holgaguy
Established
I'm looking for opinions of the AGFA Isolette III
I want a budjet MF RF
holgaguy
I want a budjet MF RF
holgaguy
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Be on the lookout for Ansco Super Speedex. Same camera inside but branded by Ansco. Sometimes you can get one for cheaper just because it doesn't say Agfa on the label.
Looks like this:
Looks like this:
FallisPhoto
Veteran
holgaguy said:
If you're on a budget, look for the Ansco Speedex Special R. I've picked two of them up on ebay for about $15 each over the last two months. Unlike the Super Speedex, it is exactly the same camera as the Agfa Isolette III, but is branded Ansco instead. They look like this:
One thing: If you get it on ebay, expect to have to replace the bellows, clean the shutter and unstick the focus and the rangefinder. Agfa (who actually made both cameras) used this horrible grease that reacted with the brass, turned green and set up like concrete. Solvents won't touch it, but heat will make it soft enough to get the camera apart for cleaning. Unsticking the rangefinder isn't any great trick, but getting the front lens element out of the center element's ring so you can focus it is.
One other thing: When it comes time to replace the bellows, you don't have to spend a arm and a leg. There was this cheap POS 6x6 camera made by Kodak, the Kodak 66, that had a very well-made, and very durable, bellows. To get the bellows out, you just undo four screws and cut through the glue with an X-acto knife. It's easy.
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FallisPhoto
Veteran
shadowfox said:Be on the lookout for Ansco Super Speedex. Same camera inside but branded by Ansco. Sometimes you can get one for cheaper just because it doesn't say Agfa on the label.
Looks like this:
To be technical, the Super Speedex is a rebranded Super Isolette, not an Isolette III. The Speedex Special R is the rebranded Isolette III.
chippy
foo was here
As FalisPhoto says unless already done in almost all cases you will need to fix the afore mentioned.
one other thing to remember is that the speedex special R lens and rangefinder will read in (imperial measurements) feet while many isolettes will be in (metric) meters. if your do not want to have convert or become acostomed to gauging the distance (tho easy) it may influence your choice.
but just my opinion on use... they are a good camera for an uncoupled rangefinder camera (once all is fixed). they feel good in the hand, size is good and feel light but still solid enough, fit in your pocket without sharp edges. quick and easy to operate. personaly i prefer the solinar as most do but they are more expensive (maybe not budget anymore) and the later models with the S/Compur EV scale shutters (aperature linked to shutter speed dial with exposure values engraved). once your used to using EV scales it is quick and easy to use without a light meter.
the super speedex is the creme' de la creme' and a different camera as falis says
one other thing to remember is that the speedex special R lens and rangefinder will read in (imperial measurements) feet while many isolettes will be in (metric) meters. if your do not want to have convert or become acostomed to gauging the distance (tho easy) it may influence your choice.
but just my opinion on use... they are a good camera for an uncoupled rangefinder camera (once all is fixed). they feel good in the hand, size is good and feel light but still solid enough, fit in your pocket without sharp edges. quick and easy to operate. personaly i prefer the solinar as most do but they are more expensive (maybe not budget anymore) and the later models with the S/Compur EV scale shutters (aperature linked to shutter speed dial with exposure values engraved). once your used to using EV scales it is quick and easy to use without a light meter.
the super speedex is the creme' de la creme' and a different camera as falis says
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
FallisPhoto said:
Yes, you're right of course.
To me, the rarer Super (whatever) is worth hunting for because of their coupled rangefinder and no red windows. Does the Isolette III still use red windows?
FallisPhoto
Veteran
shadowfox said:
Yes the Agfa Isolette III (and Ansco Speedex Special R) both use red windows. Personally, I look at the coupled rangefinder as a BIG plus, but I look at the red windows as a very small plus. I've had several cameras, of different makes, with broken frame counters. The red windows are at least extremely reliable.
chippy
foo was here
some advantages I see of an isolette III over a Super are its lighter 620grams to 845grams for the super. its definately noticable
smaller ;approx 140mmx92mmx40mm against 155mmx105mmx50, whilst it may seem only slightly bigger reading the measurments, in the hand it is easily noticable. the super i always carry with its case where as the Iso III can be carried in the coat pocket, actually it fits in a jeans pocket with some difficulty
cheaper by a long way; even paying top dollar for a fully restored Iso III spec with solinar S/Compur with EV will cost around half that of the super Isolette
a lower spec Isolette III is even a cheaper way to put a 6x6 neg in your pocket.
less mechanicals than the super so less that can go wrong.
which do i prefer; hands down the super speedex/isolette because i prefer coupled rangefinder and the wind on system of the super. also nowadays if i want to put 6x6 in my pocket i usualy pick up my perkeo 2 or E only because they are smaller again. having said that, i gave an Iso III to my daughter and i often find myself saying to her 'here give me a go with that' and then proceed to use half the film haha...
smaller ;approx 140mmx92mmx40mm against 155mmx105mmx50, whilst it may seem only slightly bigger reading the measurments, in the hand it is easily noticable. the super i always carry with its case where as the Iso III can be carried in the coat pocket, actually it fits in a jeans pocket with some difficulty
cheaper by a long way; even paying top dollar for a fully restored Iso III spec with solinar S/Compur with EV will cost around half that of the super Isolette
a lower spec Isolette III is even a cheaper way to put a 6x6 neg in your pocket.
less mechanicals than the super so less that can go wrong.
which do i prefer; hands down the super speedex/isolette because i prefer coupled rangefinder and the wind on system of the super. also nowadays if i want to put 6x6 in my pocket i usualy pick up my perkeo 2 or E only because they are smaller again. having said that, i gave an Iso III to my daughter and i often find myself saying to her 'here give me a go with that' and then proceed to use half the film haha...
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Agreed, chippy. The Super Speedex that I have is a beaut. But it's also not small. For most, I find myself grabbing the old Bessa RF 
for not much more bulk, I got a gorgeous 6x9 pictures. Now that one uses red windows.
for not much more bulk, I got a gorgeous 6x9 pictures. Now that one uses red windows.
Borghesia
Well-known
The Isolette is excellent if it is in good shape. I have several MF systems, but the Isolette is so handy that it is always with me.
I am still looking for an Super Isolette, but that will only be something to have rather than something I need, 'cause my Isolette II with Solinar is a good performer. I think that what make a good Isolette picture is how you had your picture focussed precisely. I use my Isolette II with an additional rangefinder (Watameter deLuxe) , this device puts my Isolette II next to the III and the Super.
So if you want MF cheap, you also could consider an Isolette I/II with an RF.
I bought my Watameter DeLuxe for 6 euro's ! And it also give my Isolette that great mean look.
I am still looking for an Super Isolette, but that will only be something to have rather than something I need, 'cause my Isolette II with Solinar is a good performer. I think that what make a good Isolette picture is how you had your picture focussed precisely. I use my Isolette II with an additional rangefinder (Watameter deLuxe) , this device puts my Isolette II next to the III and the Super.
So if you want MF cheap, you also could consider an Isolette I/II with an RF.
I bought my Watameter DeLuxe for 6 euro's ! And it also give my Isolette that great mean look.
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whitecat
Lone Range(find)er
For people looking for one....try to get the Solinar lens. Said to be better than the Apothar. I have one and it is as sharp a tack.
Solinar
Analog Preferred
Hmmm, a budget medium format RF. I don't think that the Iso III with a later 75/3.5 Solinar fits that description, because they are kind of rare.
Get one with the bellows already replaced or plan on spending 50 bucks US, plus postage, to get a one from "camerabellows.com" - who are in the UK. They are an awesome outfit to business with.
Folder are slow and fiddly to shoot with, but I took a liking to Agfas, as they are easy for a do-it-yourselfer to repair - when needed.
I have the deluxe Super Iso clone - the Ansco Super Speedex - awesome but a bit larger/heavier than I prefer. Unlike the Isolette III, Super Isolette have bot coupled-rf focusing and an automat film advance - two features which make Super Isolette much faster to shoot with.
Folders should be light and pocketable. The Isolette III is that. With the front cell focusing Solinar 75/3.5 everything you shoot from 5 feet out should come out crisp. Closer in - you'll need to close the aperture a bit. The old school red window film advance and uncoupled RF will considerably slow you down between exposures - but it's a vintage folder.
Although, I have the Ansco Super Speedex, I used an Iso III Mark 2 version fitted with the 75/3.5 Solinar for a couple of years as an everyday carrier. I've since replaced it with a Record III, the same concept as the Iso III - but in 6x9. Now that camera gets a lot of use. The Record III is my most used folder.
A few comments about Voigtlander and Zeiss-Ikon. I've used both. I like the Voigtlanders better. When they need a CLA or repair - the high end Voigtlanders and ZI Super Ikonta line-up are definitely more tricky to dissassemble and recalibrate upon reassembly. You can count the Super Isolette in this group as well. - Other than that, they have a more luxurious build than either the Iso III or Record III.
Get one with the bellows already replaced or plan on spending 50 bucks US, plus postage, to get a one from "camerabellows.com" - who are in the UK. They are an awesome outfit to business with.
Folder are slow and fiddly to shoot with, but I took a liking to Agfas, as they are easy for a do-it-yourselfer to repair - when needed.
I have the deluxe Super Iso clone - the Ansco Super Speedex - awesome but a bit larger/heavier than I prefer. Unlike the Isolette III, Super Isolette have bot coupled-rf focusing and an automat film advance - two features which make Super Isolette much faster to shoot with.
Folders should be light and pocketable. The Isolette III is that. With the front cell focusing Solinar 75/3.5 everything you shoot from 5 feet out should come out crisp. Closer in - you'll need to close the aperture a bit. The old school red window film advance and uncoupled RF will considerably slow you down between exposures - but it's a vintage folder.
Although, I have the Ansco Super Speedex, I used an Iso III Mark 2 version fitted with the 75/3.5 Solinar for a couple of years as an everyday carrier. I've since replaced it with a Record III, the same concept as the Iso III - but in 6x9. Now that camera gets a lot of use. The Record III is my most used folder.
A few comments about Voigtlander and Zeiss-Ikon. I've used both. I like the Voigtlanders better. When they need a CLA or repair - the high end Voigtlanders and ZI Super Ikonta line-up are definitely more tricky to dissassemble and recalibrate upon reassembly. You can count the Super Isolette in this group as well. - Other than that, they have a more luxurious build than either the Iso III or Record III.
FallisPhoto
Veteran
whitecat said:
While I will agree that you should try to get the Solinar, it depends on the price. A Solinar isn't that much better and you can pay a lot more for it if you don't shop carefully. I've got cameras with both lenses and I would happily settle for an Apotar if there was a $50 or more difference. The Apotars are good lenses, among the best of the cooke triplets, and are very good with b&w film. The ones you really want to avoid are Agnars.
chippy
foo was here
what is budget anyway? it is subjective of course. it depends on your persective, how much you can afford and are willing to spend for the small differences and improvments in one model to next. it could easily be said that all 120 rangefinders models are good vaule and budget cameras.
i think the Super Iso/Speedex was about $130 w/case when released and depending on what formular you use that can equate to near $2000 if sold today. to pick one up today under $400 in good nick is not bad vaule for money!. the same applies to most folders. the agfa/ansco isolette and records are simply good bang for your buck. the low spec Iso and record III's are about as cheap as you are likely to find an uncoupled rangefinder and were as cheap as you could find when released as well...so if we are talking what is the cheapest then they will win pretty much hands down every time...if your talking build quality then well....thats a different story...
unless one wants a particular feature, maybe a tessar type lens! or better shutter in which case a solinar Iso is still a budget camera compared to some super ikontas or voitlanders in reasonable condition.
its all swings and roundabouts as shadowfox points out the Bessa RF is a camera he prefers and i think good vaule and near the same vaule as isolette and records depending on features and condition (and luck!). Is there other any coupled rangefinder camera to be had cheaper than this (on a good day at least)!! However, one must trade using an uncoated lens and no double exposure prevention but get instead a coupled rangefinder (but two windows) with usually a good shutter (but old scale). pay twice (or more) the price and you get bessa II with coated lens, one window etc.
Andrew in Austin Texas stipulates he preferes folders that are pocketable...actually you said folders should be light and pocketable. (with respect and tounge in cheek) i dont know about that! kinda sounds like an advert would of sounded like for kodak way back lol! if i use that as a stipulation for choosing or using a folder then i would not go past the Perkeo IIIe or its Balda counterpart. i guess it depends on whether its winter or summer and how big your pockets are! the other option is you just get your sheilars to carry it for you in their handbag haha (wonder if that would work when using my field camera lol). nah but personaly i dont mind if they have a bit of weight to them, they feel more solid and better constructed. whilst i like the Agfa's, they compared to Welta, voitlander and ikonta feel a little weak (or is it just cheap!) to me, although i appreciate they are lighter.
i think the Super Iso/Speedex was about $130 w/case when released and depending on what formular you use that can equate to near $2000 if sold today. to pick one up today under $400 in good nick is not bad vaule for money!. the same applies to most folders. the agfa/ansco isolette and records are simply good bang for your buck. the low spec Iso and record III's are about as cheap as you are likely to find an uncoupled rangefinder and were as cheap as you could find when released as well...so if we are talking what is the cheapest then they will win pretty much hands down every time...if your talking build quality then well....thats a different story...
unless one wants a particular feature, maybe a tessar type lens! or better shutter in which case a solinar Iso is still a budget camera compared to some super ikontas or voitlanders in reasonable condition.
its all swings and roundabouts as shadowfox points out the Bessa RF is a camera he prefers and i think good vaule and near the same vaule as isolette and records depending on features and condition (and luck!). Is there other any coupled rangefinder camera to be had cheaper than this (on a good day at least)!! However, one must trade using an uncoated lens and no double exposure prevention but get instead a coupled rangefinder (but two windows) with usually a good shutter (but old scale). pay twice (or more) the price and you get bessa II with coated lens, one window etc.
Andrew in Austin Texas stipulates he preferes folders that are pocketable...actually you said folders should be light and pocketable. (with respect and tounge in cheek) i dont know about that! kinda sounds like an advert would of sounded like for kodak way back lol! if i use that as a stipulation for choosing or using a folder then i would not go past the Perkeo IIIe or its Balda counterpart. i guess it depends on whether its winter or summer and how big your pockets are! the other option is you just get your sheilars to carry it for you in their handbag haha (wonder if that would work when using my field camera lol). nah but personaly i dont mind if they have a bit of weight to them, they feel more solid and better constructed. whilst i like the Agfa's, they compared to Welta, voitlander and ikonta feel a little weak (or is it just cheap!) to me, although i appreciate they are lighter.
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shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
chippy said:
The Super Speedex is worth how much you say? (hastily grab a calculator and start dreaming about profit
)Just kidding, I don't think I'll ever sell my Super Speedex, I got it cheap from a granddaughter of a local photographer. It has history associated with it and it's in an unbelievably pristine condition. And the Solinar is top notch.
JeffGreene
(@)^(@)
The Iskra that so many of our members love, is a copy of the super isolette III. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.
bmattock
Veteran
JeffGreene said:The Iskra that so many of our members love, is a copy of the super isolette III. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.
I think the Super Isolette, not the III.
Have you noticed that the Iskra's have become so much of a cult item that sometimes you can find a better deal on a Super Ikonta? Funny...
chippy
foo was here
shadowfox said:The Super Speedex is worth how much you say? (hastily grab a calculator and start dreaming about profit
Just kidding, I don't think I'll ever sell my Super Speedex, I got it cheap from a granddaughter of a local photographer. It has history associated with it and it's in an unbelievably pristine condition. And the Solinar is top notch.
LOL your a funny bugger.....but really its not about what their worth is it... or if we hang on to them they may or may not be worth a little more money in the future is it hey. if it was about money there are far easier ways to make it (from my point of view)
for me it is a variaty of things that interest me , the tangible mechanics, the fact they use film with good results! the history and much more. but true...its there for all to see if one tranprocess the origonal costs of the camera to todays values..... many of the folk here are using and holding onto some expensive peices if one looks at it that way.
Ernst Dinkla
Well-known
bmattock said:
In practice it lives up to the expectations one gets after reading this article:
http://www.reportajes-jmserrano.com/@2j.m.serrano.htm
While the Super Ikonta may be priced by the collectors, the Iskra earned its price in practice way after the last one was produced. It will probably end in the collection of a real user, someone who can separate quality from hype. The 6x9 to accompany it would be an Ensign Autorange 820 and not a Super Ikonta. If the Ensign had a shutter as good as the Iskra Momentum.
Ernst Dinkla
bmattock
Veteran
Ernst Dinkla said:
While the Super Ikonta may be priced by the collectors, the Iskra earned its price in practice way after the last one was produced. It will probably end in the collection of a real user, someone who can separate quality from hype. The 6x9 to accompany it would be an Ensign Autorange 820 and not a Super Ikonta. If the Ensign had a shutter as good as the Iskra Momentum.
Forgive me for feeling that the cameras of the former Soviet Union are but imitations of better-quality German manufactured goods. I own several Russian cameras, and I do not dispute their capability to produce excellent images. But I am also familiar with their shoddy build quality and indifferent machine work.
Given the choice between an Iskra and a Super Ikonta, I'd take the Ikonta hands-down, without knowing anything else about the two of them. Perhaps I am missing something special, but my experiences thus far have not convinced me of this.
I would not mind trying out an Iskra at some point, but with prices the way they are, I think I'll wait a bit longer.