Hoping for a Sigma BF followup

[Ken Ford]

I continue to be hugely impressed with my BF - the way they rethought how a camera should be used is tremendously impressive. The UX designer deserves a knighthood; I hope the camera is a raging success.

I’m hoping Sigma doubles down on this with a slightly larger additional model that includes a quality shoulder position EVF and IBIS, and ideally integration with Leica six bit coding when using adapted M lenses. That would probably be enough to get me to move on from M mount bodies…

 

[lynnb]

Thanks for posting this. I’ll be interested/curious to hear how you find it as time passes. It’s not for me, but I wish Sigma every success.

 

[Ken Ford]

Thanks for posting this. I’ll be interested/curious to hear how you find it as time passes. It’s not for me, but I wish Sigma every success.

Is it the lack of a VF or something else? Genuinely curious.

 

[agentlossing]

The slow electronic shutter readout (equivalent to 1/40 sec) is what I'd like to see remedied above all else; IBIS would be a nice secondary addition. Is there any consensus on whether the files are really 14-bit? DPR suggested that this sensor outputs 12-bit files with electronic shutter.

As I keep saying, I've held this camera in my hands, I know what the fuss is about. The fuss is... sort of legit. This camera feels amazing.

 

[Ken Ford]

Good point - the shutter specs need a boost, too.

 

[trix4ever]

I continue to be hugely impressed with my BF - the way they rethought how a camera should be used is tremendously impressive. The UX designer deserves a knighthood; I hope the camera is a raging success.

I’m hoping Sigma doubles down on this with a slightly larger additional model that includes a quality shoulder position EVF and IBIS, and ideally integration with Leica six bit coding when using adapted M lenses. That would probably be enough to get me to move on from M mount bodies…

You mention 6bit coding. Does the BF have the corner shading correction like the Fp?
I use it all the time with my M mount wideangles and it works beautifully correcting the corner colour shift. Some of my lenses work better on the Fp than the M240.

 

[trix4ever]

I continue to be hugely impressed with my BF - the way they rethought how a camera should be used is tremendously impressive. The UX designer deserves a knighthood; I hope the camera is a raging success.

I’m hoping Sigma doubles down on this with a slightly larger additional model that includes a quality shoulder position EVF and IBIS, and ideally integration with Leica six bit coding when using adapted M lenses. That would probably be enough to get me to move on from M mount bodies…

Sigma never brought out an Fpii despite all the calls for one, I doubt they'll make a BFii, they're odd like that. Just as I wish they would bring out a Sd Quattro ii...
I'm actually thinking of buying an Fp-l to use my Leica CL lenses on.
I have to say the stupid high priced battery for the BF is enough to keep me using my Fp. Which uses the same batteries as my CL and GX8 and cost nearly nothing, and should be made for the foreseeable future. No 3rd party will make BF batteries when they are making so few cameras and they don't fit any other camera.

 

[Ken Ford]

You mention 6bit coding. Does the BF have the corner shading correction like the Fp?
I use it all the time with my M mount wideangles and it works beautifully correcting the corner colour shift. Some of my lenses work better on the Fp than the M240.

No idea - I wasn’t aware the fp did that!

 

[trix4ever]

No idea - I wasn’t aware the fp did that!

Menu > Lens optics compensation > color shading, then you photograph a plain white wall or whatever, I use a wardrobe door, then type in lens details and the lens will be automatically compensated for, up to 10 lenses can be set like this. Works like magic.
It would be silly if they left it off the BF...

 

[shawn]

It has it….

 

[Ken Ford]

Great information - thank you! I’ve pretty much settled on Sigma lenses on my BF but will likely try my M lenses more seriously at some point - I’ll have to remember this.

 

[Godfrey]

I continue to be hugely impressed with my BF - the way they rethought how a camera should be used is tremendously impressive. The UX designer deserves a knighthood; I hope the camera is a raging success.

I’m hoping Sigma doubles down on this with a slightly larger additional model that includes a quality shoulder position EVF and IBIS, and ideally integration with Leica six bit coding when using adapted M lenses. That would probably be enough to get me to move on from M mount bodies…

I have read the reviews and looked at the Sigma BF technical info, and seen bunches of photos ... And I just don't get it at all. There's little that separates this camera from a dozen other 'mirrorless' (hate that moniker) cameras other than a reduction in menu items and a highly stylized (and to my eye, very uncomfortable to hold) body design.

I have no idea why I'd want one of these over a Leica M10, M10-R, or M10 Monochrom other than the difference in price. Is "low price" the altar at which people are worshiping this camera?

There are lots of excellent 'mirrorless' bodies on the market. I wouldn't buy any of them on price alone. I'm more intrigued by the BF's predecessor, the "fp", as it is much more plainly, honestly, a compact technical camera designed to be handled and used, added to, etc. Fancy styling is silly when it comes to a camera...

G

"I'd rather spend my time looking through a camera than looking at one."

 

[splitimageview]

I for one am glad that Sigma decided to go stylish.

Imagine a world without style! It would be like living in Eastern Bloc with nothing but wheezing Trabants on the road. 🤣

 

[Rayt]

I had an Q2M and enjoyed it tremendously as an alternative to the M and SL system. And the 28mm (more like an 26mm on this camera) is my favorite perspective. The mono output and other features like perspective control are just fabulous. BUT. But the AF is such shit and I ended up zoning when I needed to shoot street because it’s barely better than an 80’s Nikon. So…I have been looking for something similar in a Fujifilm maybe an T-X5 with a fast 28mm. A fixed lens would be too restrictive unless it’s priced right. The Q3 is off the table now I have the budget breaking M11M. 🙂

 

[shawn]

I have read the reviews and looked at the Sigma BF technical info, and seen bunches of photos ... And I just don't get it at all. There's little that separates this camera from a dozen other 'mirrorless' (hate that moniker) cameras other than a reduction in menu items and a highly stylized (and to my eye, very uncomfortable to hold) body design.

I have no idea why I'd want one of these over a Leica M10, M10-R, or M10 Monochrom other than the difference in price. Is "low price" the altar at which people are worshiping this camera?

There are lots of excellent 'mirrorless' bodies on the market. I wouldn't buy any of them on price alone. I'm more intrigued by the BF's predecessor, the "fp", as it is much more plainly, honestly, a compact technical camera designed to be handled and used, added to, etc. Fancy styling is silly when it comes to a camera...

G

"I'd rather spend my time looking through a camera than looking at one."

Sigma pretty much has always made cameras that are different and go their own way. The BF is no different. I have the fp L so the BF is not of interest to me as it doesn't bring anything extra I would want and looses to much to me.

Used within its limits the fp L is a wonderful camera and has the best sensor out of any of my L mount cameras. I bought it to shoot square as a type of digital SWC and it is brilliant for that and I also ended up using it for much more. It lets me do things my Panasonics won't, such as override the APS-C crop which fits with square extremely well and opens up combos like the tiny Sigma 10-18mm f2.8 zoom which covers square fine. I have a used Sigma 16mm f1.4 on the way to try in square. If that covers, it will be ever so slightly wider than the SWC (just under 1 degree more vertical and horizontal) with even tighter DOF control. Equivalent to a 37mm f3.2 on 6x6.

 

[keepright]

I'll go one farther on the electronic shutter: I hope Sigma releases some i-series lenses with built-in leaf shutters. There's some precedent for this, and with cooperative firmware, could be used on other camera models as well. (It would be even more beneficial for cameras with flash control.) I'd gladly take a lens that's a stop darker and a bit more expensive in exchange.

I’ve pretty much settled on Sigma lenses on my BF but will likely try my M lenses more seriously at some point

My 45/2.8 is pretty much always attached. The only time I go back to m-mount is for my little 40/1.4 Nokton Classic when I know I'll be in the dark. And once I used my SLR adapter to fit a macro lens to it. I didn't expect to like the 45 as much as I do, but I did expect my adapted lenses to quickly be set aside once I had AF lenses for it. I spent years working in a camera store, listening to people say "well, if I buy this new camera system at least I can use my existing lenses on adapters", which was their way of saying "I'll see you again in a few months as I start re-buying all of my favourite lenses".

I have read the reviews and looked at the Sigma BF technical info, and seen bunches of photos ... And I just don't get it at all.

The good news is that you're not missing out. Nobody with a BF knows something you don't, or has any capabilities that can't be found elsewhere. The BF has a good but common sensor, it's about the same size as other small cameras, its autofocus isn't the best in the world, and it's suitable but not particularly gifted for adapted lenses. It's not a cheaper Leica, but it's also not a more expensive Panasonic. It's just it. And that's why I love mine.

The Sigma BF is an object. All of my other cameras are devices.

A cut crystal vase, or a golf club, is an object. I've never played golf, but if I pick up a good club, I know it's a good club and can see how it's meant to be used. There's a solidity, a thing-ness, to it. My ice maker, or my TV remote control, is a device. I've owned some good TV remotes, and I've had ones where it isn't clear which end is which – but regardless of design success or failures, their purpose is what they do, not how they're used. There's more to this distinction between the BF and other cameras than that in my mind, but maybe in my mind is also the only place where this makes sense.

 

[shawn]

I'll go one farther on the electronic shutter: I hope Sigma releases some i-series lenses with built-in leaf shutters. There's some precedent for this, and with cooperative firmware, could be used on other camera models as well. (It would be even more beneficial for cameras with flash control.) I'd gladly take a lens that's a stop darker and a bit more expensive in exchange.

I have thought the same thing. The flash possibilities alone would make it interesting for studio work. I am actually really surprised very few ILC mirrorless have done this. The Pentax Q and Samsung NX Mini had them.

Or take a page out of Pentax's book and make a lens adapter with a leaf shutter in it.

 

[agentlossing]

I have read the reviews and looked at the Sigma BF technical info, and seen bunches of photos ... And I just don't get it at all. There's little that separates this camera from a dozen other 'mirrorless' (hate that moniker) cameras other than a reduction in menu items and a highly stylized (and to my eye, very uncomfortable to hold) body design.

I have no idea why I'd want one of these over a Leica M10, M10-R, or M10 Monochrom other than the difference in price. Is "low price" the altar at which people are worshiping this camera?

There are lots of excellent 'mirrorless' bodies on the market. I wouldn't buy any of them on price alone. I'm more intrigued by the BF's predecessor, the "fp", as it is much more plainly, honestly, a compact technical camera designed to be handled and used, added to, etc. Fancy styling is silly when it comes to a camera...

G

"I'd rather spend my time looking through a camera than looking at one."

This is one of those fairly rare cameras which embodies the concept of "less is more" without apology. And (somehow) they've managed to make it easy to control despite that. But the concept of barely any menu will appeal to some. And, while the body might not be the most ergonomic, it's amazing in the flesh - if it appeals to you, you probably don't get over it after purchasing it. I imagine it'd be a bit like my Pentax 31mm Limited lens in silver - I still enjoy looking at it and picking it up, even though I've had it for a while.

Now, I wish the "less" didn't include lack of physical shutter or way of controlling with a flash. But design-wise, the camera charmed me when I handled it.

 

[shawn]

Now, I wish the "less" didn't include lack of physical shutter or way of controlling with a flash. But design-wise, the camera charmed me when I handled it.

Hopefully global shutters will become common enough that a physical shutter is not needed.

 

[Ken Ford]

I have read the reviews and looked at the Sigma BF technical info, and seen bunches of photos ... And I just don't get it at all. There's little that separates this camera from a dozen other 'mirrorless' (hate that moniker) cameras other than a reduction in menu items and a highly stylized (and to my eye, very uncomfortable to hold) body design.

I have no idea why I'd want one of these over a Leica M10, M10-R, or M10 Monochrom other than the difference in price. Is "low price" the altar at which people are worshiping this camera?

There are lots of excellent 'mirrorless' bodies on the market. I wouldn't buy any of them on price alone. I'm more intrigued by the BF's predecessor, the "fp", as it is much more plainly, honestly, a compact technical camera designed to be handled and used, added to, etc. Fancy styling is silly when it comes to a camera...

G

"I'd rather spend my time looking through a camera than looking at one."

If you evaluate the BF based on specs, I can see not being impressed. The magic is in how they implemented things, it works with an easy flow that never intrudes into what you are doing. Everything you need and nothing you don’t. The UX is genius.

I needed to put an aftermarket grip on mine only because arthritis makes the size of the “pinch” needed to hold the camera painful.