sOid
Member
Hi guys and gals.
I'm getting a tax refund somewhere in the next couple of months, and I decided to buy a digital compact with it. I currently own a 5D mk2 and a Vivitar 35ES (and some other cameras but I barely use those).
I really love them, but the 5D2 is way too much of a hassle to carry everywhere I go. And the Vivitar uses film. It's just too expensive and cumbersome for daily use.
So I narrowed it down to pretty much 3 or 4 cameras: the Canon G11, S90, Ricoh GX200 and the Panasonic Lumix LX3.
I've read some reviews already, but it's really hard for me to decide, since some aspects aren't mentioned in the reviews.
I will mainly use the camera for street photography. Both during the day and night, but mainly during daytime.
This is my wishlist:
- Little shutterlag
- Good IQ
- Fast operations
- Silent
- RAW
- Somewhat good ISO
- Good AF or easy and accurate manual focus
- Good build quality; I don't want it to malfunction with a couple of raindrops
- Optical viewfinder is a plus
- Intuitive manual control (although I will mostly be using it in Av I guess)
- Wide-angle
- Fast lens
That's pretty much it I guess.
I'm currently leaning towards the G11 for it's optical viewfinder, IQ, ISO and AF. However, the IQ and handling of the LX3 are slightly better (if I am to believe the reviews) as well as the extra 4mm on wide-angle end.
The GX200 looks great. Feature wise. The ISO results are very poor in my opinion, and the AF is slow. At least, that's what I read. However, it does have 24mm and the option to switch between 24, 35 and 50mm.
What do you think? Remember; I will mainly be using this for street photography.
Thanks for reading!
I'm getting a tax refund somewhere in the next couple of months, and I decided to buy a digital compact with it. I currently own a 5D mk2 and a Vivitar 35ES (and some other cameras but I barely use those).
I really love them, but the 5D2 is way too much of a hassle to carry everywhere I go. And the Vivitar uses film. It's just too expensive and cumbersome for daily use.
So I narrowed it down to pretty much 3 or 4 cameras: the Canon G11, S90, Ricoh GX200 and the Panasonic Lumix LX3.
I've read some reviews already, but it's really hard for me to decide, since some aspects aren't mentioned in the reviews.
I will mainly use the camera for street photography. Both during the day and night, but mainly during daytime.
This is my wishlist:
- Little shutterlag
- Good IQ
- Fast operations
- Silent
- RAW
- Somewhat good ISO
- Good AF or easy and accurate manual focus
- Good build quality; I don't want it to malfunction with a couple of raindrops
- Optical viewfinder is a plus
- Intuitive manual control (although I will mostly be using it in Av I guess)
- Wide-angle
- Fast lens
That's pretty much it I guess.
I'm currently leaning towards the G11 for it's optical viewfinder, IQ, ISO and AF. However, the IQ and handling of the LX3 are slightly better (if I am to believe the reviews) as well as the extra 4mm on wide-angle end.
The GX200 looks great. Feature wise. The ISO results are very poor in my opinion, and the AF is slow. At least, that's what I read. However, it does have 24mm and the option to switch between 24, 35 and 50mm.
What do you think? Remember; I will mainly be using this for street photography.
Thanks for reading!
kuvvy
Well-known
Welcome first of all, you're sure to enjoy it here. I have both the G11 and the LX3 and much prefer the LX3 for street shooting. I tend to use the G11 as an alternative to a DSLR. My Lumix has had all the firmware upgrades and offers plenty of shooting choices, my fave being the Dynamic B&W option. Being smaller than the G11, in my opinion, makes it easier (at least for me) to use on the street. Fitting neatly in the palm of your hand it's quite possible to do some discreet hip shooting and you gotta love the 24mm lens for shooting in tight corners.
That said my LX3 is going up for sale shortly as I recently got a GRD III and that seems to give me similar colours to my main shooter, the RD1 but it's hard to let the Lumix go.
That said my LX3 is going up for sale shortly as I recently got a GRD III and that seems to give me similar colours to my main shooter, the RD1 but it's hard to let the Lumix go.
Meatboy
Member
If you use 28mm a lot I'd add the GRD II or III to that list. The GRD II is quite cheap now and they are both very pocketable, moreso than any of the others. The autolens cap and fast startup is great. I have the LX3 and GRD III and I often find the GRD just works more seamlessly, you dont think about it, when grabbing a image. The fixed lens also makes you forget about zooming and I look for images that suit 28mm, kind of making the images fit the camera rather than the other way.
Oh and the 28mm f1.9 on the GRD III gets me indoor images other cameras dream about!
Oh and the 28mm f1.9 on the GRD III gets me indoor images other cameras dream about!
sOid
Member
Thanks for the replies!
Regarding the LX3: I wouldn't use the shooting styles. I like to shoot raw and do any b&w conversion myself. Also, I'm not very convinced about the build quality of the LX3. It looks a lot more fragile than the G11 and GX200. Also, the optional viewfinder is so ridiculously expensive I'm sure I won't buy it.
Regarding the GRD III: looks like a great camera. But it's a bit above my budget. Also, I will mostly stick on 24/28 and 35mm (and maybe 50), but a digital camera with only one, non-exchangeable prime, is too limiting for me.
Thanks for the welcome too by the way
My previous post was the first one, but I've already gathered some valuable information over here
Any other suggestions or comments?
By the way, another plus for the G11: I can use my 580ex2 flash when using that camera. It looks ridiculous and is probably a pain in the ass to use (since it's out of balance), but it coul be useful.
Regarding the LX3: I wouldn't use the shooting styles. I like to shoot raw and do any b&w conversion myself. Also, I'm not very convinced about the build quality of the LX3. It looks a lot more fragile than the G11 and GX200. Also, the optional viewfinder is so ridiculously expensive I'm sure I won't buy it.
Regarding the GRD III: looks like a great camera. But it's a bit above my budget. Also, I will mostly stick on 24/28 and 35mm (and maybe 50), but a digital camera with only one, non-exchangeable prime, is too limiting for me.
Thanks for the welcome too by the way
My previous post was the first one, but I've already gathered some valuable information over here Any other suggestions or comments?
By the way, another plus for the G11: I can use my 580ex2 flash when using that camera. It looks ridiculous and is probably a pain in the ass to use (since it's out of balance), but it coul be useful.
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Warren T.
Well-known
I can't speak for the Ricoh or Panny, but I recently tested the S90 and G11 for a few days because I was considering them as my next compact digital camera purchase. Both of them offer superb image quality (for a small sensor digicam), RAW, and full controllability.
- intuitive manual control, S90 is not very intuitive, G11 is better because it has a couple more dedicated dials (ISO and Exp Comp, very important). S90 is mostly menu-based navigation
- both G11 and S90 very solidly built, but not weatherproofed, The S90's one glaring negative is a very loose control wheel in the back, that can be easily jostled thus causing settings to be accidentally changed.
Have you looked through the G11's viewfinder? The fact that it shows only around 77% of the actual image makes it useless for composition, only good for emergency usage when it's not practical to use the LCD. Personally, I would not count the inclusion of an optical viewfinder on the G11 a "plus".
After the tests, I decided that the S90 was too small and the ergonomics uncomfortable for me. OTOH, the G11 was borderline too big for its capabilities. It's a solid, brick of a camera, and it feels good. I think that I can be happier with the G11 more than the S90, if I didn't need a shirt pocket camera.
I hope this helps a bit. In the end, I decided not to buy either camera.
--Warren
- intuitive manual control, S90 is not very intuitive, G11 is better because it has a couple more dedicated dials (ISO and Exp Comp, very important). S90 is mostly menu-based navigation
- both G11 and S90 very solidly built, but not weatherproofed, The S90's one glaring negative is a very loose control wheel in the back, that can be easily jostled thus causing settings to be accidentally changed.
Have you looked through the G11's viewfinder? The fact that it shows only around 77% of the actual image makes it useless for composition, only good for emergency usage when it's not practical to use the LCD. Personally, I would not count the inclusion of an optical viewfinder on the G11 a "plus".
After the tests, I decided that the S90 was too small and the ergonomics uncomfortable for me. OTOH, the G11 was borderline too big for its capabilities. It's a solid, brick of a camera, and it feels good. I think that I can be happier with the G11 more than the S90, if I didn't need a shirt pocket camera.
I hope this helps a bit.
In the end, I decided not to buy either camera.--Warren
BearCatCow
Established
Interesting comment! What lens do you use with your RD-1? I'm curious what lens you think the GRD-3 renders similarly to.
cnphoto
Well-known
I have just received the LX3, build quality is on par with the G series cameras IMO. Thought it is naturally smaller, and lighter. I have owned a G5, my bother in law has the G7 and most of my photographer friends also have G9's, G10's and G11's... I still went for the Lx3. F2.0 and wide angle was the winner for me, and smaller size.
The LX3 will be my everyday carry around camera, coupled with the XA it makes for a very small 2 camera set. I plan to use the Lx3 with some studio lighting and a ring flash occasionally for portraits (not headshots) and for light tests etc when setting up lighting for the 4x5.
If i had not planned to use it for the portraits and lighting stuff I would have gone for a Ricoh GRD (II or III).
The LX3 will be my everyday carry around camera, coupled with the XA it makes for a very small 2 camera set. I plan to use the Lx3 with some studio lighting and a ring flash occasionally for portraits (not headshots) and for light tests etc when setting up lighting for the 4x5.
If i had not planned to use it for the portraits and lighting stuff I would have gone for a Ricoh GRD (II or III).
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alecgold
Established
I had the G7, it has shutter lag alright, is silent, has raw when you tweak the software, but I upgraded to a M8 because of the louse focussing and the build quality. I know, there is something like a 10 fold price difference, but mine wasn't very good at keeping together. I even started losing the screws that keep the thin metal sheets on the body.
I don't know how the quality on the G11 is, but despite all my grudges I've made some nice pictures with my G7.
One big advantage: you can do everything manual on the G7, but it's not really fast or easy doing it manual. It's almost a dSLR in some aspects, in others it's miles away from it.
I don't know how the quality on the G11 is, but despite all my grudges I've made some nice pictures with my G7.
One big advantage: you can do everything manual on the G7, but it's not really fast or easy doing it manual. It's almost a dSLR in some aspects, in others it's miles away from it.
sOid
Member
I'm sorry for my late response. Couldn't find the time to read your comments thoroughly
Anyway, thanks for the comments. However, I still don't know what to choose. I guess I should just try them out myself in a good camera store.
I knew the viewfinder didn't have nearly as much coverage as my 5D2, but 77% isn't really useful. To say the least
Other opinions and experiences are still very welcome!
Anyway, thanks for the comments. However, I still don't know what to choose. I guess I should just try them out myself in a good camera store.
I knew the viewfinder didn't have nearly as much coverage as my 5D2, but 77% isn't really useful. To say the least
Other opinions and experiences are still very welcome!
acheyj
Well-known
Dont find the G11 vf to big a problem, when I shoot in a fast or rushed way its good enough, I tend to shoot with both eyes open with an OVF. In more formal composed shots the LCD is great (like a view camera on a tripod).
The G11 WILL fit in my shirt pockets, just maybe a bit heavy. Great camera given the tiny sensor.
ron
The G11 WILL fit in my shirt pockets, just maybe a bit heavy. Great camera given the tiny sensor.
ron
crist
Crist
Sigma dp1 or Dp2 amazing foveon sensor
GBR66
Member
Very happy with the S90 which I've had for a couple of months - I tried the DLux4, G11 and it side by side when looking for a real carry anywhere camera to use when I didn't want to carry my DSLR or rangefinders. It fits in a trouser or coat pocket, image quality has impressed so far, controls are easy and fairly intuitive (but I agree with an earlier poster that the rear dial is easily altered by mistake). I tend to use it in RAW on Av. I think it meets most of your requirements and where it doesn't, the EVF, it is certainly better than cameras of a couple of years ago.
sOid
Member
Cheers guys. I think I'll go for the LX3. Seems like a solid camera
edit: Hmm, I think I'm gonna wait for a few more months. I don't really need it right now, and Panasonic will announce a successor in the next couple of months.
Not saying I'm gonna buy that, but I do want to know what they come up with. I can always buy an LX3 with discount when the LX4 is too expensive
edit: Hmm, I think I'm gonna wait for a few more months. I don't really need it right now, and Panasonic will announce a successor in the next couple of months.
Not saying I'm gonna buy that, but I do want to know what they come up with. I can always buy an LX3 with discount when the LX4 is too expensive
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Frank Petronio
Well-known
I've had the LX2 and the GRD2 before giving up on small sensors. Both are very nice but the Ricoh is brilliant as a shooter's camera -- the best interface of any digital camera to date.
But those sensors are sooo tiny... sell the 5D and get a Pany G-1! or a used Nikon D40. Or something with a real sensor!
But those sensors are sooo tiny... sell the 5D and get a Pany G-1! or a used Nikon D40. Or something with a real sensor!
sOid
Member
Sell my 5D2? Are you insane?
No way. I need a compact camera to carry daily, not one to replace my dslr.
kuvvy
Well-known
Interesting comment! What lens do you use with your RD-1? I'm curious what lens you think the GRD-3 renders similarly to.
Sorry for late reply. My main lens on the RD1 is the CV Ultron f2. Though I haven't done a real test on this and the GRD, I did find I preferred the GRD colours over the Lumix.
meeker
Established
Another vote for the s90. It really very pocketable - more so than the ricohs and lumix. I've had it for 3 months and think it is really very good. There's a 5 minute fix for loose wheel if you're willing to pop it off and insert a small piece of padding. A few taken with the s90:
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sOid
Member
Lovely shots. Thanks for sharing
Ranchu
Veteran
Never been a fan of LX3's colors, weird magenta haze. The G11 finder is barely even a finder, I use a voigtlander in the hot shoe with my G10, had to tape it in or it slides right out. I buy digital cameras now by who makes the best raw software, and imo that is canon's dpp bar none, neutral picture style. The S90 has automatic distortion correction through dpp which eats some resolution, there's a lot of barrel distortion otherwise.
sOid
Member
I absolutely hate DPP. I use Lightroom or ACR. Preferably with custom made camera-style-thingies (forgot the exact name, camera calibration I think it was).