Were any modern MP's made without the Flare Free Finder?

kdemas

kdemas

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I have an MP3 and I could swear I am getting some focus patch white out which is not evident with my M7 (MP finder upgrade). So my questions is....

Were any MP's (new generation) made without the little condenser (flare free finder)? If not, what might be going on with my MP?

Thanks for your thoughts.

Kent
 
The MP viewfinder is not actually 100% flare resistant. Under some conditions I occasionally get some flare in the vf of mine. I don't believe that any Leica viewfinder is entirely resistant to flare.
 
The M3 is the most resistant to RF patch flare. I've never seen mine white out.

In contrast, I can make the patch on my M2 & M4 flare, but I have to really work @ it (move my eye way off center, etc.). I think the "new" design introduced w/the late M7s & continuing w/the MP simply returned everything to the M2 state of affairs, but are still not as flare-free as the M3.

Rafael said:
The MP viewfinder is not actually 100% flare resistant. Under some conditions I occasionally get some flare in the vf of mine. I don't believe that any Leica viewfinder is entirely resistant to flare.
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kdemas said:
Riccis- Thanks for the note. I am a little concerned with the flare I see in the MP3. Hmmm.
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Sell it to me 😀😀😀😀

I don't know about the MP flare resistance but its viewfinder does not need to be replaced like in some of the early M7s as this was corrected before the MP came into existence.

Cheers,
 
There seems to be a little line forming if I decide to sell it! I do like the camera, though my M7 .85 keeps winking at me and saying "what are you doing with THAT!".

That M7 had zero flare compared to the MP3, causing my question. Both are great tools. I'm going to ping Leica for fun to see what they have to say about that MP3 finder. It is a bit different from stock MP's, with only 3 frames, so who knows!

Kent



Riccis said:
Sell it to me 😀😀😀😀

I don't know about the MP flare resistance but its viewfinder does not need to be replaced like in some of the early M7s as this was corrected before the MP came into existence.

Cheers,
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I wonder if the flat glass illumination window on the MP3 might be part of it? The MP3 doesn't have the ribbed glass like the MP- tho the M6 and M4-P have that ribbed glass too...

I have to admit that I've not ever noticed any difference in my VFs, and I've shot CL, CLE, M3, M4, M4-2 M5, M6, MP, MP3, M7, M8, M8.2 & M9 bodies. But then again I am an idiot. I do notice a lack of visible framelines from time to time whatever the body, but never RF patch woes. A slight increase in frameline woes with the MP3- but still not very often at all.

Oh, and I'm the one you'll want to sell that thing to.
 
jonmanjiro said:
Kent, I'm pretty certain that the very early MPs came with the same finder as the M7. The change to the better "MP" finder happened a bit later on in production.

I base this observation on the dozen or so MPs I examined at MAP Camera in Tokyo a while back. The finder in one with a very early serial number had a different color multi-coating on the finder glass (from memory more blueish than the later coating) than the other later serial no. MPs. When pointed at a strong light source, the early finder seemed to flare more than the other later finders. Unscientific maybe, but if I was buying an MP, based on this I would not buy an MP in the 28xxxx range, and would prefer one in the 3xxxxxx range. Just my two yen.
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That is the first time that I hear about a switch in production of the modern Leica MP. The most important change compared to it predecessor (the M6TTL) was an improvement of the VF and it was one of points emphasized by Leica. The improvement is not just re-installing a condensor lens but some other modifications to the whole RF assembly （which were listed once in the Leica Camera User forum) compared to the earlier ones (M6, M6TTL, M7).

I had a Leica MP my own, a early production model in the 29xxxxx range and it had the same VF as later models.

EDIT: There was a small series of "pre-MP" cameras, only sold in Japan. The Leica MP-6 (400 pieces) but the only difference to the regular MP were cosmetics.
 
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furcafe said:
The M3 is the most resistant to RF patch flare. I've never seen mine white out.

In contrast, I can make the patch on my M2 & M4 flare, but I have to really work @ it (move my eye way off center, etc.). I think the "new" design introduced w/the late M7s & continuing w/the MP simply returned everything to the M2 state of affairs, but are still not as flare-free as the M3.
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That sums it up very well. In order to reduce the finder magnification from the .91 of the M3 to a lower value (starting with .72 in the M2), The whole finder layout had to be changed to one with some flare sensitivity. It wasn't bad with the M2, M4, or M5. With later cameras, the condenser lens was removed, increasing the susceptibility to flare. With the MP and some M7's, they have put back what they never should have taken out in the first place.
 
jonmanjiro said:
The cameras I looked at were regular MPs. The guy at MAP Camera was as baffled as I was about the difference. Maybe its as simple as a batch of MPs got pre-upgrade M7 finders by mistake...
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Leica changed the VF window coatings all the time. With introduction of the M6 (and the need to install LEDs for the meter read out), a covering in the VF window had to be installed, thus the single silver stripe on the front window of the M6. Since many customer complained about the flare problem, as a counterneasure Leica improved the window coating and added a second silver stripe on the top of the front window when introducing the M6TTL. This same window design was also used for the M7 including the M6TTL RF assembly but with changed meter display. The MP however - since only having a simple LED dot read-out and a changed RF assembly - has again the single silver-stripe on the bottom of the VF front window.

Unfortunately, it is impossible to judge from the outside of the camera, which RF assembly is installed.
 
They all flare, some more some less. M2, m3 flares significantly less. M6 ttl is the worst (my experience).
 
Hmmm... on the silver stripe point Gabor raised, the MP3 has no silver stripe at all. Maybe this is contributing to the issue.

It sure looks good though 😉
 
The serial number on my MP3 is in the #305xxxx range. I wonder if it's those little silver stripes, that sounds possible.
 
I recently purchased a second hand SN29… MP.
One of my major concerns in making the purchase was, that it seriously upgrades in finder flare upon my chrome M6 0.72, as I didn't see another reason, to buy an MP.

I was pleasantly surprised, that the MP is up to the finder of my M8.2, which never made any difficulties for focussing due to flare (my M6 and M7 0.85 do).
The MP finder is crystal clear, as the M8.2 finder.

The M6 0.72 flares most, while the M7 0.85 still does in certain strong back lit/ side lit situations.
 
Kent - Bring it to the Muybridge get-together and I'll bring my a la carte MP. Mine also has only the 35-50-90 framelines. It's brighter and more flare-resistant than my M8. We can geek-out comparing finders 😀
 
I have definitely had flare on my M3 when shooting into the sun, sun just out of the VF. I haven't tried any other M yet.

The screwmounts never flare; there's at least one advantage to having a separate RF.
 
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