Leica LTM Removing Lower Speed Knob

Leica M39 screw mount bodies/lenses
wjlapier

wjlapier

Well-known
Local time
4:58 AM
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
1,903
View My Gallery
Might sound crazy, but I'm considering removing the lower speed dial just so I can use my 11 o'clock Elmar. I can't even use it on my M3--it hits the lens release button guard. So, anyway, I have a I converted to IIIa. Youxin Ye did a CLA and curtain replacement, but had trouble getting the lower speeds to work. I can't remember exactly what he said, but basically he said don't use the lower speeds. I've seen some Barnacks with what looks like a cover where the lower speed knob is. Can the knob be removed and some sort of plug put in it's place?

What ya think? It's not a collectable piece. I use it when I have time and want to try something different. DAG seems way to busy to bother him with this. Sherry maybe, or back to Youxin?

TIA--Bill
 
wjlapier said:
Might sound crazy, but I'm considering removing the lower speed dial just so I can use my 11 o'clock Elmar. I can't even use it on my M3--it hits the lens release button guard. So, anyway, I have a I converted to IIIa. Youxin Ye did a CLA and curtain replacement, but had trouble getting the lower speeds to work.
Click to expand...

Two things can cause this: (1) The pawl is bent or worn and (2) The return spring on the slow speed escapement is off the tab or broken.

wjlapier said:
I've seen some Barnacks with what looks like a cover where the lower speed knob is. Can the knob be removed and some sort of plug put in it's place?
Click to expand...

The later IIIc's through IIIg's have this which won't fit your camera.. You can however remove the dial and have someone make a cover plate.

wjlapier said:
What ya think? It's not a collectable piece. I use it when I have time and want to try something different. DAG seems way to busy to bother him with this. Sherry maybe, or back to Youxin?

TIA--Bill
Click to expand...

I'd try to get the slow speeds fixed instead of removing the dial..
 
batterytypehah! said:
I think the problem is that the slow speed knob is interfering with the focus lever, Colyn.
Click to expand...

I understand but I'd rather keep the slow speed dial and maybe trade the lens for the correct period lens or buy another one if it were mine..

I'm not even sure if the 11 o'clock Elmar has the standardized register. If not it may not properly focus either way.. Most of these version lens were non-standard and had to be modified to work with cameras with the standardized mount/register..
 
Thanx--I said it might sound crazy. Probably is. I think I'll send it to Sherry to see if she can fix the slow speeds. It's a nice little camera--Youxin did a great job smoothing things out. The RFer windows were hazy and now after he cleaned them they are very clear.

On a side note, he didn't want to charge me because he couldn't figure out why the slow speeds could not be fixed. He changed the shutter curtains, cla, and cleaned the RF/VFer windows and still insisted on no payment. I figured his time and the curtains were worth something so I sent him payment.

Anyway, probably right about seeking a new lens to replace the 11 o'clock Elmar. Sucks I can't even use it on my M3 or M6. I can use it on my GF1 though 🙂
 
For what it is worth I have a 'I' converted to IIIa whose slow speeds vary depending on what angle the camera is held at...but then I don't use them so no matter.

Unusual that the focus lever of any Elmar actually hits the slow speed dial, implies big non standard lever. Mine clear OK on 11 o'clock Elmars whether with infinty lock or not.

Michael
 
Dralowid said:
For what it is worth I have a 'I' converted to IIIa whose slow speeds vary depending on what angle the camera is held at...but then I don't use them so no matter.

Unusual that the focus lever of any Elmar actually hits the slow speed dial, implies big non standard lever. Mine clear OK on 11 o'clock Elmars whether with infinty lock or not.

Michael
Click to expand...


It's a problem on all of my Leica III's - two black cameras from '33, one chrome from '34. My " 11 o'clock Elmar" is from 1932 (s/n 99xxx).

Apparently this problem does not occur on the larger -c and -f bodies.
 
colyn said:
I'm not even sure if the 11 o'clock Elmar has the standardized register. If not it may not properly focus either way.. Most of these version lens were non-standard and had to be modified to work with cameras with the standardized mount/register..
Click to expand...


Not sure about this... my 11 o'clock Elmar is from 1932 ( s/n 999xx ) and came with my 1932 Leica II ( s/n 778xx ).

The camera body has all nickel hardware, including the lens mount flange, which has the " 0 " at 12 o'clock, and the collimating plug at the center of the back.

There are no marks on the lens assembly.

From what I have read, I think all interchangeable lenses were standard, it was the pre- " 0 " lens mounts on the body that had to shimmed for collimation ?

Weren't pre-standard lenses marked with the serial # of the body that was collimated for them ?
 
Youxin Ye is a really nice guy. Definitely a gentleman, and his prices are great. Having said that, I send my stuff to Focal Point or DAG now because on 2 occasions I've had to send his work to them to get the cameras right. You pay for what you get w/ this, and if your camera had a curtain replacement there is absolutely no reason why it shouldn't be working properly.
 
Luddite Frank said:
Not sure about this... my 11 o'clock Elmar is from 1932 ( s/n 999xx ) and came with my 1932 Leica II ( s/n 778xx ).

The camera body has all nickel hardware, including the lens mount flange, which has the " 0 " at 12 o'clock, and the collimating plug at the center of the back.
Click to expand...

The "O" indicates that this camera has the standardized mount. Earlier one without the "O" were non-standard.

Luddite Frank said:
From what I have read, I think all interchangeable lenses were standard, it was the pre- " 0 " lens mounts on the body that had to shimmed for collimation ?

Weren't pre-standard lenses marked with the serial # of the body that was collimated for them ?
Click to expand...

The first models with interchangeable lens were non-standard. Any lens regardless of focal length had to be matched to that body.
 
wjlapier said:
Anyway, probably right about seeking a new lens to replace the 11 o'clock Elmar. Sucks I can't even use it on my M3 or M6. I can use it on my GF1 though 🙂
Click to expand...

You could pick up a Zorki or FED for it and shim the lens mount as needed for standard back focus. Heck, you could even rotate the mount so the lever lands where you want it.
 
batterytypehah! said:
You could pick up a Zorki or FED for it and shim the lens mount as needed for standard back focus. Heck, you could even rotate the mount so the lever lands where you want it.
Click to expand...
Sorry, you can't rotate the mount on a FED or Zorki, there's a flat machined into the back at the top...physically it would screw up the register if you did it.

EDIT: That's possibly incorrect for a Zorki 6, can't see for sure.
 
Last edited:
I'm gonna get the slow speeds fixed and use a different Elmar. The 11 o'clock is pre '33 according to the list online, and in near mint condition. I'm not a collector, but when I saw the lens and the price, it was too good to pass up. Mounting it is when I found it to be the 11 o'clock version.

I'm thinking of picking up another Barnack to use the lens. II seems to be the vintage I'm looking for. Any opinions or suggestions when I start to look for one?

Oh, playing with it on a Panasonic GF1--sharp little thing. Amazing for ~80 year old lens.
 
wolves3012 said:
Sorry, you can't rotate the mount on a FED or Zorki, there's a flat machined into the back at the top...physically it would screw up the register if you did it.

EDIT: That's possibly incorrect for a Zorki 6, can't see for sure.
Click to expand...

Yes, you can, if you're also shimming for correct focus at the same time (like I said in my post).
 
batterytypehah! said:
Yes, you can, if you're also shimming for correct focus at the same time (like I said in my post).
Click to expand...
Still think it'd be more trouble than it's worth. The milled flat on the back of the mount means it would end up needing huge shims to keep it square to the body, then the lens would need re-shimming drastically to correct the extra LTF distance. It may be possible but it's not very practical. Milling another flat would be easier - if you have access to the equipment!
 
wolves3012, we're probably not talking about the same camera here. I mean a Zorki 4. No flat. The mount can be attached in any of the four possible orientations. My Zorki came with the mount upside down, that's how I found out. Shims were MIA, too.

There's a tiny engraved dot on the rear surface that needs to point down for standard orientation. On mine, at least (1967 vintage).
 
If it is necessary to use the Elmar, then getting a II for it is the obvious course. If slow speeds are not to be used even when available, then the II can replace the IIIa.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom