GarageBoy
Well-known
So I picked up an Olympus XA2 and Mju I mainly because I don't like wearing cameras around my neck and I'd rather pull a small one out of my pocket.
They also look cool
My issues- the XA2 - I shoot close and in dim lighting and the scale focusing wasn't working out for me
Had two dead XAs (DOA on both)
Stylus/Mju I - SLOW and occasionally locks up and won't let me take the shot in certain situations. The turning off the flash every time kinda annoys me too
Is a "luxury" P&S the only way to go, or should I stick with small SLRs and RFs?
They also look cool
My issues- the XA2 - I shoot close and in dim lighting and the scale focusing wasn't working out for me
Had two dead XAs (DOA on both)
Stylus/Mju I - SLOW and occasionally locks up and won't let me take the shot in certain situations. The turning off the flash every time kinda annoys me too
Is a "luxury" P&S the only way to go, or should I stick with small SLRs and RFs?
stompyq
Well-known
I gave up on small film p&s once I tried the Ricoh GR. Not film I know so might not be your cup of tea
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
XA is small RF.
My XA is beaten but isn't dead yet. I used it for one year as every day, on my belt or in my pocket camera.
Scale focusing at 2.8 on close distances needs to be practiced, but doesn't take long time.
Igor&Kapow by Ko.Fe., on Flickr
My XA is beaten but isn't dead yet. I used it for one year as every day, on my belt or in my pocket camera.
Scale focusing at 2.8 on close distances needs to be practiced, but doesn't take long time.
Igor&Kapow by Ko.Fe., on Flickr
Monochrom
Well-known
P&S?
try contax t3 or tvs.
CArl zeiss optics on these models are superb!
try contax t3 or tvs.
CArl zeiss optics on these models are superb!
shortstop
Well-known
TVS is fantastic, T3 is superfantastic! I tried XA, but the optics never satisfied me. T3 optics is great. Like lenses of an SRL or blasoned RF. And autofocus works and is rapid too. What else?
kuzano
Veteran
Luck of the draw....
Luck of the draw....
The camera's you are choosing are 45 years old and plastic. It takes a diligent search and kissing a lot of frogs to find a good one. When you do, sometimes it's work it. Millions of the plastic camera's built in the seventies are in land fills around the country, and more are languishing in closets, looking pristine but with old hardened lubricants and corrosion from batteries left in them.
Furthermore, they were high end "snapshot" camera's and you should not expect more of them.
However, find a well cared for and fully functional XA and you will be pleased, as long as you are expecting to get JUST nice shapshots. No macro, no extensive ISO/ASA range, a very tight little lever on the rangefinder, meaning perfect eyesight to handle the tiny window and match the patches, if they still show. (one trick is a black paint spot on the center of the outside of the front window).
Frankly, since the rangefinder is not so accurate for me, I like the XA2 better, even with it's lesser lens. But you must step off and learn the scale differences.
All in all, a crapshoot, but a nice one if you find the right camera. However, even in the best and fully working condition, you just may not find acceptance. Never had an Mjui but suspect they were even less well cared for than most XA's. XA2's were highly considered as a cheaper camera with a lesser lens. I find they take good snaps.
Still I find a good working XA2 to be more usable to me. In fact, I am drawn to the tiny bit of Vignette that EVERY XA2 I have ever used has created on the corners of the images. If that vignette is a problem for you, slight as it is, the XA2 is not your friend.
Probably easier to find an older reconditions Olympus RD metal body film camera. The jewel in my small camera is the Petri Color 35, called by Cameraquest, the camera that Rollei should have made. In fact, I think it's the one that Steve mentioned it's only flaw was that it does not say Rollei on the top. Another good predecessor to the XA series was any of the Olympus Trips, with the "no batteries required" selenium meter cell, if you can find one that has been stored religiously in it's leather case. Don't buy one without the case, as the meter will likely be dead.
However, as camera's go, the pocket rangefinders are generally nothing more than "shap shot" camera's built to fit in coat pockets as picture taking traveling companions. Not much of a camera for discerning photographers, but readily available for preserving memories.
I'm going tomorrow to look at a $20 XA2, and my last two working XA2's cost me $20 for both. I have the scale distances dialed into my feet, and I just hanker for that vignette.
Luck of the draw....
The camera's you are choosing are 45 years old and plastic. It takes a diligent search and kissing a lot of frogs to find a good one. When you do, sometimes it's work it. Millions of the plastic camera's built in the seventies are in land fills around the country, and more are languishing in closets, looking pristine but with old hardened lubricants and corrosion from batteries left in them.
Furthermore, they were high end "snapshot" camera's and you should not expect more of them.
However, find a well cared for and fully functional XA and you will be pleased, as long as you are expecting to get JUST nice shapshots. No macro, no extensive ISO/ASA range, a very tight little lever on the rangefinder, meaning perfect eyesight to handle the tiny window and match the patches, if they still show. (one trick is a black paint spot on the center of the outside of the front window).
Frankly, since the rangefinder is not so accurate for me, I like the XA2 better, even with it's lesser lens. But you must step off and learn the scale differences.
All in all, a crapshoot, but a nice one if you find the right camera. However, even in the best and fully working condition, you just may not find acceptance. Never had an Mjui but suspect they were even less well cared for than most XA's. XA2's were highly considered as a cheaper camera with a lesser lens. I find they take good snaps.
Still I find a good working XA2 to be more usable to me. In fact, I am drawn to the tiny bit of Vignette that EVERY XA2 I have ever used has created on the corners of the images. If that vignette is a problem for you, slight as it is, the XA2 is not your friend.
Probably easier to find an older reconditions Olympus RD metal body film camera. The jewel in my small camera is the Petri Color 35, called by Cameraquest, the camera that Rollei should have made. In fact, I think it's the one that Steve mentioned it's only flaw was that it does not say Rollei on the top. Another good predecessor to the XA series was any of the Olympus Trips, with the "no batteries required" selenium meter cell, if you can find one that has been stored religiously in it's leather case. Don't buy one without the case, as the meter will likely be dead.
However, as camera's go, the pocket rangefinders are generally nothing more than "shap shot" camera's built to fit in coat pockets as picture taking traveling companions. Not much of a camera for discerning photographers, but readily available for preserving memories.
I'm going tomorrow to look at a $20 XA2, and my last two working XA2's cost me $20 for both. I have the scale distances dialed into my feet, and I just hanker for that vignette.
Archlich
Well-known
The Mju has to fully charge its flash (which it does relatively fast!) in order to shoot in low light and locks the shutter before it's ready. Typical for its class (like the Fuji DL Super Mini and Konica Big Mini), it can't be helped.
You have to get a "luxury" compact which remembers its flash setting. I'd suggest the Nikon 35Ti or the Contax T2, both are available now at the low point of the price hike.
You have to get a "luxury" compact which remembers its flash setting. I'd suggest the Nikon 35Ti or the Contax T2, both are available now at the low point of the price hike.
littleearth
Well-known
I followed the trend for a while ! Started with the Olympus XA series, Yashica T's and ended my experience with the overpriced Contax T series.
I sold them all !
I much prefer a small SLR like the Olympus OM2 or the Contax 139 !
P&S are not for everyone !
I sold them all !
I much prefer a small SLR like the Olympus OM2 or the Contax 139 !
P&S are not for everyone !
CliveC
Well-known
My issue with point and shoots is that I feel guilty for not handling all aspects of exposure.
unixrevolution
Well-known
I've tried a few film P&S cameras, and the truth of the matter is they don't give me the control I want, which I do get from a digital P&S. I haven't found a single film P&S I thought was really worthy of more than a few rolls of fun, with the exception of the incredible Olympus XA, which is actually a rangefinder.
Digital P&S cameras, even crappy ones, offer more manual control and "certainty" with focus and composition than any pocketable film camera. As much as I don't really care for film point and shoots, I love my Sony RX100, to the point I think it's my favorite camera.
I would try a good XA if I were you...enjoy it and see if it really is your thing. Rather than kiss some more frogs on eBay, you can send your DOA ones to be serviced by the only Olympus serviceman around I now of: http://www.zuiko.com/
Good luck in your search. I think for me, the only P&S's that will catch my eye in the film world from now on will likely be the Rollei 35, XA, or the rare and beautiful Nikon TI's. They are so awesome.
Then again, for certain values of pocket, and point and shoot, some medium format folders also make dandy carry-rounds, and I think a Pentax MX with 40/2.8, or a small Leica screw mount or LTM copycat rangefinder with a short (Physically short) lens, would be enjoyable also.
Digital P&S cameras, even crappy ones, offer more manual control and "certainty" with focus and composition than any pocketable film camera. As much as I don't really care for film point and shoots, I love my Sony RX100, to the point I think it's my favorite camera.
I would try a good XA if I were you...enjoy it and see if it really is your thing. Rather than kiss some more frogs on eBay, you can send your DOA ones to be serviced by the only Olympus serviceman around I now of: http://www.zuiko.com/
Good luck in your search. I think for me, the only P&S's that will catch my eye in the film world from now on will likely be the Rollei 35, XA, or the rare and beautiful Nikon TI's. They are so awesome.
Then again, for certain values of pocket, and point and shoot, some medium format folders also make dandy carry-rounds, and I think a Pentax MX with 40/2.8, or a small Leica screw mount or LTM copycat rangefinder with a short (Physically short) lens, would be enjoyable also.
David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
A dead XA is nothing to do with the XA or Olympus but with the seller. Many of us have been using them for years and are pleased with them; even charity shop ones. There are specialist repairers who can sort them out and bring them back to life. They are very pleasant cameras and capable of far more than most people need.
The XA2's are pretty good too but you need to know what you are doing, which means finding a tape measure and learning a couple of distances.
As for the mju-I, it is grossly under-rated because the mju-II is slightly over rated.
I have owned all of the above, still own all of the above and have a film in one of them at the moment. I am pleased with them all but never print bigger than 8 x 12 and they seem more than adequate for that. I have used B&W (Ilford FP4+), colour print and colour slide film in them and, again, can't complain.
The problem could be nothing more than the fact that they are old and you don't know with old cameras what has been done to them. That also applies to not so old second-hand cameras...
So, in a nutshell, I would not blame the cameras. Iit might pay you to persevere because a little understanding of their ways can improve things no end.
BTW, what are you going to do with the old dead XA's?
Regards, David
PS Had an all electronic Contax and when it failed, no one would even consider looking at it. And it didn't cost a pittance like all the above.
A dead XA is nothing to do with the XA or Olympus but with the seller. Many of us have been using them for years and are pleased with them; even charity shop ones. There are specialist repairers who can sort them out and bring them back to life. They are very pleasant cameras and capable of far more than most people need.
The XA2's are pretty good too but you need to know what you are doing, which means finding a tape measure and learning a couple of distances.
As for the mju-I, it is grossly under-rated because the mju-II is slightly over rated.
I have owned all of the above, still own all of the above and have a film in one of them at the moment. I am pleased with them all but never print bigger than 8 x 12 and they seem more than adequate for that. I have used B&W (Ilford FP4+), colour print and colour slide film in them and, again, can't complain.
The problem could be nothing more than the fact that they are old and you don't know with old cameras what has been done to them. That also applies to not so old second-hand cameras...
So, in a nutshell, I would not blame the cameras. Iit might pay you to persevere because a little understanding of their ways can improve things no end.
BTW, what are you going to do with the old dead XA's?
Regards, David
PS Had an all electronic Contax and when it failed, no one would even consider looking at it. And it didn't cost a pittance like all the above.
Rodchenko
Olympian
I didn't enjoy my XA1 much, but I still got some decent shots. Now I have an XA, I am frequently amazed at the quality I'm getting.
I also have a Mju i. It feels limiting, not being able to control hardly anything at all, but it's a different discipline. I'm carrying it right now, as it happens.
But, of course, different strokes for different folks and all that. It would be a boring world if we all used the same cameras all the time.
I also have a Mju i. It feels limiting, not being able to control hardly anything at all, but it's a different discipline. I'm carrying it right now, as it happens.
But, of course, different strokes for different folks and all that. It would be a boring world if we all used the same cameras all the time.
btgc
Veteran
There are many scale focus cameras, enhancing experience of compact film cameras. Say, XA2 is almost too small for me and focus distance resets each time I open cover, yet release button is specific. Nice camera, but Konica C35 EF3 keeps focus distance as long as change it, independent from on/off cycles. Yashica Electro 35MC is small scale focus camera, smallest of Electros and has Av automation, even better than C35 or XA2. Mju? I still have my Mju, my first proper camera...and don't use it because too many cameras are better, ergonomically. I keep it for sentimental reasons.
Just few examples...just look around and step off beaten tracks of Internet wisdom. Try and see which camera works for you.
Just few examples...just look around and step off beaten tracks of Internet wisdom. Try and see which camera works for you.
bohdan
-- Physicist
So, I tried the point and shoot route for a few months. I looked at the Olympus Mju ii/stylus epic, the Ricoh GR1v, and the Fujifilm Klasse S and W.
I liked all of them.
I've sold the Ricoh GR1v. It came to me with a split finder from Japan. The seller didn't realize it and neither did I. It was really small, but noticable when you looked at it the right way. The new owner doesn't mind. The optics are great and the handling is nice. I did not like the view finder. It's small, of course, when you are used to the Leica or the Contax Gs. it was small. I'd advise againt the GR1 and GR1s. They have problems with the LCD that crop up. Some have it, some don't. I think most of them have hit their critical life span. The motors are an issue on some. GR1v has manual ISO setting. If you roll your own film or push/pull, this helps.
The MJUII or Stylus Epics have great wide angle lenses. They can be slow, but for well lit situations, they are nice. I still have both the ones I bought for $45-50US. And, both work well. The view finders are terrible.
I absolutely love the Fujifilm Klasse W/S. I have on of each. Build quality is great and they have great finders. No auto ISO, if I remember right. Color is bright from the pics. The S is 38mm and the W is 28mm. Done over, I would have bought only the 28mm.
When I think about it though, I sold my Contax G series and three lenses about three years ago. I loved the 28 and 45mm. I sold it because I bought a Leica M6 used. The prices for the Contax G lenses have gone up quite a bit since they have adapters for other cameras now. People argue back and forth about the G1 and G2, but I'd prefer one of those over any of the point and shoots. Some would classify that system as a 'luxury point and shoot with interchangable lenses' rather than a rangefinder. Okay, whatever, but it's fun to shoot and better than the listed point and shoots.
But, if size mattered and you want to pursue that mission...I'd suggest the FujiFilm Klasse W.
I liked all of them.
I've sold the Ricoh GR1v. It came to me with a split finder from Japan. The seller didn't realize it and neither did I. It was really small, but noticable when you looked at it the right way. The new owner doesn't mind. The optics are great and the handling is nice. I did not like the view finder. It's small, of course, when you are used to the Leica or the Contax Gs. it was small. I'd advise againt the GR1 and GR1s. They have problems with the LCD that crop up. Some have it, some don't. I think most of them have hit their critical life span. The motors are an issue on some. GR1v has manual ISO setting. If you roll your own film or push/pull, this helps.
The MJUII or Stylus Epics have great wide angle lenses. They can be slow, but for well lit situations, they are nice. I still have both the ones I bought for $45-50US. And, both work well. The view finders are terrible.
I absolutely love the Fujifilm Klasse W/S. I have on of each. Build quality is great and they have great finders. No auto ISO, if I remember right. Color is bright from the pics. The S is 38mm and the W is 28mm. Done over, I would have bought only the 28mm.
When I think about it though, I sold my Contax G series and three lenses about three years ago. I loved the 28 and 45mm. I sold it because I bought a Leica M6 used. The prices for the Contax G lenses have gone up quite a bit since they have adapters for other cameras now. People argue back and forth about the G1 and G2, but I'd prefer one of those over any of the point and shoots. Some would classify that system as a 'luxury point and shoot with interchangable lenses' rather than a rangefinder. Okay, whatever, but it's fun to shoot and better than the listed point and shoots.
But, if size mattered and you want to pursue that mission...I'd suggest the FujiFilm Klasse W.
Greyscale
Veteran
I think that for your shooting style, you would get more utility from a compact rangefinder with a fast lens. The Olympus XA isn't the only option. Maybe something from the Olympus 35 series, or the Konica Auto S3, Vivitar 35ES, or Minolta Hi-Matic 7SII or Hi-Matic E. All are pocketable (shirt or jacket, anyway) and fast enough to use in low light situations.
GarageBoy
Well-known
Thanks
I need to remember the zones for the XA2
I sold my dead XAs for parts
I'm weary of the metering in older cameras, but otherwise, fixed lens RFs sound great
I need to remember the zones for the XA2
I sold my dead XAs for parts
I'm weary of the metering in older cameras, but otherwise, fixed lens RFs sound great
unixrevolution
Well-known
I should chime in again and say that there is one notable exception to all the film P&S cameras besides the XA: The original Retina series, the I and the Ia and Ib. I find them delightful and they are truly tiny when folded up.
thegman
Veteran
I'd probably go a bit bigger and get an RF like a Bessa. A Bessa T with collapsible lens is bigger than most P&S cameras, but not much.
Chris101
summicronia
What are the XA2 focus distances? I got an XA3 for Christmas, and have been using 4', 10', and infinity. Once in a while, I get a bad oof picture (and lots of fuzzy ones from my lazy technique), but I think that's from forgetting the focus reset when I opened the camera.
All in all, it's a very easy camera to snapshoot with.
All in all, it's a very easy camera to snapshoot with.
Rodchenko
Olympian
I also use my Trip as a P&S camera. It's only got two shutter speeds, the focussing is by icons (but you can choose something in between the numbers), you have no control over aperture, and it takes absolutely cracking photos.