Cheap film rangefinder for street photography

Trius, I scrolled thread all the way down in order to make sure you already advised Oly 35SP :) I second.
good kiev with /J8/J12/J9 will deliver excelent results. It's just not as quick in use as 35sp and other mentioned 35 fixed lens rangefinders.
 
You mentioned you like fast film as well as fast lenses. The older camera's here will only have meters that go to ISO 800 or so. Some can be used in manual mode, but ones like the canonet QL17 will lose the meter when you turn to manual. The XA is great, but doesn't go beyond ISO 800 and there's no manual over-ride.

Whereas a Zorki or a Kiev has no meter, so you can use whatever film you like; Ilford Delta 3200 is nice for night work. No mercury batteries to worry about, in fact there are no batteries at all to worry about. And if push comes to shove late night in Nottingham, you can always use it as a weapon! Hopefully not, though...
 
If you want to go wide, look for a Yashica Electro 35 CC -- similar build and metering to the GSN, but with a 35mm f/1.8 lens, instead of the 45 f/1.7 on the G series. However, none of the Yashicas (or the Canonet, IIRC) will do metered-manual mode. That means you either shoot aperture priority auto, or you rely on an external meter (or just guess).

Another option might be to look for a good deal on an Olympus SP. They're a bit more expensive than the Yashicas, but more or less on par with the Canonet, and support metered-manual as well as full-auto exposure. They also have spot metering, which almost no other fixed-lens rangefinders that I know of do.
 
However, none of the Yashicas (or the Canonet, IIRC) will do metered-manual mode. That means you either shoot aperture priority auto, or you rely on an external meter (or just guess).

The Yashica Lynx series is fully manual
 
I really like the look of the wide GSN (35mm), from what can see it goes up to 1000 ISO. Will it meter whilst shooting manually? I am used to shooting manual and keeping an eye on the light meter. If not what sort of camera will allow this?

I checked out the Oly 35 Sp seems fine, how does it compare?

I understand I am trying very quickly to understand 30 years or more of rangefinders for what is essentially a common useage type and that everyone will have opinions and favorites. I presume i couldnt really go wrong with most of the suggestions here, so thanks!

Cheers

Toby
 
You can not shoot manually with the GSN. You set the aperture and the iso and the camera chooses the shutter speed.
Again, check out the Yashica lynx series for fully manual control
 
It will be worth your time to read this page, along with some of the pages linked from it: --> http://www.cameraquest.com/com35s.htm

Also, although a lot of those that people have mentioned are nice cameras, very few of them have what I'd call a wide lens.

The Yashica 35CC and Olympus XA are the only ones, I think. You're right to look for wide too, as wide is often more useful for street photography. You can only back up so far, but you can usually get closer. Close-up portraits will be better with the normal lenses in the 40-50mm range.

I've got a Yashica GS (pre-N) and an Olympus XA, and although they are both semi-automatic rangefinders, they are worlds apart in terms of handling. Focusing the XA can be a bit fiddly, and the finder's not as easy to use. But it shows you shutter speed and gives you a true 35mm wide angle lens, aperture priority with a switch for +1.5 stop overexposure. It only has an f/2.8 lens, as opposed to the Yashica's f/1.7. The XA, although nice, seems like more of a primitive point & shoot than an old-school rangefinder.

Anyhow, if you look at that link above, 95% of them are 40mm or longer lenses.

If you're going to settle for a non-wide lens, look for an Olympus SP, RD, Canonet QIII, Minolta 7sII. Most of them are shutter priority with manual override, but the light meter doesn't work in manual mode, so you have to meter in shutter-priority, then switch to manual and readust.

So... how badly do you want it to be a rangefinder? :)

Another option would be a smallish SLR, such as an Olympus OM1n or Pentax ME Super, or MX with a fixed 28 or 35mm lens. Then, you'd have the best of all worlds, except for the super-quiet shutter. They're a little harder to hide in a jacket too, but very versatile. Oh, and you wouldn't have a < f/2 lens either. It'd most likely be f/2.8.

After all that, if it has to be an inexpensive but high quality rangefinder, I'd go with some sort of Yashica Electro 35 (GS, GSN, etc.) That is a big one, bigger than many SLRs. For a small one, Olympus RC or similar as described on cameraquest.

If you really want the wide angle and can give up the rangefinder bit, a Pentax MX with a 28 f/2.8 would be a nice kit.
 
OH! I nearly forgot the best one, Rollei 35! But you won't get a working one for 50 quid. (by quid, you mean GBP, right?) More like 150. Nothing mentioned to this point has as much character as a Rollei 35. It is mechanical & manual exposure only. The lens is top-notch, though they only get as fast as f/2.8.
 
Regarding metered manual mode and the Canonet QL17 GIII, you can put the camera in auto mode to take a meter reading and then set the camera manually using simple reciprocity.

Another camera to consider for low-cost street shooting, particularly if one likes a physically larger camera, is the Konica Auto S2. Will cost less to buy, has a wonderfully sharp lens, has a meter display on top of the camera (which makes setting the camera less conspicuous), comes with a real leather case, etc.

-Randy
 
Another idea: find a clean, used Canon 28mm f/2.8 for your 350D, and if you don't like the style of shooting, at least you'd have a top wide angle lens for your current rig. The 350D is about the same size as a Canonet, but the lens protrudes more.
 
Avotius' reference to the those shots makes a really strong case for the GSN, of course. Of all the other fixed lens RFs with a similar focal length, that is the one I would like to have. It is, however, bigger and heavier than my SPs. That is purely personal preference, of course. I'm not a big person, but my hands are good sized. I think the GSN is about the same size/weight as my Olympus LC, and I can tell you that if I had to give up one of the LC or the SP, the LC would go, even though it has a couple of features I wish were on the SP.

Mike makes a great point about the ISO capabilities of the older RFs. It is one of the other gripes I have about the SP, but of course it's not fair since when the SP, GSN, etc., were manufactured, box-rating of 800 was about as high as you could get.

I often shoot faster film than 800 in the 35SP, using the metered manual mode and compensating. With the EV metering system, it's quite easy. Any camera that has EV metering is easier to use in this respect, IMO.
 
rcoder said:
If you want to go wide, look for a Yashica Electro 35 CC -- similar build and metering to the GSN, but with a 35mm f/1.8 lens, instead of the 45 f/1.7 on the G series. However, none of the Yashicas (or the Canonet, IIRC) will do metered-manual mode. That means you either shoot aperture priority auto, or you rely on an external meter (or just guess).

Another option might be to look for a good deal on an Olympus SP. They're a bit more expensive than the Yashicas, but more or less on par with the Canonet, and support metered-manual as well as full-auto exposure. They also have spot metering, which almost no other fixed-lens rangefinders that I know of do.
Click to expand...

This question of metering is not really a problem. You put the camera on A to meter, and then you set the aperture and shutter manually. There is no need to be constantly metering in manual. If you notice the lighting changes significantly then meter again.

Olympus cameras like the SP are just as good but more expensive. The QL17 giii is a great value for the prices you find them at.
 
Agreed that the QL17 GIII is a great value. It has moving framelines for parallax, which the SP doesn't. Not that that is a big deal for street work.
 
Gosh this is a bit of a minefield. I didn't realise the GSN was quite so large, I was hoping to get something pretty small and inconspicouse (reason I chose rangefinder rather than my present SLR) I have a 30mm 1.4 for my SLR which is equivalent to 50mm in real terms. I would like something a little wider.

I think I will need to do some further research and pop into a camera shop (the old boys there will have a camera I can try out to get feel of size and useablity)

Thanks again for the deluge of informative posts!

toby
 
Olympus 35 SP is a highly competent fixed lens RF that is certainly reacheable within the $100/ 100 euro range, if not lower if you are patient.
 
Toby: I have never had a problem with the XA with regard to it being only auto and battery-dependent. It takes SR44W silver oxide batteries, so you need to "be prepared" in case you lose power. Those are very small and light batteries, so it's no big deal. With the 35mm focal length, you'll get what you're looking for in that department. You'd also get that with the Yashica 35CC which, while larger, has a faster lens and is easier for some to handle. The XA is tiny, and some find the shutter release to be "hair trigger". And the rangefinder patch on the XA may not be as contrasty as the Yashica.

Wider than 35mm, you won't find many fixed RFs, and what you do find will be far more expensive. You're really into 28mm or wider on an interchangeable lens body at that point.

The Olympus 35SP has a 42mm focal length, and I find that, for me, to be a nearly perfect balance between 50mm "normal" and 35mm "mildly wide". Other cameras such as the Canonet have a 40mm lens.

The Olympus 35RD has 40mm f/1.8 and would fit the bill nicely. But it is not in the $100E price range, at least if you get one that has been serviced. An RD without servicing will invariably have sticky shutter blades, as the original lubricant gums up over time. I have never heard of an original RD with original lubricant with an accurately functioning shutter. A proper CLA for an RD will run about $100USD once shipping is considered, perhaps a bit more with VAT.

The only "drawback" to the RD is that the meter is not active in manual mode, only in automatic, as with the Canonet, the Olympus RC, etc.
 
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