Thom Hogan On M10

parsec1 said:
Couldn't agree more Steve. Canon, Nikon. perhaps even Pentax (although I have never used them ) as I have Nikon and Canon professionaly ,most certainly have .
Leica though I'm not so sure.

As for being 'awake' when you have had to face a couple of 'stoned out of their brains' 13 year olds pointing AK 47s at you sleep apart from the 'eternal one' is far from your mind.
Regards
Peter
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the scariest moment of my life Peter. I have been very "awake" since.
 
jaapv said:
There is a little known prelude to this story - at the invasion of the Netherlands the Dutch Air Force Fokkers shot down just enough Messerschmidts to enable the British Spitfires to hang on by their nails....
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In all wars there are 'heroes and villians and if this is the case then you certainly have yours although in fact it didn't prevent the RAF still being outnumbered 6 to 1

And the RAF flew 1200 missions dropping food to the starving Dutch people when the Germans 'Left' .After my father had completed his 60 missions in Lancasters (Crashed once in the sea and once at RAF Scampton) over occupied Europe he was amongt the first who volunteered to do so.
Another 'Littlle known story'

But this is not a post of the 'mine are better than yours' type Its about the very people who started it all for both of us and it still does not address the issue of Leica being 10 years behind the Japanese in their technology and expecting people to ignore that and pay huge sums just to
hang a picture taking instrument with a little red dot around their necks.

Regards
Peter.

PS Jan Vermeer is my personal most admired artist and I have visited the Netherlands many times just to stand before his masterpieces and wonder at them and I don't spend much time in the 'Coffee Shops' either !
Perhaps I should.
 
I think most here should not comment on the M10 until you actually used an M9! I don't see or hear any complaining about their M9s....The fact is that M9 is expensive so deal with it. make life changes or do a part time job for 1 year to pay it off. I think the M9 is good enough. Is M8.2 a disgrace? no its not... honestly if we can deal with the hassle of film why can't we deal with the cyan drifts and all that.. Maybe it time for RF user to realise things are not cheap especially leica and we cant do much to change it except manage our finances.
Keep a coin box Now named : for M10....
Anyway my M7 has made me a better photographer. Hopefully M9 will too.
Alright back to work.
 
I think most here should not comment on the M10 until you actually used an M9! I don't see or hear any complaining about their M9s....The fact is that M9 is expensive so deal with it. make life changes or do a part time job for 1 year to pay it off. I think the M9 is good enough. Is M8.2 a disgrace? no its not... honestly if we can deal with the hassle of film why can't we deal with the cyan drifts and all that.. Maybe it time for RF user to realise things are not cheap especially leica and we cant do much to change it except manage our finances.
Keep a coin box Now named : for M10....
Anyway my M7 has made me a better photographer. Hopefully M9 will too.
Alright back to work.
 
parsec1 said:
In all wars there are 'heroes and villians and if this is the case then you certainly have yours although in fact it didn't prevent the RAF still being outnumbered 6 to 1

And the RAF flew 1200 missions dropping food to the starving Dutch people when the Germans 'Left' .After my father had completed his 60 missions in Lancasters (Crashed once in the sea and once at RAF Scampton) over occupied Europe he was amongt the first who volunteered to do so.
Another 'Littlle known story'

But this is not a post of the 'mine are better than yours' type Its about the very people who started it all for both of us and it still does not address the issue of Leica being 10 years behind the Japanese in their technology and expecting people to ignore that and pay huge sums just to
hang a picture taking instrument with a little red dot around their necks.

Regards
Peter.

PS Jan Vermeer is my personal most admired artist and I have visited the Netherlands many times just to stand before his masterpieces and wonder at them and I don't spend much time in the 'Coffee Shops' either !
Perhaps I should.
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I can assure you the food droppings are not a little known story, even to the extent that the food came from Sweden. Maybe your father knew my wife's father who flew in Lancasters as well.

As for ten years behind Japan, I guess in smile recognition yes, but I don't see any Japanese DRFs, nor any image quality advantages. The smoother high ISO of the CMos sensors, used mainly because they are cheaper, is offset by the higher image quality of CCD at low ISO imo.
 
Good grief, are we talking about today's Leicas or about WW II which has been history for some 60 years? War psychoses have nothing to do with photography.

Is anything German still synonymous with Nazis for you? Where have you been in the last 50 years, Parsec?
 
Arjay said:
Good grief, are we talking about today's Leicas or about WW II which has been history for some 60 years? War psychoses have nothing to do with photography.

Is anything German still synonymous with Nazis for you? Where have you been in the last 50 years, Parsec?
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Cambodia, Laos.Israel,Somalia South Africa Mostly in the Childrens wing of Pollsmoor Prison , Jo Berg prison, Laos prisons 'Death Row' ,Malawi, and more recently,Pakistan, Kashmir and the Swat valley,and I know what an AK 47 or RPG sounds like from close up

Two of my very closest relatives are Royal Marines currenly 'in theatre' for their third tour !

Open your eyes and see history repeat itself In Europe at this very moment as facism is allowed to raise its evil again.
Off to Africa tomorrow to give some hood a bit more target pratice and Columbia in another month..
Be interesting or perhaps not to know your contibution to 'world peace'.
 
Arjay said:
Good grief, are we talking about today's Leicas or about WW II which has been history for some 60 years? War psychoses have nothing to do with photography.

Is anything German still synonymous with Nazis for you? Where have you been in the last 50 years, Parsec?
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OH yes ver sorry forgot Northern Ireland..to many time to mention
 
jaapv said:
I can assure you the food droppings are not a little known story, even to the extent that the food came from Sweden. Maybe your father knew my wife's father who flew in Lancasters as well.

As for ten years behind Japan, I guess in smile recognition yes, but I don't see any Japanese DRFs, nor any image quality advantages. The smoother high ISO of the CMos sensors, used mainly because they are cheaper, is offset by the higher image quality of CCD at low ISO imo.
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" No Japanese DRFs to be seen yet" ?
'RDS' pretty visable and they did not have to have IR/UV filters screwed into their lenses. Anyway there will be a couple soon and at half the price of a 'Red Dot'.
As perviously mentioned in someone else's post a DRF with a D700 sensor would be there the holy grail. And that won't be long
 
parsec1 said:
Cambodia, Laos.Israel,Somalia South Africa Mostly in the Childrens wing of Pollsmoor Prison , Jo Berg prison, Laos prisons 'Death Row' ,Malawi, and more recently,Pakistan, Kashmir and the Swat valley,and I know what an AK 47 or RPG sounds like from close up

Two of my very closest relatives are Royal Marines currenly 'in theatre' for their third tour !

Open your eyes and see history repeat itself In Europe at this very moment as facism is allowed to raise its evil again.
Off to Africa tomorrow to give some hood a bit more target pratice and Columbia in another month..
Be interesting or perhaps not to know your contibution to 'world peace'.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, we won't be able to solve the world's problems here on RFF. And anyway, this thread is about photography, not politics.

Let's not feed the troll.
 
Arjay said:
I'm sorry, we won't be able to solve the world's problems here on RFF. And anyway, this thread is about photography, not politics.

Let's not feed the troll.
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Fine ..no problem with that at all.

Interesting though to note that presumably your are a German National Dont have ANY problem with that, yet use Japanese rangefinders ?

Purely from a photographic perspective would you enlighten me as to why ?
 
My purchasing decisions have long been driven by price/performance ratio and technical capabilities, and not by national considerations. I feel this is more than an insignificant contribution to world peace.I'm not aware that any camera company today is entangled in any of the conflict areas you mentioned.

If Leica were to not only make capable, but also affordable cameras, I'd buy one. Otherwise I'd have no qualms to buy from a company of whatever nationality as long as it is a suitable tool and the company operates without a political agenda.

As for my contribution to world peace - I try to educate my son as a European, not as a German. Theoretically, he has the same nationality as you.
 
1) Japanese companies aren't just better at "smile recognition", that is an ugly misrepresentation of the situation. Canon, Nikon and Sony are all great companies that make wonderfull sensors 2-3-4 years ahead of Leica sensors. If you don't need the utmost in high iso capacity and don't need wide angle performance without color shift etc, this is not important, but trying to downplay the electronic/technical supremacy of these companies in relation to Leica is just.. seriously?

2) I think that we will se an explosion of mirror-less EVF-oriented cameras the nest 2-3 years. I'll be the first in line when I can get a fullframe, short FFD camera.
 
ulrikft said:
1) Japanese companies aren't just better at "smile recognition", that is an ugly misrepresentation of the situation. Canon, Nikon and Sony are all great companies that make wonderfull sensors 2-3-4 years ahead of Leica sensors. If you don't need the utmost in high iso capacity and don't need wide angle performance without color shift etc, this is not important, but trying to downplay the electronic/technical supremacy of these companies in relation to Leica is just.. seriously?

2) I think that we will se an explosion of mirror-less EVF-oriented cameras the nest 2-3 years. I'll be the first in line when I can get a fullframe, short FFD camera.
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Except, of course, for rangefinder cameras...

Cheers,

R.
 
O.K. can someone articulate, just how the M9 is ten years behind? If you could do it in point form that would be great.

As for all this war talk, it sounds like a place for a Leica to capture the tragedy of the human condition. Whether with film or digital, if it is the photographers preferred instrument.
 
ulrikft said:
Except of course for the RD...?

And you can perfectly well look at sensor development, sensor quality, electronics quality, display quality etc, regardless of slr or rf.
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Sorry: I was taking full-frame for granted. I don't think many would want to go back to the M8 crop factor, let alone RD.

And you can't look at sensor development without considering flange-to-sensor distance and market size.

Cheers,

R.
 
Keith said:
Anyone who's not happy with what the M9 offers needs a DSLR and should stop thinking about what the M10, M11 or any subsequent model should or could offer.
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It has come down to that huh? wow.

When M9 came out I predicted that a lot of DSLR owners would adopt it and in the process discovered ways to use an old concept such as rangefinder focusing along with its advantages.

But, I didn't expect for them to go the other way and suggested changes that clearly indicates that they just "don't get it" 🙂
 
parsec1 said:
Not difficult to know better than Leica Roger ?

The M8 and M8.2 were a bloody disgrace and (apologies to all those who were conned into buying them by an obsession with the little red dot).

The company is arrogant beyond belief and produce what they 'think' we the consumer must buy at prices bearing no resemblance to their worth as picture taking instruments.

I had a hybrid Kodak/Nikon digi in 1996------IR/UV filters for different times of the day or year, frame banding and incomprehenceable colour shifts .......what a joke !

As one very well known multi award winning (Now walking with a slight limp after being shot in Kosovo) PJ once said to me and many others(until they gave him a couple of M9s ( and admitedly about their film cameras )
"LOVE THE CAMERAS HATE THE COMPANY " and with good reason IMHO.

Had my first Leica an M2 and a 35 summi at 14 years old(Worked in a camera store during college breaks and they let me buy it on the 'drip') bless them, before going to Cambridge ( Astrophysics ) and then Princeton for same.

Have an original MP2 as well as much other Leica stuff incuding 2 M9s. If the camera division of the company goes 'down' they have nobody else to blame but themselves.

Looking at buying an appartment built into the cliff overlooking the harbour in Tangiers, recently. After Leica 'folds' and the way they are following their nations well proven traits that won't be long .

Selling the MP2 might provide some of the required funds and prevent the Mrs from beheading me.

Best Regards
Peter.
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Dear Peter
I am casting my mind back to the September 2009 post "professionals are ditching thier DSLR's for M9's" and if I recall correctly, you were one who attested to that.
We had a number of very genial exchanges and after a while you said you would keep you D3's but were switching to M9's for much of your work.
Is this still the case, and how do you find your 2 M9's? Have you ditched you D3's?

best wishes

Richard
 
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