traveler_101
American abroad
Well, woe is a bit of hyperbole, but still very discouraging first experience today. I have been developing b&w for a few years now: never had problems and have generally enjoyed the experience.
Some time ago I bought a colour development kit and a few rolls of film: it has sat around for five years . . . because of . . . of what? Innate laziness or a sixth sense that colour would be difficult? That was conventional wisdom, but somehow I still wanted to try it. Well I shot a roll this week, mixed the chemicals and today and had a go at it. What happened: on the first or second inversion in my Paterson tank, the blix "exploded" landing on my shorts, shirt, all over the table and the floor. I should have had that sit for a couple of days I guess. But beyond that I came away with a general sense that the chemicals for colour development stink . . . literally (lol). I found it difficult to get temperatures correct as well.
Some time ago I bought a colour development kit and a few rolls of film: it has sat around for five years . . . because of . . . of what? Innate laziness or a sixth sense that colour would be difficult? That was conventional wisdom, but somehow I still wanted to try it. Well I shot a roll this week, mixed the chemicals and today and had a go at it. What happened: on the first or second inversion in my Paterson tank, the blix "exploded" landing on my shorts, shirt, all over the table and the floor. I should have had that sit for a couple of days I guess. But beyond that I came away with a general sense that the chemicals for colour development stink . . . literally (lol). I found it difficult to get temperatures correct as well.
wwfloyd
Well-known
I share some of your misery with color developing. Yes, with just kitchen gear, temperature control is inexact. My greatest frustration with the higher temp. chemicals, is that the plastic Kinderman top wants to slide itself off of the stainless tank. Twice, I have barely kept a loosened top from becoming total loss.
retinax
Well-known
I guess "burping" the lid on the Paterson tank doesn't help with the warm soup, it warms up the air inside which then expands... well that sucks.
Mackinaw
Think Different
A Sous Vide heater works wonders for temperature control. I started processing C-41 at home just last year and have good success. Saving a bundle of money too. As for the exploding Blix, I’ve noticed that adding Blix causes a chemical reaction that increases pressure in the tank. I’ve learned to “vent” my stainless steel tank (take off the drain cap) about 30 seconds after I add the Blix. That solves the pressure problem.
Jim B.
Jim B.
DHK
-
I noticed the blix would leak a bit. This is a good reason why. Thanks for the tip. I’m using a steel tank with plastic lid.
traveler_101
American abroad
The real misery occurred when my wife got wind of it . . . literally. I work out of the downstairs bathroom with a nice Italian tile floor. I could never imagine such a mess.
Perhaps it would have helped. I do that when fixing to minimise leakage, but the amount of gas in minuscule in comparison to what this hot blix stuff produces.
Just curious - what is a "sous vide" heater? Sounds like someone is preparing a meal. Thanks for your suggestion. Yes I think it is a chemical reaction, but it mimics the releases from a reactor core in the process of a meltdown - lol.
After posting this I found a discussion on another site suggesting that the reaction is caused by contact with the developer. He recommends doing a rinse in between the developer and blix cycles.
All I can say is that I don't like working with these chemicals. Perhaps with a rotary tank and in a basement dark room it would be more plausible.
Mackinaw
Think Different
That's exactly what it is. Basically, you drop sealed packets of food into a hot water bath. The Sous Vide heater will maintain water at a set temperature. After cooking for a certain period of time, your meal is done.
I set my Sous Vide heater at 103F when I process C-41 film. Works really well. Google for some pics of the unit.
Jim B.
traveler_101
American abroad
Heck, that would be really useful! So the holy trinity of colour development imo: rotary tank, dark room and sous vide heater.
benlees
Well-known
Assuming C41, colour chems are much different than b&w- as you have found out! Sloshing them around should be avoided. I used a Paterson tank but never inverted- just gently rotated.
You don't need special equipment (besides an accurate thermometer, which you need for b&w anyway) to keep the water bath at a constant temp (there is 1-2 degree leeway regardless what the internet says). Just keep a supply of hotter water nearby (kettle) and add to your bath as needed. Times are quite short compared to b&w but making sure the temp is correct adds some flavour to the process.
I should add I occasionally got brownish streaks on some negs, so my work flow needed improvement. Still better than the local lab...
You don't need special equipment (besides an accurate thermometer, which you need for b&w anyway) to keep the water bath at a constant temp (there is 1-2 degree leeway regardless what the internet says). Just keep a supply of hotter water nearby (kettle) and add to your bath as needed. Times are quite short compared to b&w but making sure the temp is correct adds some flavour to the process.
I should add I occasionally got brownish streaks on some negs, so my work flow needed improvement. Still better than the local lab...
David Hughes
David Hughes
And kitchen sink makes a perfect water bath.
Regards, David
Regards, David
CharlesDAMorgan
Veteran
I loathe colour development. Stinky developer, horrible stainy blix, the necessity to agitate for seemingly hours as the blix depletes, keeping temperature constant in the winter and water everywhere and just a lot of faff. Using my kitchen sink as a water bath it decided to detach itself and fall off (inadequately fitted probably). I've yet to have the blix explode on me though!
So once my current batch of colour film is finished, digital colour only.
Black and white on the other hand, bliss!
So once my current batch of colour film is finished, digital colour only.
Black and white on the other hand, bliss!
Gregm61
Well-known
I send my color negative film to Simple Labs in California to have them both processed and scanned to DNG format so I can interpret the colors later in Adobe camera raw just like I do color files from my digital M262. That guy does a great job on both the processing and scanning and I only do the part of the process I enjoy, shooting the cameras and working the digital raw files, and storing the negatives when they return, LOL.
Kodak Portra 400 through an M4..
and M6..
Kodak Portra 400 through an M4..
and M6..
traveler_101
American abroad
Yes, C-41 processing: a Unicolor kit purchased in USA. I followed the instructions which specified inversions, but I am glad to have your advice.
Yes, the kitchen sink would be far more useful than the one in the bathroom. If I were a bachelor I could use it . . .
At this point, you are expressing my feelings precisely. I have five rolls of cheap colour film in the freezer - two rolls of Ektar 100 and three of Fuji 200.I will try to shoot them swiftly and then be done with it.
I would love to have a reasonably priced lab available where I live, but it is a dream. These are absolutely gorgeous, Gregm61! Thanks for posting.
I send my color negative film to Simple Labs in California to have them both processed and scanned to DNG format so I can interpret the colors later in Adobe camera raw just like I do color files from my digital M262. That guy does a great job on both the processing and scanning and I only do the part of the process I enjoy, shooting the cameras and working the digital raw files, and storing the negatives when they return, LOL.
Kodak Portra 400 through an M4..
and M6..
Bill Clark
Veteran
I find C-41 is much simpler than black & white. By that I mean look at the gadzillion different types of developers available for black and white film.
The only ingredient thst is some what critical is the developer temp. But even then, there is a fair amount of latitude with the film so as I don’t need to get worried about developer temp. And with XP 2 Plus there is a wide ISO range that can be used when making the photos.
At sny rate, C-41 is C-41.
How many different black and white developers do you use? And the temp needs to be looked at for developing times. Unless, of course, it’s stand development. Or do I use stock 1+1, 1+2, 1+3. Let me see fine grain, PMK, XYZ and oh dear me!
The only ingredient thst is some what critical is the developer temp. But even then, there is a fair amount of latitude with the film so as I don’t need to get worried about developer temp. And with XP 2 Plus there is a wide ISO range that can be used when making the photos.
At sny rate, C-41 is C-41.
How many different black and white developers do you use? And the temp needs to be looked at for developing times. Unless, of course, it’s stand development. Or do I use stock 1+1, 1+2, 1+3. Let me see fine grain, PMK, XYZ and oh dear me!
mconnealy
Well-known
I use the Unicolor C-41 kit. I find it easier and quicker than most b&w processes. The cost per roll is about a buck as a kit will easily process twice what the directions indicate.
Plastic tanks leak when inverted. That can be averted by agitating with the stirring rod for the Paterson tank.
I bring the developer and blix to the proper temperature by setting the beakers into a container with running hot water.
I store the three C-41 solutions in plastic peroxide bottles in the refrigerator; they last for months without degradation.
A description of the process I use is in a post on my blog.
Plastic tanks leak when inverted. That can be averted by agitating with the stirring rod for the Paterson tank.
I bring the developer and blix to the proper temperature by setting the beakers into a container with running hot water.
I store the three C-41 solutions in plastic peroxide bottles in the refrigerator; they last for months without degradation.
A description of the process I use is in a post on my blog.
wjlapier
Well-known
C41 for me:
Developer and Blix in their Jobo 1L bottles in a bath with the thermometer in the developer to bring chems to proper temp. I'll get to 102 degrees and pull the chems from the bath and pour the bath water in the developer measuring cup ( brings the temp of the cup up ). While the chems are in the bath rising to developing temperature I'm measuring out my stabilizer and photoflo ( not sure this step is needed but I've done it forever so I continue to ). Once the developer is at 102 and I've poured out the bath water that was warming up the measuring cup I measure out my developer and Blix and start my timer and follow the directions. I do invert the Patterson tank for the developer but not the Blix--just use the stirring rod. Thats it and no exploding chems.
The only time I could have had that happen was after mixing the Blix. I put it in a Jobo 1L container and closed the top. The chems were still reacting and the bottle begin to budge so I slowly released the air.
Developer and Blix in their Jobo 1L bottles in a bath with the thermometer in the developer to bring chems to proper temp. I'll get to 102 degrees and pull the chems from the bath and pour the bath water in the developer measuring cup ( brings the temp of the cup up ). While the chems are in the bath rising to developing temperature I'm measuring out my stabilizer and photoflo ( not sure this step is needed but I've done it forever so I continue to ). Once the developer is at 102 and I've poured out the bath water that was warming up the measuring cup I measure out my developer and Blix and start my timer and follow the directions. I do invert the Patterson tank for the developer but not the Blix--just use the stirring rod. Thats it and no exploding chems.
The only time I could have had that happen was after mixing the Blix. I put it in a Jobo 1L container and closed the top. The chems were still reacting and the bottle begin to budge so I slowly released the air.
Steve M.
Veteran
I don't even know what a Blix is, much less an exploding one, but really, really don't like the sound of it.
Charles has summed up my feelings about colour home development. Not sure that I'd go as far as shooting digital, other than my phone. This may sound odd, but I COULD see the point of making B&W prints at home (development and printing a good neg is a breeze) and hand colouring them. That sounds like fun.
Long ago I decided that B&W development was the height of my skill level. It's a comfortable level because things don't need to be exact.....like the time I was washing a roll of Shanghai B&W in a tank, turned the hot water on accidentally instead of the cold, forgot about it for a couple of hours, and every frame still came out perfect!
Unfortunately, my experiments with using fixer for a developer were sub optimal.
Charles has summed up my feelings about colour home development. Not sure that I'd go as far as shooting digital, other than my phone. This may sound odd, but I COULD see the point of making B&W prints at home (development and printing a good neg is a breeze) and hand colouring them. That sounds like fun.
Long ago I decided that B&W development was the height of my skill level. It's a comfortable level because things don't need to be exact.....like the time I was washing a roll of Shanghai B&W in a tank, turned the hot water on accidentally instead of the cold, forgot about it for a couple of hours, and every frame still came out perfect!
Unfortunately, my experiments with using fixer for a developer were sub optimal.
Mackinaw
Think Different
traveler_101
American abroad
Thanks for all the constructive suggestions on the part of those of you who enjoy colour processing and for the expressions of empathy for those of you who do not. There are apparently quite few people out there who find colour processing to be of a different order so my initial reaction was not idiosyncratic.
J enea
Established
to me, color is not any harder than B&W. you just have a stricter temp situation. Like mentioned above, color is easy as you have only 1 developer, not the dozens in B&W, so there is much less experimenting.
I use a large slow cooker set on the warming setting and it keeps the water bath at 105, which keeps the chems at 102. I did 18 rolls of slide film yesterday and had no issues with temps. it does take about an hour per batch, but the cost of self development is the only reason I can still afford to shoot slide film.
Its not hard, just some people make it out to be. it may take a few more attempts to get you system down, but the results will be better and more consistent than a lab. and you will only have yourself to blame if there is a mistake.
I use a large slow cooker set on the warming setting and it keeps the water bath at 105, which keeps the chems at 102. I did 18 rolls of slide film yesterday and had no issues with temps. it does take about an hour per batch, but the cost of self development is the only reason I can still afford to shoot slide film.
Its not hard, just some people make it out to be. it may take a few more attempts to get you system down, but the results will be better and more consistent than a lab. and you will only have yourself to blame if there is a mistake.