J8M 50/2 LTM, OK on M2?

[mike goldberg]

Hi... The general consensus seems to be...
One can use a Jupiter 8M 50/2 LTM with Adapter,
on a Leica M-mount camera with no problems.
QUESTION: Please confirm this... or be specific
if any shimming is needed.
Thanks, mike

 

[Jocko]

Well, Mike, obviously there are variations between individual lenses. However, having tested about a dozen assorted Soviet standard lenses on Leica and Bessa cameras, I have found that at close focus there are usually some issues. Focus may typically be 8-12 cm out (and sometimes significantly more), much as Dante Stella suggests. A fairly slow lens like the I-61 will absorb much of the error in DOF, but a fast lens, wide open will show the problem.

For this reason many people adjust the lenses for use on Leicas, Bessas etc. Others doubtless have no trouble. Much depends on the individual lens, but my hunch is that most J-8s would require some adjustment for complete accuracy.

Cheers, Ian

 

[mike goldberg]

Options-options-options...
Thanks you guys. The above being said,
would I be better off with Industar-61 LD 53/2.8?
Some say that the I-61 is too sharp & contrasty

 

[mrtoml]

I have found that at close focus there are usually some issues. Focus may typically be 8-12 cm out (and sometimes significantly more), much as Dante Stella suggests. A fairly slow lens like the I-61 will absorb much of the error in DOF, but a fast lens, wide open will show the problem.


Cheers, Ian

I had this problem with a J8 and Bessa R I bought used. In the end I tested the lens and found it focussed about 6" behind where it was supposed to at objects about 6 feet away. Stopped down it is supposed to be OK, but I was never happy with it and just bought a Nokton instead. Much happier now. I found the lens was too soft for me anyway even at f4. Some people say they get great results when they get a good copy. I also didn't like the fact that the aperture ring and focus ring rotate together.

Spyderman here on RFF knows a lot about this stuff. He helped a lot. The thread is here:

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33874

Scroll down to post 10 onwards.

 

[Kim Coxon]

The worst lenses seem to be the J3 and J9s. Nearly all of these will need some form of adjustment unless you are very lucky. I have had very few problems with the J8s. Most seem to be OK apart from needing the Yak Spit grease replacing. A few have been out but most of those showed signs of having been tampered with in the past.

Kim

 

[Jocko]

Well Mike, I like the I-61, which was my lens of choice for many years - but it doesn't win prizes for "bokeh" 🙂 I would do as Brian suggests and see how you get on with a J-8, given a minor tweak may make all well: his is the voice of knowledge!

The alternative (which inevitably costs more) would be to look elsewhere - say a Canon 1.8. To be honest, I tend to avoid Soviet lenses, having learnt not to trust my abilities as an adjuster!

Cheers, Ian

 

[Xmas]

Mike

Get the cheapest in good condition one you can get.

Brian and Ian are telling you at f2 and 3 feet you will (probably) detectably back focus becuase the FSU standardised its optics on the Nikon focal length rather then the Leitz focal length. The I-61 should have the same problem.

If you are in the Holy Land you will be at /125 and f/11 and wont notice this. The J8 will be better lens most of the time for you.

Brian is an artist at fixing lenses, like HCB was at candids, more difficult for thee and me I think...

Noel

 

[mike goldberg]

OK... it's all more clear now, friends, and 'bokeh' IS important to me, as well.
Having had great luck with my first Jupiter, a J8M 53/2 on my Kiev, I'm going to
stay with Jupiter. The investment is very low cost.
When I have said lens and run tests, we can go from there.
Thanks & ciao,
mike

 

[Kim Coxon]

I think the jury is still out on this one. It has been said that the Jupiter designs cames from the Zeiss factory and were therefore based on the Contax standard which is very slightly longer than the Leica one. (I am not sure that Nikon has ever been involved before 😉 )

However, in most cases there has been a great deal of kitchen surgery done on much of the kit sold. If all the lenses were out the same amount, I could support the theory. However, having done about 15 J9s, they were all slightly different (in some cases very different 😱 ) A while ago, I had 2 brand new (old stock) J3s from a seller in Siberia. Both of these matched the Leica standard perfectly out of the "tub". Both are now with other RFF members.

Quality control?, kitchen surgery? or different standard? I really don't know and I don't think it will ever be fully answered unless some paperwork emerges from out of the old factory to support the differing standards theory.

Kim

Mike

Brian and Ian are telling you at f2 and 3 feet you will (probably) detectably back focus becuase the FSU standardised its optics on the Nikon focal length rather then the Leitz focal length. The I-61 should have the same problem.

 

[mike_j]

Does anyone have pictures posted taken with J-8's in LTM? Shimmed vs original?

Here is a scanned pic using Bessa R2, generic adaptor and J8, taken from my test film when I first got the Bessa. Warning 16MB


http://tinyurl.com/2436k5

 

[Xmas]

Kim

Keybard transcription errr I ment to type 'Contax' instead of 'Nikon' well spotted, I was hoping no one would notice. My LTM J8 is nearly ok on Ms/IIIC. And we have no provenance for any lenses unless you have bought one new in UK in 70s. If I drop a J8 in canal it is not a Greek tragedy.

As well look at the latest 1.5 Zeiss Sonnar saga of focus shift with new lenses. My recomendation was to try it as the sun is bright in holy land, A J8 can be had really cheap and some are really stellar performers.

If it needs a shim some one can shim it.

Noel

 

[Graybeard]

The J-8 is one of the Russian lenses that is generally in good condition and need not be shimmed or adjusted (the J-12 is the other Russian lens that tends to be in good shape). The J-9 and J-3 can be nightmares, it is these you may be thinking of concerning focus problems.

The J-8's are inexpensive and the odds are in your favor for getting a decent lens. It seems to be worth the risk unless the asking price is really wild.

 

[Santafecino]

You should know that the earlier (silver) J8s had a nonrotating mount--the f-stop marker stays at top center. The later improved (?) black J8 has a rotating mount--you have to keep looking for the f-stop mark as the focus changes. To me, this is not progress, and I'm baffled why they did that. You wouldn't want to use a rectangular lens shade with the rotating mount version.

I have an earlier version that I use as my basic 50mm on a CL. It seems to focus well out of the box, but I'm going to have it scrutinized and shimmed one of these days.