loquax ludens
Well-known
I acquired a FILCA cassette that is loaded with a film that appears to have a factory-cut long leader. It does not look like it was cut with an ABLON. An ABLON would not have left the point at the very end, or the notch at the fifth sproket hole.
Handwritten in pencil on the exposed leader is "Supreme 1953". The only vintage film I could find that was called "Supreme" was AGFA Ansco Superpan Supreme. Were there other vintage films known as "Supreme"?
Why would a film with a factory-cut leader be loaded in a reloadable cassette? You would think that the leader of any bulk loaded film in a FILCA would be cut with an ABLON. Were there single roll-length films with pre-cut leaders sold to photographers to load into their cassettes, or did film manufacturers or camera shops provide reloading services?
I rather doubt this 60 year old film is capable of recording an image, so I probably won't try it, But I'm curious about the history, if anyone has any information about it.
This is not the best photo, but it's legible enough, I think.
Handwritten in pencil on the exposed leader is "Supreme 1953". The only vintage film I could find that was called "Supreme" was AGFA Ansco Superpan Supreme. Were there other vintage films known as "Supreme"?
Why would a film with a factory-cut leader be loaded in a reloadable cassette? You would think that the leader of any bulk loaded film in a FILCA would be cut with an ABLON. Were there single roll-length films with pre-cut leaders sold to photographers to load into their cassettes, or did film manufacturers or camera shops provide reloading services?
I rather doubt this 60 year old film is capable of recording an image, so I probably won't try it, But I'm curious about the history, if anyone has any information about it.
This is not the best photo, but it's legible enough, I think.
colyn
ישו משיח
Back in the 20's-50's 35mm film could be bought pre-cut to length and the user had to load into the FILCA in a darkroom. Some brands sold their film with pre-cut leaders..
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
Even as late as the 50's you could buy film that came in long rolls, but with leaders trimmed to size. You just loaded your cassette and snipped it off at the thin end of the leaders!
You can always try the film, rate it at some very low asa (3 or 6) and process in Rodinal 1:50 for 10 minutes. Could work (I did some Kodak 1931 film like that - rated it at 0.5 asa - kind of worked - a bit of emulsion flaking - and, yes it was grainy).
You can always try the film, rate it at some very low asa (3 or 6) and process in Rodinal 1:50 for 10 minutes. Could work (I did some Kodak 1931 film like that - rated it at 0.5 asa - kind of worked - a bit of emulsion flaking - and, yes it was grainy).
loquax ludens
Well-known
Yes, I guess it would be fun to try and see if it can capture anything at all. 3 to 6 ASA sounds about right for really old film. It probably was no faster than 125 speed originally, based on what I've been able to find out about it. I'll rate it at 3 and give it a shot as soon as I finish the roll of Tri-X that is currently loaded in my IIIc.
Hopefully no one has opened the cassette over the years. If they have, it'll be a wasted effort, but there's only one way to know. I can add some potassium bromide to the developer as an anti-fogging aid. I'll need to research it a bit before I try to develop the film.
Hopefully no one has opened the cassette over the years. If they have, it'll be a wasted effort, but there's only one way to know. I can add some potassium bromide to the developer as an anti-fogging aid. I'll need to research it a bit before I try to develop the film.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
I am not familiar with this film bit here in the UK Ilford supplied "darkroom refills". These were standard length films with a leader to re-load into FILCA IXMOO or plain cassettes. There was a saving on the cost of film but the example I have has a "standard" leader.
"In October 1959, 35mm FP3 film became FP3 Series II. A 20exp. cassette cost 5s/1d (25.5p)and a 36exp. cassette cost 6s/10d (34p). Darkroom loading refills, 36exp. cost 3s/11d (19.5p) and unspooled lengths of 5m and 17m cost 10s/6d (52.5p) and 31s/11d (£1.60p) respectively.
From:http://www.photomemorabilia.co.uk/Ilford/Chronology.html
There is a picture here,not showing the leader.
http://anegativeinfluence.wordpress.com/2011/07/23/ilford-pan-f-refill/
It could be of this type but the "measured" bulk roll looks best bet with the darkroom notch.
Slightly O/T but fascinating are the exposed films found in cameras:
http://westfordcomp.com/updated/found.htm
"In October 1959, 35mm FP3 film became FP3 Series II. A 20exp. cassette cost 5s/1d (25.5p)and a 36exp. cassette cost 6s/10d (34p). Darkroom loading refills, 36exp. cost 3s/11d (19.5p) and unspooled lengths of 5m and 17m cost 10s/6d (52.5p) and 31s/11d (£1.60p) respectively.
From:http://www.photomemorabilia.co.uk/Ilford/Chronology.html
There is a picture here,not showing the leader.
http://anegativeinfluence.wordpress.com/2011/07/23/ilford-pan-f-refill/
It could be of this type but the "measured" bulk roll looks best bet with the darkroom notch.
Slightly O/T but fascinating are the exposed films found in cameras:
http://westfordcomp.com/updated/found.htm
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
Al Kaplan (Sadly Missed) 27/02/2009
The Leica cameras and the three part turn-to-open cassettes were designed by Leitz to work together. Film in preloaded 35mm cassettes wasn't available. What is amazing is that the various camera manufacturers were able come up with cameras that all were capable of using the same size cassette so that the now common felt lipped cassette worked in such a wide range of cameras. Ilford made a really heavy duty and well designed snap-cap cassette. They sold "daylight refills" consisting of a plastic spool with a 36 exp. length of film and a black paper "leader" atached to the film tongue. You could reload your cassette and pull the black paper through the felt light trap until the film leader appeared. These also worked in Leica, Nikon, etc. cassettes as well as cassettes from Ilford, Agfa, Gavaert, Ansco, DuPont, Ferrania, Adox, etc. Kodak marketed 27.5 ft. "bulk" rolls that were pre-cut with leaders and little tongues that would fit in the slot of Lerica and other brands of film spools. Each leader was connected to the next tongue by a narrow piece of film, easy to tear off in the dark. It gave you 5 rolls of 36 exposures, and while on a per roll basis was more expensive than buying 50 ft. (yes, they made those too) or 100 ft. rolls it was still a lot cheaper than buying factory loaded cassettes.
The Leica cameras and the three part turn-to-open cassettes were designed by Leitz to work together. Film in preloaded 35mm cassettes wasn't available. What is amazing is that the various camera manufacturers were able come up with cameras that all were capable of using the same size cassette so that the now common felt lipped cassette worked in such a wide range of cameras. Ilford made a really heavy duty and well designed snap-cap cassette. They sold "daylight refills" consisting of a plastic spool with a 36 exp. length of film and a black paper "leader" atached to the film tongue. You could reload your cassette and pull the black paper through the felt light trap until the film leader appeared. These also worked in Leica, Nikon, etc. cassettes as well as cassettes from Ilford, Agfa, Gavaert, Ansco, DuPont, Ferrania, Adox, etc. Kodak marketed 27.5 ft. "bulk" rolls that were pre-cut with leaders and little tongues that would fit in the slot of Lerica and other brands of film spools. Each leader was connected to the next tongue by a narrow piece of film, easy to tear off in the dark. It gave you 5 rolls of 36 exposures, and while on a per roll basis was more expensive than buying 50 ft. (yes, they made those too) or 100 ft. rolls it was still a lot cheaper than buying factory loaded cassettes.
loquax ludens
Well-known
Chris, thank you for that bit of history. I especially appreciate the quote from Al Kaplan, which most likely explains the how the film I have got into a FILCA.
That site with the "lost" exposed films was very fascinating. I just bought a Minox III that had an exposed roll of Minocolor 3 film in it. It's 100 ASA film, and probably not that old, although the label looks pretty dated. I am pretty sure it is C-41 process, and so I'll develop it in my next run of C-41.
That site with the "lost" exposed films was very fascinating. I just bought a Minox III that had an exposed roll of Minocolor 3 film in it. It's 100 ASA film, and probably not that old, although the label looks pretty dated. I am pretty sure it is C-41 process, and so I'll develop it in my next run of C-41.
Jaans
Well-known
Thats an interesting find. It would be great to know how some images turned out.
loquax ludens
Well-known
I will post about my results after I try the film. I'll post images if I get any. It'll be a while though. My IIIc has a half a roll of film in it already that is taking me a while to finish. It's my fault for having eight different cameras all loaded with film at the same time.