Real Sonnar vs. Jupiter 9

[hlpgtf]

I currently have an late-1950's lsm 85mm Jupiter 9, but ran across what looks like a prewar chrome Contax-mount Zeiss Sonnar for a reasonable price (I'm using a Sony NEX, so mount doesn't much matter - adapters are cheap). Assuming a good Jupiter copy, would I see any real difference in the two? I'd be shooting wide open most, if not all, of the time. Also, the Sonnar is listed without a T by a seller that always mentions the T - should that mean uncoated, or were most single-coated? Thanks.

 

[hlpgtf]

Another quick question - would I see a weight penalty with the Sonnar? The Jupiter's cheapy aluminum body has an upside - I've been amazed how dense the old chomed brass lenses are.

 

[Dez]

I suspect you would see better contrast with the J9. A big slab of uncoated glass is just begging for flare. The J9 will probably require adjustment of the focus mount shims however.

Cheers,
Dez

 

[Brian Legge]

...though there are mixed opinions about if a J9 can be accurately shipped for LTM. Maybe able to get it close enough for general use but F2 up close takes a lot of accuracy.

 

[David Hughes]

Flare

Flare

A lot of people talk about flare as though it happens all the time; it needs a light source or reflection of one in the frame or else very near to it. Shoot the way most people do and use a lens hood and you may never notice it. Take care when shooting into the light and it's not much of a problem; especially when compared to getting the exposure right.

I use a Summar in the original condition (meaning uncoated and undamaged) and a FED f/2 clone/copy (also uncoated and undamaged) and don't have any worries. And the lens hood was off a stall in a flea market...

You have to remember what your granny told you about always having the sun behind you! It's often as simple as that.

BTW, scratches, cleaning marks, dirt or haze often cause what's seen as flare and then get blamed on the makers and not the users. Watch people cleaning lenses with their shirt sleeves and you'll understand...

Regards, David

PS I'd be very interested in your comments on the digital + adapter set-up. I've often wondered about them but have had bad experiences with them many years ago, before the things got properly sorted out.

 

[dexdog]

...though there are mixed opinions about if a J9 can be accurately shipped for LTM. Maybe able to get it close enough for general use but F2 up close takes a lot of accuracy.

I have a J9 that does not focus accurately on a Canon P; it back-focuses about 2 feet at a distance of 15 feet, wide open at f2. The same lens focuses just fine using the LCD screen on my NEX 5, and produces nice, sharp images. I think that the registration distance of the lens may be less of a factor with a camera like the NEX because focus does not rely on a rangefinder. Just my two cents.

 

[randomm]

I have a J9 that does not focus accurately on a Canon P; it back-focuses about 2 feet at a distance of 15 feet, wide open at f2. The same lens focuses just fine using the LCD screen on my NEX 5, and produces nice, sharp images. I think that the registration distance of the lens may be less of a factor with a camera like the NEX because focus does not rely on a rangefinder. Just my two cents.

Shame Brian is no longer posting here, but for what its worth I also do not think that a J9 can be made to correctly focus at all distances on a Leica standard body. From 1.8m or so until infinity is possible, but closer than that I think its probably impossible. I've attempted two and failed.

It's a wonderful lens though. I have the first fixed at 0.8m focus and the second one collimated to work between about 1.8m until infinity. I love the close focus one that I've got:


Geraldine by randomm, on Flickr

 

[dexdog]

Shame Brian is no longer posting here, but for what its worth I also do not think that a J9 can be made to correctly focus at all distances on a Leica standard body.

Nice portrait using the J9! I recall Brian Sweeney has said in the past that a J9 in LTM cannot be made to focus accurately across the spectrum on a leica standard body. I think that he said that the length of the barrel/focusing mechanism is a little too short to allow the proper shims to be put in place.

 

[randomm]

Nice portrait using the J9! I recall Brian Sweeney has said in the past that a J9 in LTM cannot be made to focus accurately across the spectrum on a leica standard body.

Yes, this is exactly what I meant, sorry! I think it may be possible to have a close focus optimised one or one optimised for longer distances and up until infinity, but not necessarily the whole range.

I think that he said that the length of the barrel/focusing mechanism is a little too short to allow the proper shims to be put in place.

Interesting. I am determined to have another go at some point. I'll post my findings here if and when I get a chance to fiddle with it...

 

[dexdog]

Interesting. I am determined to have another go at some point. I'll post my findings here if and when I get a chance to fiddle with it...

I have 2 J-9s in LTM, a 1957 version that does not focus correctly on a Canon P, and a 1951 version (with CZJ glass and internal barrel elements) that is apparently made to the leica standard, because it focuses very well on the Canon. If you unscrew the optics from both lenses and try to swap them out, they are not interchangable- they will physically screw in place, but the 1951 optics stick out of the 1957 barrel by a mm or so. Neither lens will focus accurately on the Canon P with the elements swapped out, but both will produce sharp images on the NEX. It is interesting to note that the distance scale on the barrels are in different positions when focused on the same point, using the NEX on a tripod. Not exactly sure what all this means, not being very good with the math and physics of lens design.

I agree that the J-9s can usually be optimized for close-up and wide-opn at the expense of infinity focus.

 

[brbo]

Ok, OP said lens will be used on NEX so all of this focus thing is irrelevant.

It WILL focus correctly on NEX. At all distances*. MF focus lens in 'stopped down' focusing mode (which is all you get with MF lens + adapter on NEX) can not backfocus/frontfocus on NEX when you focus using the LCD display.

* provided that the adapter will enable the lens to reach infinity