Sunny f/8?

kevin_v

kevin_v

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So, you know that rule for guessing exposure, the Sunny f/16 rule which states on a bright, sunny day, at f/16, your shutter speed should be 1 over your ISO? Well, it may be just me, but on sunny days, for me, it's more like f/8 or, rarely, f/11. Does the sun just shine less brightly in Minnesota? :confused:
 
1 over your ISO....? shouldn't your shutter speed match your ISO? or rather, get as near to your ISO as possible.

perhaps that is why you end up using f8/f11....?

*is a noob*
 
With B/W, I get good results with Sunny f/11 as a baseline, and then adjust up or down (more down than up) as I judge each shot. I also use a hand-held incident light meter. Looks like a toy, but it works for me.

With best regards.

Pfreddee(Stephen)
 
I think Kevin is saying "one over the iso" e.g for iso 400, 1 over 400 or 1/400th. This is what I also understand sunny 16 to be.
 
I think OP means ISO100=1/125 ISO200=1/250 ISO400=1/500 which is the "one over". In theory that should be fine for negative material as it is only 25% deviation.
 
Yes, it's 1 over your ISO. For example: fp-4 iso 125, sunny 16 says 1/125 @ f16. As for sunny 8, it does depend on the direction of the sun but I'm always pretty close to 16, sometimes I go to 11, knowing I'll want to tame the contrast a bit in development.
 
Time of day, time of the year, latitude, light haze, not to mention differences in film and camera all add to the inaccuracy of the sunny sixteen rule. I get f8 sometimes in California, but not very often.
 
I've found Sunny 16 to be very effective, but it has to be 100% clear with great visibility. And keep in mind that it only applies to a directly illuminated subject. So for example, it works great if you're photographing people with the sun behind you.

If your angle changes, you may want to see into the shadows more, in which case Sunny 16 will look too dark. It's not that the exposure has changed, it's just that now the ideal exposure is a split between the sunlit areas and the shadow areas. That could easily put you at ƒ/8. (Open shade is "Shady 5.6") I also rate my negative films at 1/2 box speed or less, so I actually use "Sunny 11."

Chicago shares some weather characteristics with Minnesota, so the biggest challenge for me is estimating the exposure when it's overcast. Most exposure charts list Overcast and Heavy Overcast, but in the midwest, we have a much larger spectrum of Overcast. Sometimes it's a very light EV 13 (ƒ/8, 1/ISO), but a heavy overcast sky in winter can easily reach EV 9 or 10 (ƒ2/2.8, 1/ISO).

But generally an error of a stop or two is not a problem if you're shooting negatives!
 
greyelm said:
I think Kevin is saying "one over the iso" e.g for iso 400, 1 over 400 or 1/400th. This is what I also understand sunny 16 to be.
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Lflex said:
I think OP means ISO100=1/125 ISO200=1/250 ISO400=1/500 which is the "one over".
Click to expand...

erik said:
Yes, it's 1 over your ISO. For example: fp-4 iso 125, sunny 16 says 1/125 @ f16.
Click to expand...

ah, my bad. :eek:

yes, i agree with everyone else that it depends on various things as to whether f16 really is optimum.
 
I always found that I got Sunny f11 living in Cornwall (south coast of England). Moving back up north to the dirty, grimy, not-particularly-sunny Midlands last year, I suddenly found myself working at Sunny f8.

I don't think I've ever been anywhere in England where I got Sunny f16 on a lightmeter. You guys don't know how lucky you are!
 
The sun (sky) may just be a little less bright in Minnesota than some place further south. I went to the Caribbean in February and while the air temp was only 75 degrees the overhead sun made it feel much warmer than the 85 degrees in the US a few days ago.
 
It is actually the old German rule of thumb "Die Sonne lacht, nimm Blende 8" [Sun is smiling, use aperture 8] since "lacht" and "8=acht" are an easy to remember rhyme. Another one "Erscheinen Wolken Dir, nimm Blende 4" [If clouds appear, use aperture 4]

These rules were established when films with sensitivity similar to todays ISO125 were standard.
 
I just took a reading, here in St. Louis, with the Spectra Professional three days ago. The sky was a clear, cloudless blue, and I took the reading near noon. With the ISO (really, ASA on this old meter) set to 125, I got exactly 1/125 at f/16. That surprised me, because here in St. Louis it is more usually a "Sunny 11.5 rule." It would not surprise me if the reading were to drop another 1/2 stop or so between here and Minnesota. And if the reading had been taken earlier in the year, when the sun was lower in the sky, it would not surprise me if it were a bit lower still. Atmospheric conditions have an effect as well. Of course, Sunny 16 applies to subjects that are fully frontally lit. Surfaces facing at a 45 degree angle to the sun will require a smidgin more exposure, etc.

Add all that up, and that's why we need light meters! I mostly se sunny 16 to check my meter, not to finalize the exposure.
 
Sunny 16 is one shutter speed over the ASA at f16.
That's the rule for pointing at a "neutral" portion of a sunny sky. When you're shooting your subject under those same conditions you have to account for a one stop loss because everything we see is reflecting sunlight. That accounts for the f11 that most people are getting.

That's what I've always heard. It's worked pretty well for me over the last 25 years.
 
Travis, I believe, has it right. I have read the 1 over ISO @ f16 holds true for snow and light colored beaches on a bright, sunny day. A cow pasture under the same conditions reflects less light. However, it does not seem right. I do not want my grass to look like snow. It is darker (different zones in the zone system).
 
mid-winter in alabama, it is sunny 500/f5.6, early spring/fall, 500/f8, mid summer on the gulf, 500/f16 from 10 a.m. to 4 p.m. humidity/haze in high summer in the deep south cuts a stop to f11 ...
 
TXForester said:
Travis, I believe, has it right. I have read the 1 over ISO @ f16 holds true for snow and light colored beaches on a bright, sunny day. A cow pasture under the same conditions reflects less light. However, it does not seem right. I do not want my grass to look like snow. It is darker (different zones in the zone system).
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Doesn't that assume that the sand/snow is 1 stop brighter than the pasture? If it's more than 1 stop, and if f11 is 'correct' (zone V) for the pasture, then f16 for something that's more than a stop brighter will place the bright subject higher than zone V.
 
it depends on the angle of the light, your position to it, what contrast you want (thus, what film you use) and the reflectiveness surface of what you're photographing.
 
I've posted this before, but the Rolleiflex TLRs used to have a metal exposure table plate on the body, with winter and summer settings, Northern Europe. Northern USA might be similar.

I have never seen a thread on Sunny 16 that causes so much confusion. I won't add to that.
 
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