Considering…Zorki 4 to 5?

[xxloverxx]

A bit of background: Used my Zorki 4 for a while, then got my Zorki C. Haven't touched the 4 since. Both are knob wind. So I want a lever wind, but I like bottom loading.

So I'm considering selling the Zorki 4 body and getting a Zorki 5b (round RF window) with a rigid Industar 50 (black).

Comments/advice? I can sell the Zorki 4 body for about the same price the Zorki 5 is (~70 USD including shipping).

…is 70 USD a good price? 40 USD for the camera (Zorki 5) + lens (black I-50).

 

[julio1fer]

Zorki 5 is a good option if you don't need slow speeds. Very easy to handle, long RF base. I believe it is the only relatively common Soviet RF that is both lever-operated and bottom-loaded.

Industar-50 is a nice Tessar clone, quite underrated IMHO. And if you don't like it you can always get a Jupiter-8 for peanuts.

Price seems a bit high, but it all depends on condition. Remember that most old cameras will need a CLA to get into shape. Even those vaunted L's.

 

[Livesteamer]

Is the Zorki 5 the one that should not have the shutter fired with the lens removed? I remember something about the rf mechanism getting in the way of shutter parts when the lens is off. I could be wrong. Joe

 

[xxloverxx]

julio, the price does seem a bit high, but the seller claims that everything works fine; I'm guessing it probably won't need a CLA.

Livesteamer, I did read something about that, but I'm not sure whether to believe it or not — the lens focused at infinity and the lens being off altogether is the same for the RF cam. In both cases, it's sticking out as far as it will go.

 

[ZorkiKat]

Is the Zorki 5 the one that should not have the shutter fired with the lens removed? I remember something about the rf mechanism getting in the way of shutter parts when the lens is off. I could be wrong. Joe

Yes, the Zorki-5 shutter SHOULD never be fired without any lens. The RF and shutter components can mesh.

 

[John Robertson]

Zorki 4K! Zorki 4 with lever wind.

 

[xxloverxx]

Yes, the Zorki-5 shutter SHOULD never be fired without any lens. The RF and shutter components can mesh.

But the shutter can be cocked without a lens, right?

Just bought it. Going to list the Zorki 4 when it arrives and I'm confident it's working properly. I had no idea that listing on eBay was so…tiring :bang:

 

[freeranger]

I have both - In my opinion the Zorki 4 is a much better camera and I would never swap a 4 for a 5.
That said, I may just have a good example of a 4 and a bad 5.

 

[ZorkiKat]

But the shutter can be cocked without a lens, right?

Just bought it. Going to list the Zorki 4 when it arrives and I'm confident it's working properly. I had no idea that listing on eBay was so…tiring :bang:

Yes it can. In fact, it is also possible that the shutter speed regulator and RF parts won't mesh when the camera is fired, but it will likely do that some time. I've repaired about three or four Zorki-5 whose parts have meshed as a result of being fired without a lens.

Zorki-5 are quite nice cameras. They look like M3, from a distance. They are likely found with rough winding levers though, and may need to be reworked as well as CLA'd to get them to work right.

I would go for a Zorki-5 anytime over a Zorki 4... 😛

 

[xxloverxx]

Thanks for the info, ZorkiKat!

I had seriously considered the 4K, but I suppose I decided to go with the 5 because of the different wind lever (more…old-style(?) metal with no plastic tips), bottom loading (I consider it to be tougher because of this, but I have no evidence) and longer RF base.

 

[sig]

ZokiKat, regarding firing the shutter with no lens, if you push the rf cam in while triggering the shutter does that equal to have a lens on?

thanks

 

[ZorkiKat]

ZokiKat, regarding firing the shutter with no lens, if you push the rf cam in while triggering the shutter does that equal to have a lens on?

thanks

That's the safe way of firing the shutter without the lens in place. However, be very careful in pushing the rf cam- a light push, and not too deep, just move it around 10mm from its fully extended position, and that's good enough.

 

[sig]

That's the safe way of firing the shutter without the lens in place. However, be very careful in pushing the rf cam- a light push, and not too deep, just move it around 10mm from its fully extended position, and that's good enough.

Thanks for quick reply

 

[xxloverxx]

That's the safe way of firing the shutter without the lens in place. However, be very careful in pushing the rf cam- a light push, and not too deep, just move it around 10mm from its fully extended position, and that's good enough.

I'm not doubting your knowledge, but if fully-extended means the RF is focused at infinity, and the shutter can jam if the cam is sticking all the way out (lens unmounted), are there any risks to firing the shutter with the lens at infinity?

Or is the RF past infinity when the lens is off?

 

[ZorkiKat]

I'm not doubting your knowledge, but if fully-extended means the RF is focused at infinity, and the shutter can jam if the cam is sticking all the way out (lens unmounted), are there any risks to firing the shutter with the lens at infinity?

Or is the RF past infinity when the lens is off?

A fully extended (outwards) RF cam is not the infinity position. The cam moves inwards for infinity.

When the lens is off, the RF is way past its MINIMUM focus distance. That's where the trouble begins.

If you can see how the parts connected to the RF cam are laid out on the top plate, you'll see that at a certain position, these parts can go in the path of the rotating shutter speed selector.

Without any lens on the mount, the RF cam will extend past the lens mount OUTWARDS, and will go further if not for the limits set by the lens mount flange itself. When the RF cam is at this position, the components connected to it laid out on the top plate will lay in the path of the moving shutter speed control parts. That's how the meshing happens.

By having a lens on the mount (or by pushing the rf cam inwards), the lens rf coupling cam will cause the rf cam to move inwards, and at this position will cause the upper parts of the rf arm to stay clear of the path of the shutter speed components.

 

[xxloverxx]

Thanks for the info! 🙂

 

[wolves3012]

Yes it can. In fact, it is also possible that the shutter speed regulator and RF parts won't mesh when the camera is fired, but it will likely do that some time. I've repaired about three or four Zorki-5 whose parts have meshed as a result of being fired without a lens.

Zorki-5 are quite nice cameras. They look like M3, from a distance. They are likely found with rough winding levers though, and may need to be reworked as well as CLA'd to get them to work right.

I would go for a Zorki-5 anytime over a Zorki 4... 😛

Jay,

I'll have to disagree with the first part. On my Zorki 5, I can definitely state that the components WILL hit each other if you cock the shutter with no lens on. The consequences are actually worse than firing, because the force of the winder is behind it.

Either push the cam in a little or, simpler, leave a lens on and DON'T cock or fire without!

 

[wolves3012]

If you don't need slower speeds and don't mind bottom loading cameras, a serviced Zorki 5 is excellent. It has a wide-base RF and a very bright VF and almost no possibility to have light leaks - it's very compact too with a collapsible.

The winders are often rough on them but a proper CLA of the gears makes them very sweet to wind.

 

[xxloverxx]

Jay,

I'll have to disagree with the first part. On my Zorki 5, I can definitely state that the components WILL hit each other if you cock the shutter with no lens on. The consequences are actually worse than firing, because the force of the winder is behind it.

Either push the cam in a little or, simpler, leave a lens on and DON'T cock or fire without!

Is it safe to take the lens off with the shutter cocked but not fire it then?

Just want to know how I can easily inspect the shutter.

 

[wolves3012]

Is it safe to take the lens off with the shutter cocked but not fire it then?

Just want to know how I can easily inspect the shutter.

Yes, perfectly safe. The problem is that if there is no lens on, the RF coupler extends fully and this leaves the RF linkage in the path of the shutter mechanism. Firing the shutter or winding it on can cause them to collide with enough force to damage one or the other part (probably the shutter speed-setting pin IIRC).

The clearance with a lens on is quite small and variation means on some cameras you may get away with it without one on. On mine you can't. I was intrigued and had a close look whilst I was servicing mine. All you need to do is to push the coupler in slightly when there's no lens on, a couple of mm is enough, if you really must fire it.