Dwayneb9584
Well-known
Hey all,
Just wanted to know if anyone on here has an agent or rep. And how to go about getting one. Is it a good idea to make a small portfolio book like say a 8x5.5 from adorama books that I can send to agencies by mail or drop off myself. Just curious in what steps you all took or the best path to walk down.
Thanks
Just wanted to know if anyone on here has an agent or rep. And how to go about getting one. Is it a good idea to make a small portfolio book like say a 8x5.5 from adorama books that I can send to agencies by mail or drop off myself. Just curious in what steps you all took or the best path to walk down.
Thanks
Frank Petronio
Well-known
First, realize that this is probably the least likely place to ask and get a relevant response... try to find a forum aimed at working professional photographers than may possibly have a rep. Try Photo District News, A Photo Editor, What's the Jackonory? to start... SPAR is the (USA) national rep organization.
Short answer: you need to already have good real clients to get a real representative. They won't just rep you based on photos, you have to prove yourself by already getting jobs.
A rep doesn't unburden you from marketing and business operations. Instead, getting to the point where you have one only amplifies those aspects.
Short answer: you need to already have good real clients to get a real representative. They won't just rep you based on photos, you have to prove yourself by already getting jobs.
A rep doesn't unburden you from marketing and business operations. Instead, getting to the point where you have one only amplifies those aspects.
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Dwayneb9584
Well-known
Thanks Frank. That pretty much summed it up.
emraphoto
Veteran
What sort of work do you do?
swoop
Well-known
An agent will help you sell more work, but you already have to be working for you to be worth their time and effort.
Dwayneb9584
Well-known
Well when I do work for clients I'm recognized more for a Lifestyle, fashion/Style, Portraiture, and documentary. I developed this range through my personal work that I shoot. When every it happens it happens I guess. I'm not on the hunt for any of them, I was just curious.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
On the subject of agents: to quote a publisher friend (i.e. from the buyer's side of the fence), "They're all worthless parasites." An overstatement, no doubt -- there certainly are good ones -- but along the lines of "It's a shame that 90% of xxxxs get the other 10% a bad name."
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
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x-ray
Veteran
I don't have a rep for my commercial work but do have one for my art (x-ray art). In every case the reps have found me one way or another. The commercial reps have never worked out mainly because they want a piece of my work that I allready had before they came along or they wanted too high a percentage of the job. My art rep in NYC found me through a magazine article. I've had him for about six years and he's made a good bit of money for me. He's had my work in three major feature length movies and commission work plus gallery sales across the country. I just completed and shipped a commission for a new Sands property in Singapore that he worked on getting for over a year. He takes 50% but is worth every penny.
Paul T.
Veteran
Well, that's quite possibly because some publishers prefer to deal with agent-less contributors because they can get away with lousy contracts.
I had a book deal a few years ago, negotiated without an agent, with a reputable, small publisher. I never finished the book. My current agent persuaded me to re-start it. For his 15% he got me exactly 24 times as much money as for the original deal.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Indeed, this possibility cannot be neglected. On the other hand, there are decent publishers, just as there are decent agents. Shame about the other 90%...
Cheers,
R.
Jamie123
Veteran
Disregard Roger's comment. It's nonsense.
As far as reps go I think they serve three basic functions. 1) Negotiation/selling, 2) production and 3)promotion.
I list promotion third as just because you have someone who shows your book to a couple of art buyers and ADs every month doesn't mean you don't have to do your own promos and hunting for jobs yourself.
If you start picking up big jobs it can be really useful to have someone do the production for you (creating estimates, renting the studio and equipment, hiring a MUA and a stylist, renting props, getting insurance, taking care of the catering, creating call sheets, booking flights etc. etc.).
Negotiation and selling is another advantage of having an agent. A good agent knows how to get the most out of a job and if you're not good at negotiating this might be a big advantage but only if you think an agent can do more than 20-30% better than you.
Personally, I'm far from being at a point in my career where I could even consider an agent. That being said, I did intern at an agency for a while so I do have some insight to what a (good) agency does.
As far as reps go I think they serve three basic functions. 1) Negotiation/selling, 2) production and 3)promotion.
I list promotion third as just because you have someone who shows your book to a couple of art buyers and ADs every month doesn't mean you don't have to do your own promos and hunting for jobs yourself.
If you start picking up big jobs it can be really useful to have someone do the production for you (creating estimates, renting the studio and equipment, hiring a MUA and a stylist, renting props, getting insurance, taking care of the catering, creating call sheets, booking flights etc. etc.).
Negotiation and selling is another advantage of having an agent. A good agent knows how to get the most out of a job and if you're not good at negotiating this might be a big advantage but only if you think an agent can do more than 20-30% better than you.
Personally, I'm far from being at a point in my career where I could even consider an agent. That being said, I did intern at an agency for a while so I do have some insight to what a (good) agency does.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
This from someone who is "far from being at a point in my career where I could even consider an agent," but who worked (presumably for nothing) for an agent...
No, don't disregard it. Just take it as (maybe) out of date and (maybe) from an unscrupulous publisher, and keep it in mind when dealing with (a) agents and (b) buyers. And, come to think of it, (c) other photographers.
Cheers,
R.
Jamie123
Veteran
By the way, towards the end of my internship I got to produce a couple of jobs and negotiate some fees. We had an inquiry from a brewery in another country asking for a photographer to do some pictures on their premises for a brochure (architecture and lifestyle stuff). It was not a job for the agency's high end roster but they had a non-exclusive contract with a photographer in that region. We called the photographer and asked what his rate was. He quoted $1500/day including equipment and assistant. I created an estimate of $15'000 for a 3 day shoot with full rights buyout and they accepted. So even with the agency's 30% commission that still was $10'000 for the photographer instead of $4'500
Jamie123
Veteran
Yes, Roger, it was complete and utter BS. Sorry but it's true. Most of the time I appreciate your posts but you have this habit of posting wise-ass "quotes" that add nothing whatsoever to the conversation.
As for your personal attacks, yes I did do an internship at a large agency for little financial compensation and from that I gained a little insight into the workings of an agency but I'm far from knowing much or claiming to do so. I do think, tough, that I have more useful information to give than quoting some "publisher friend" who says they're all "worthless parasites".
And I also know a little about the photographer's side of the agent/photographer relationship from working for several photographers as an assistant.
If you have something useful to contribute I'm sure we'd all be happy to hear it but please do us a favor and stop dropping these inane one-liners.
Piewacket
Established
Well, I do have a rep and have pretty much always had one since I started working 20+ years ago. You do either need to be somewhat established or wildly talented for a rep to take you on. There are many more photographers than agents and it does involve an investment of time and money so it is not easy when you are starting out.
Depending on your area and market it also may not be needed... I do agree as Jamie said, you still have to continue your own promotion efforts.
It is also a little like a marriage and if the two of you are not in sync it can be rocky. I have had some good ones and some lousy ones but in the process, I have learned a lot.
There was a day when you could not get your foot in the door without one but I believe times have changed in that regard and many creatives do not mind, may even prefer dealing with the talent directly.
Most photo reps will want 25%-30% of your fees, sometimes less for editorial. I actually handle my own editorial, there is no negotiating involved and most come to me directly.
Some will expect you to commit to agency promotions and may want a piece of your existing client roster...
If you are in a smaller market but busy, you might consider looking for a good studio manager you can train to be a house rep. Offering a good commission (I would say at least 15 or 20 percent) and help groom them into what you need.
I think you really need a rep when you are so busy that you can not devote the time needed to promote your work and land new clients ...
or
You have a lot of interest in your work but you are clueless at negotiating and promoting..still you need to learn, pay attention and force yourself to become business savvy. I made the mistake early in my career of relying too much on my reps and gotten take advantage of more than once.
or
If you are in an extremely competitive market (NYC for example) and have built up a decent client base and are ready to take it to the next level.
Hope that helps!
Depending on your area and market it also may not be needed... I do agree as Jamie said, you still have to continue your own promotion efforts.
It is also a little like a marriage and if the two of you are not in sync it can be rocky. I have had some good ones and some lousy ones but in the process, I have learned a lot.
There was a day when you could not get your foot in the door without one but I believe times have changed in that regard and many creatives do not mind, may even prefer dealing with the talent directly.
Most photo reps will want 25%-30% of your fees, sometimes less for editorial. I actually handle my own editorial, there is no negotiating involved and most come to me directly.
Some will expect you to commit to agency promotions and may want a piece of your existing client roster...
If you are in a smaller market but busy, you might consider looking for a good studio manager you can train to be a house rep. Offering a good commission (I would say at least 15 or 20 percent) and help groom them into what you need.
I think you really need a rep when you are so busy that you can not devote the time needed to promote your work and land new clients ...
or
You have a lot of interest in your work but you are clueless at negotiating and promoting..still you need to learn, pay attention and force yourself to become business savvy. I made the mistake early in my career of relying too much on my reps and gotten take advantage of more than once.
or
If you are in an extremely competitive market (NYC for example) and have built up a decent client base and are ready to take it to the next level.
Hope that helps!
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Dwayneb9584
Well-known
Wow thanks all for the help. I actually was clueless as how it works but you all really put it down for me. Piewacket, thanks for the help. I noticed you were located in Atalanta. How is it out there as I was thinking about relocating from NYC for a good time. I have family in the Atlanta area and my options are open. I think it can be a good start to work in a smaller city. Can you shed some light on that?
Piewacket
Established
Sorry to be so slow to respond, I just saw your question. Atlanta is a pretty small market and a little limited because of that. I am actually planning to move back to Cali because of it. It can be a good place to start out if you're good at selling yourself and maybe want to assist a bit more.
The cost of living is pretty good and that is a big plus. There are very few reps here but if you hustle, you can really work any where. There is very little editorial work here and that is the biggest downside for some one just starting out.
I would suggest you visit and make some appointments and show your books and see what kind of feedback you get. Also if you like the lifestyle. It is a car city, you must own one here, it is as important as owning a good camera! You would not be able to work without one, so that is something to consider. Good luck!
The cost of living is pretty good and that is a big plus. There are very few reps here but if you hustle, you can really work any where. There is very little editorial work here and that is the biggest downside for some one just starting out.
I would suggest you visit and make some appointments and show your books and see what kind of feedback you get. Also if you like the lifestyle. It is a car city, you must own one here, it is as important as owning a good camera! You would not be able to work without one, so that is something to consider. Good luck!