Nando
Well-known
Hello,
I've been wanting to get a 300mm lens for my Pentax for a while now. I live in an area where there are many scenic farms (some abandoned) in the countryside but I can only photograph most of them from afar. I would also like to try photographing birds and other wildlife. I do have a 500/8 mirror lens but I do not like the harsh bokeh it produces.
I've been thinking of going into medium-format with Arax Photo's modified version of the Kiev-88 plus some CZJ lenses once I get my dark room set up. I was thinking of killing two birds with one stone by purchasing a CZJ 300/4 Sonnar in Pentacon-Six mount with an adaptor for use with my Pentax. I could then use the lens with both systems.
So, is this a good idea? Does anybody have any experience with Arax Photo or the CZJ 300/4? I've seen many great things written about Arax Photo's service but not very much written on their actual product. I'm also finding that there is very little information on the 300 Sonnar so I would greatly value anything that you may share with me.
Thanks.
I've been wanting to get a 300mm lens for my Pentax for a while now. I live in an area where there are many scenic farms (some abandoned) in the countryside but I can only photograph most of them from afar. I would also like to try photographing birds and other wildlife. I do have a 500/8 mirror lens but I do not like the harsh bokeh it produces.
I've been thinking of going into medium-format with Arax Photo's modified version of the Kiev-88 plus some CZJ lenses once I get my dark room set up. I was thinking of killing two birds with one stone by purchasing a CZJ 300/4 Sonnar in Pentacon-Six mount with an adaptor for use with my Pentax. I could then use the lens with both systems.
So, is this a good idea? Does anybody have any experience with Arax Photo or the CZJ 300/4? I've seen many great things written about Arax Photo's service but not very much written on their actual product. I'm also finding that there is very little information on the 300 Sonnar so I would greatly value anything that you may share with me.
Thanks.
rbiemer
Unabashed Amateur
Fernando,
I have an Arax 60 and can only say that dealing with Arax was an absolute pleasure. I chose the 60 instead of the 88 because I decided that the 60 was going to be less troublesome. Don't have any CZJ lenses so I have no opinion there.
Rob
I have an Arax 60 and can only say that dealing with Arax was an absolute pleasure. I chose the 60 instead of the 88 because I decided that the 60 was going to be less troublesome. Don't have any CZJ lenses so I have no opinion there.
Rob
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
I have good experience with Arax Photo, they have done a couple of repairs and tuneups for me, I've bought a few lenses from them and met Gevorg Vartanyan in Kiev two times.
I'm not sure whether your medium format plans are such a good idea at the moment. Firstly, the 300/4 Sonnar is a good lens, but on the Pentax you can only use it with stopdown metering; I'm not sure if that is a problem for you.
Secondly, I am somewhat hesitant to recommend buying a new Kiev 88 to anyone. I have one, a good-quality 1985 body that has seen an overhaul from Arax that I use extensively, and it is quite a capricious beast with quirks that require handling with care. Back when Western and Japanese medium format SLRs were expensive, I could see the rationale behind getting one (I bought mine four years ago for 150 USD). However, spending 500-something Euros now on a Kiev is more money than it is worth IMHO. Yes, you get warranty, but do you always want to send your camera to the Ukraine if there is a light leak?
If you want a "cube" type camera, I think spending the same amount on a used 645 camera outfit from Mamiya or Pentax makes more sense, these are definitely the better cameras. You can use the Sonnar with an adapter. (Stopdown aperture again, though.) If you want a low-cost camera, the Kiev 60 is the better option IMHO, as it is far less complex and much more robust. You don't get interchangeable backs (I use them much less than I thought, though). And it is a rather big camera, but with a 300mm lens it probably feels just right
I'm not sure whether your medium format plans are such a good idea at the moment. Firstly, the 300/4 Sonnar is a good lens, but on the Pentax you can only use it with stopdown metering; I'm not sure if that is a problem for you.
Secondly, I am somewhat hesitant to recommend buying a new Kiev 88 to anyone. I have one, a good-quality 1985 body that has seen an overhaul from Arax that I use extensively, and it is quite a capricious beast with quirks that require handling with care. Back when Western and Japanese medium format SLRs were expensive, I could see the rationale behind getting one (I bought mine four years ago for 150 USD). However, spending 500-something Euros now on a Kiev is more money than it is worth IMHO. Yes, you get warranty, but do you always want to send your camera to the Ukraine if there is a light leak?
If you want a "cube" type camera, I think spending the same amount on a used 645 camera outfit from Mamiya or Pentax makes more sense, these are definitely the better cameras. You can use the Sonnar with an adapter. (Stopdown aperture again, though.) If you want a low-cost camera, the Kiev 60 is the better option IMHO, as it is far less complex and much more robust. You don't get interchangeable backs (I use them much less than I thought, though). And it is a rather big camera, but with a 300mm lens it probably feels just right
Nando
Well-known
Thanks guys. I didn't realize that mf cameras the like Pentaxes and Mamiyas have come down in price. I also spotted a few Hassy outfits for just a few hundred dollars more than the similar Arax. I have to rethink this. What attracted me to the Arax was that it was a modular system and that it would accept the CZJ lenses. It's also a very nice looking camera to boot. I'll be considering the Arax 60 and a Pentacon-Six too.
As for the 300 Sonnar, it still seems like a nice bargain. It is really heavy but it looks very well made. I've been trying to find a nice Pentax K, A or M 300/4 lens for the past few months but the one's I've seen have not been in great shape. The ones that were in nice condition were priced above a CZJ 300 Sonnar in similar condition. I don't mind stop-down metering. Although the meter in my Pentax MX is pretty accurate, I prefer to use an external incident meter whenever possible.
As for the 300 Sonnar, it still seems like a nice bargain. It is really heavy but it looks very well made. I've been trying to find a nice Pentax K, A or M 300/4 lens for the past few months but the one's I've seen have not been in great shape. The ones that were in nice condition were priced above a CZJ 300 Sonnar in similar condition. I don't mind stop-down metering. Although the meter in my Pentax MX is pretty accurate, I prefer to use an external incident meter whenever possible.
R
rich815
Guest
"...but I can only photograph most of them from afar."
A 300mm lens for 6x6 is not going to get you all that close. Certainly closer than a standard 80 lens or so but you realize that the 300mm will only be about the equivalent of a 150mm or so on a 35mm camera.
A 300mm lens for 6x6 is not going to get you all that close. Certainly closer than a standard 80 lens or so but you realize that the 300mm will only be about the equivalent of a 150mm or so on a 35mm camera.
rxmd
May contain traces of nut
Hi Nando,
A few extra considerations on this:Nando said:
- The Hasselblad is a fine camera, but lenses are expensive and there is no adapter for CZJ lenses. For the 500 series there can't be any adapter, because they have leaf shutters in the lens and no shutter in the body. Shutterless CZJ lenses don't work at all. For the 200 series with their focal plane shutters it is theoretically possible to have the lenses adapted; there was a Japanese guy on the Kiev Report forum who had a Chinese repairman convert some lenses to Hasselblad mount. It's permanent surgery, though, and not many mechanics can or would do that.
- There are adapters for most 6x45 camera systems to accept CZJ lenses (just as there are for 35mm systems). Arax actually sells most of them, you can check in their price list which systems work. Stopdown metering with all of those. I think I read about an adapter for Mamiya 645 somewhere that allowed open-aperture metering, but I don't find it now and in all probability I'm mistaken. I think the best medium format option for you would be some flavour of Mamiya 645, as it also offers a good and not overly expensive lens range including portrait lenses with extra leaf shutters for fill-in flash, and the cameras are relatively compact.
- The Kiev 60 is supposedly a lot more robust than the Pentacon Six and has other conveniences, such as a much better film transport and a finder that shows more than the ca. 60 percent of the frame that the P6 does. It's cheaper, too. I wouldn't go for an original Pentacon Six.
- A 300 mm lens on medium format doesn't get you that far (or close). The usual conversion factor is 1 to 1.6 for cropping from a 6x6 frame, so you get approximately the field of view of an 180mm lens on 35mm. For wildlife photography this might not be enough. However, there is a Pentacon 500/f5.6 lens, too. (With this lens you don't lose anything by putting it on an adapter, as it only offers stop-down metering anyway; it's rather big, though) And there is a rather rare Arsat 500/f5.6 APO lens that surfaces on eBay now and then and that has a good reputation, but might be somewhat costly. For an overview and tests of Pentacon Six lenses, see http://www.pentaconsix.com.
Nando
Well-known
Philipp,
Thank you very much for your time and help. Those are all great points which I will take in consideration.
Rich,
I will be using the lens primarily with the Pentax, of course. I also got a quality Vivitar 7-element teleconverter that will yield 600mm on the Pentax if necessary. Later I would like to try MF so I thought that getting a CZJ lens in Pentacon-Six mount might be a good idea as I would be able to using with both systems.
It is good to know that there are adapters available to use CZJ lenses on many cameras. I'm thinking of purchasing the 300/4 very soon but I would like to wait on purchasing a MF camera until after the summer. This should give me ample time to decide what camera is best for me.
Thank you very much for your time and help. Those are all great points which I will take in consideration.
Rich,
I will be using the lens primarily with the Pentax, of course. I also got a quality Vivitar 7-element teleconverter that will yield 600mm on the Pentax if necessary. Later I would like to try MF so I thought that getting a CZJ lens in Pentacon-Six mount might be a good idea as I would be able to using with both systems.
It is good to know that there are adapters available to use CZJ lenses on many cameras. I'm thinking of purchasing the 300/4 very soon but I would like to wait on purchasing a MF camera until after the summer. This should give me ample time to decide what camera is best for me.
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dostacos
Dan
I set my 60 to Arax for adjustments and converting to all black, I also have bought lenses from ARAX always an easy transaction, NOT FAST but easy. It does take awhile for shipping