroom, usually have to wait until night....

Rodinal may be nice, but only if you want that 'look.' Also consider D-76/ID-11. I'm using ID-11 with Rollei Retro 100 / APX 100 and love it.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/ckdexterhaven/3464077643/sizes/o/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ckdexterhaven/3464077369/sizes/o/
 
Wow those examples are great!

I honestly don't know what look I'm after - I don't have enough experience with black and white to have formed much of an opinion. My experience with real b&w film is limited to FP4+, developed by the Ilford lab (which I really liked - not the most exciting/striking ever - but a good blend of sharpness and grain, with incredibly fine detail even visible in one of their 7x5 prints)

But honestly, seeing as I'm new to my M2 and new to developing - something that's foolproof to develop and has a relatively wide exposure latitude is probably the best bet.
 
Skip the kit - there's a lot of stuff in it you don't need, and some stuff you do need missing. You will need:

A bathroom sink with hot and cold running water
A thermometer
Some developer - HC110, Rodinal, ID-11, there are a lot of choices.
Some fixer - rapid or slow - how patient are you?
Optional chemicals: stop bath, hypo clearing agent, wetting agent
A developing tank. Patterson is the most common, some like steel tanks.
Reels to fit the tank you choose. Get 2 and a tank that will hold both.
A graduated cylinder to measure chemicals.
A 'church-key' bottle opener to get the film out of the cassette.
Some liter sized bottles: fixer, stop, wetting agent, hypoclear.
A bottle or measuring cup for developer.
A clip to hang the film in your shower.
A dark place or bag to get the film from the cassette to the developing tank.
About an hour.

Determine the length of time to develop for from this website.

Mix all your chemicals per the instructions.
Warm or (most likely) cool the bottles to the desired temperature.
Put the bottles by the sink.
Put the film on the reels in the dark, put the reels in the tank and close the tank.
Now take the tank to the sink and pour water in the tank and agitate it for one minute.
Pour the water out and pour the developer in.
Agitate the developer for one minute and then 5 sec. every 30 seconds after that.
Rap the tank against the sink each time you agitate so bubbles don't stick to the film.
15 seconds before the end of the developing time, pour the developer down the drain.
Fill the tank with water, and pour it out. Do that again.
(Optionally, use stop bath instead for 30 seconds.)
Put the fixer in the tank, and agitate it just like the developer.
(Most rapid fixer takes 4-5 minutes, regular fixer takes 7-8 minutes.)
Pour the fixer back into the bottle.
(you can re-use fixer until it no longer works. Then recycle it in the manner prescribed by your municipality.)
Rinse the film again with water - you can open the tank to light now.
Fill the tank with hypo clearing agent. (an optional step)
Wash the film with water (5 min. if you used clearing agent, or 20 min. otherwise)
Rinse the film with wetting agent made up in distilled water.
Shake the reels to remove the wetting agent, and despool the film on the hanger.
Wait until it's dry.

And believe it or not, it's easier to do than to type!
 
Thanks guys, that's really helpful.

Glad to hear that Rollei Retro 100 is good - I can get it for under half the price of anything else!

i'll have to start hunting for the best places to source my own kit. Does anybody have any recomendations for UK suppliers?
 
SebC for the stop bath you can use a 2% vinegar acid solution (but not the fancy kitchen stuff). You can (probably) buy a 10% solution in a supermarket - at least i don't have any problems getting it in poland and germany. Works fine for me, and it's cheap.
 
I like the combination of ASA 125 (Ilford FP4+ or Kodak Plus-X) film with Rodinal at 1+50 dilution. Time anywhere between 12-14 minutes, very minimal agitation, say every 4 minutes.

Here's an example from this method:
3942358494_0ccbc5a20e_o.jpg


Sorry, this is from a 6x4.5 negative, not 35mm, but I hope you get the idea.
 
sebc, go with the virgins[chris101] instructions to start, straight foward and easy to follow, all the info you need is in his first[virgin] reply, regards
 
shadowfox said:
I like the combination of ASA 125 (Ilford FP4+ or Kodak Plus-X) film with Rodinal at 1+50 dilution. Time anywhere between 12-14 minutes, very minimal agitation, say every 4 minutes.

Here's an example from this method:
3942358494_0ccbc5a20e_o.jpg


Sorry, this is from a 6x4.5 negative, not 35mm, but I hope you get the idea.
Click to expand...

Nice results from the Rodinal and ASA 125 film combo. I have a few questions, if you don't mind;

1. Are you wet printing the negs, or using a scanner and digitally printing?

2. Are you exposing at Box Speed?

3. What temperature do you process your film at?

4. Could you describe your agitation methods? I am thinking of trying out Rodinal with the two films you mentioned, and I am looking for a good starting point.

Thank you,

Mike Sullivan
 
Zathros said:
Nice results from the Rodinal and ASA 125 film combo. I have a few questions, if you don't mind;

1. Are you wet printing the negs, or using a scanner and digitally printing?

2. Are you exposing at Box Speed?

3. What temperature do you process your film at?

4. Could you describe your agitation methods? I am thinking of trying out Rodinal with the two films you mentioned, and I am looking for a good starting point.

Thank you,

Mike Sullivan
Click to expand...

Not at all,

1. The posted picture is a scan from the negative. I however, will wet-print it at some point (as most of my final outputs tend to be). If I think that the picture will look good when printed with alt. process, I'll make a digital negative from it using little Epson printer.

2. Yes

3. I pay little heed to temperature, really. Whatever water temperature that comes out of my tap. I do live in Texas, and the water temperature doesn't fluctuate as severely as let's say in the Midwest.

4. As I mention above, I find that less agitation for Rodinal resulted in a suppressed grain and good tonal range especially with slower film. The photo above was developed at 1+50 dilution in 14 minutes. I only agitate twice (three gentle inversions) at the 7 minute mark and about the 12 minute mark. I gave it a couple of inversion right before pouring the developer out.

Let me know how this works out for you if you do try it out.
 
IdeaDog said:
Sorry to say it, but:
The whole process has made me appreciate the simplicity of digital because the workflow after the moment the shutter is pressed is such a breeze compared to film. Scanning and cropping and rotating and naming files just takes too much time seated at the cursed computer. I love my MP and my Zeiss Ikon, and I love the magic of discovering what emerges on the developed film. However, the M8 with Nik Software's Color Efex Pro and Silver Efex pro gives me photos that I have mistaken for film shots. I was quite startled recently to see in the EXIF info that some of my older pictures were M8 shots, not Tri-X. (I don't view, print, or scan anything billboard sized.)

I have a fair stock of chemicals, but I recently used up almost everything that was diluted/mixed/ready and I may not mix any more. I DO love the smell of fixer. Maybe I should keep a tiny bottle of it just for a nostalgic sniff once in a while.
Click to expand...

No need to be sorry about this, in fact, if you shoot digital as carefully as you would when you shoot film, you'll end up with more keepers and less work (best of both worlds :) )

Now, I do like the "hassle" of development, it's relaxing for me. And I especially like printing (wet and alt. process). I do not enjoy printing with inkjet.

Although... I hate fixer smell ... :rolleyes:
 
Hi Seb,

As someone who also recently started doing some B&W, I can tell you that Chris101 (above) is right on. Just don't be shocked when you dump out the water from the very first step -- it'll look like blue ink! That's normal (dissolved anti-halation layer) but I hadn't seen it mentioned anywhere and got really nervous...

Have fun.
 
IdeaDog said:
I often enjoy the "hassle" of development too, Shadowfox. And inkjet printing is a drag.

If I tried wet printing, I think I might get hooked.
Click to expand...

There is a good chance that you will :)

Frankly, one of the bonus thrill for me is to find nice equipments for cheap, people are throwing perfectly good printing stuff away these days.

Then those days when you emerge from the darkroom with a couple of nice prints...
 
shadowfox said:
There is a good chance that you will :)

Frankly, one of the bonus thrill for me is to find nice equipments for cheap, people are throwing perfectly good printing stuff away these days.
Click to expand...

That they are. My local shop (Harpers Photo, Woking) had an enlarger behind the counter last time I went in with a note stuck on it saying "free to a good home". If I had the space...
 
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