TMax 400 in Caffenol-C - what did I do wrong?

[pobe]

This is from a roll of TMax 400 I developed in Caffenol-C. One of my first rolls and something went very wrong... Any ideas on what might have caused this? The reason I ask is that I have a brick of TMax in my fridge... I haven't dared to use again, but I think I'll have another go at it.

It looks as if the unexposed silver has gotten developed, turning what should be black into gray - but there are still darker areas (lighter on the neg of course).

I could try a "real" developer, but I really enjoy the Caffenol thing... Haven't tried with potassium bromide though - perhaps that's the key? Or did I simply mess up the process - too much of something, too long?

Thankful for any ideas!

 

[ibcrewin]

I don't know what happend, but it almost looks like solarization! Kind of funky.

 

[arunrajmohan]

Where they exposed at 400?
Have you read this? http://caffenol.blogspot.com/2010/10/tmax-400-1600-4800-in-caffenol-c-l.html
Perhaps the film hates caffeinated drinks and likes HC110 🙂

Arun

 

[LeicaM3]

May be able to help if you provide some information.

Volume?
Amount of Caffenol / Vit C / Wash soda?
How did you mix? In what order? Did you let the first ingredient dissolve before mixing in the next? How long after mixing did you use it?
Time / Temperature / Agitation?

Once we know it is easier to tell. Hard to pinpoint (for me) from a bad neg what exactly went wrong.

 

[pobe]

27g soda, 20g coffee, 9g vit c in 500ml water. First soda, then coffee, then vit c (waiting until the first was dissolved) Started probably about 5 minutes after mixing - agitating the first minute and then a few turns every three minutes for totally 21.

 

[pobe]

Where they exposed at 400?
Have you read this? http://caffenol.blogspot.com/2010/10/tmax-400-1600-4800-in-caffenol-c-l.html

Yes, exposed at 400. But perhaps stand with some KBr is the way to go with TMax...

 

[rover]

Cream and sugar, should have used the caffenol black.


Sorry, couldn't stop myself.

 

[arunrajmohan]

Yes, exposed at 400. But perhaps stand with some KBr is the way to go with TMax...

That article says, "EI 200 and 400 were so dense that they were practically unsuable. 800 was OK, but still quite dense. So I thought that EI 1600 would be possible at least, maybe more even if I reduced the dev time or temperature slightly"

Are your negatives either too dense or too thin? Last time I tried this with Arista Premium 400, the negatives were dense... too dense. Thereafter I stopped using Caffenol.

Arun

 

[dan_sutton]

just a question, what about caffenol do you enjoy besides the bad results? hc110 sits on the shelf for every, only uses a bit per roll and works flawlessly.

 

[pobe]

Good question... The weirdness of developing in coffee? 🙂 I've actually gotten quite good results with other (slower) films, only done one roll of TMax 400 so far. I'll probably get a proper developer for the brick in my fridge though...

 

[ibcrewin]

maybe you need to presoak the film to soften up the emulsion?

 

[xwhatsit]

That's solarised! Sure it didn't see any light during development? I suppose if they're all evenly like that then it can't really have been a tank light leak.

That's cool, chemical solarisation 🙂

 

[LeicaM3]

27g soda, 20g coffee, 9g vit c in 500ml water. First soda, then coffee, then vit c (waiting until the first was dissolved) Started probably about 5 minutes after mixing - agitating the first minute and then a few turns every three minutes for totally 21.

Ok, I mix soda -> Vit C -> coffee.
Never added coffee before Vit C.

Reinhold recommends "When adding the vitamin-C small bubbles will appear, wait until they have cleared before finally adding the coffee. This is important! Then add the coffee, stir well and let stand the soup for about 5 minutes."

All kinds of other things may have gone wrong, so it is hard to tell - but your mixing sequence seems to be off. Have you ever done it in your order with decent results?

 

[pobe]

Ok, I mix soda -> Vit C -> coffee.
Never added coffee before Vit C.

Reinhold recommends "When adding the vitamin-C small bubbles will appear, wait until they have cleared before finally adding the coffee. This is important! Then add the coffee, stir well and let stand the soup for about 5 minutes."

All kinds of other things may have gone wrong, so it is hard to tell - but your mixing sequence seems to be off. Have you ever done it in your order with decent results?

Can't remember where I found the instructions, but I've "always" done it this way (about 20 rolls total) and it has worked fine expect for this particular roll/film. Haven't tried any more TMax 400 - TMax 100 worked great (quick scans with default settings on a cheap flatbed):





I'll do the vit c before the coffee next time!

 

[Ezzie]

I've got good results with TMAX 400 in Caffenol-C-H. Look here http://on-your-kitchen-worktop.blogspot.com

Though I must admit I prefer TMAX 100 in Caffenol

You've used the C-M version which is not recommended for 400 films or faster. You really need potassium bromide, at least 1.5g/l, i.e 0.75 for a 500ml solution. Develop for 14 minutes at 20C, 1min agitation initially, 3 inversions a minute thereafter. Slow and steady inversions mind. Fill not 500ml but 530ml when processing one 120 film or two 135 films so the froth from the coffee settles above the top edge of the roll. Dilute and dissolve soda let settle, add vitamin-C second and let settle. Add PBr, then coffee. Remember; either you need heat to dissolve the ingredients, or the chemical reactions themselves generate heat, you'll need to cool the solution off to 20F/68F before use. Use within 30 minutes preferably. Water stop 1 minute, fix and wash as normal.

 

[Ezzie]

The posterisarion is due to underdevelopment more likely or underexposure in my experience. You yourself are in the best position to pin point which. But 21 minutes development (if at 20C) is overdoing it in my book, 13 to 15 minutes is more like it. But I use an EI of 320-400 even in Caffenol.

Though these dark shadow areas should be clear on the negative, they probably aren't due to base fog. You need PBr to rid the negatives of the fog. In post processing do not overdo trying to pull details out of the shadows, that most likely aren't there. If you do you get posterisation. And when scanning, widen the field to include information outside the flanks of the histogram. The result will be dull and flat, but much the better for post-processing.

 

[pobe]

Thanks!

I have tried different ways to scan these, some of the pictures look OK but most of them are really bad - it's the negs. I just ordered some potassium bromide so I'll give it a go with another roll and see how it works. Also, I'll mix in a different order (coffee last), watch the temperature and probably a bit shorter time.

 

[pobe]

I just developed a roll of TMax 400, being careful with the temperature, adding the coffee last and also using some potassium bromide (0.5 g for 250 ml water). 15 minutes - the negs are a bit thin but otherwise they look great! I'll try a bit longer next time, but I've got hope for the rest of the rolls in my fridge now 🙂