Dev prob or shutter bounce?

beethamd

beethamd

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Any suggestions?

lncoln_002.jpg
 
It seems to be the whole roll, more noticeable in different frames. I've attched a frame where it's not really noticeable on the wall. Dev was DDX, Paterson tank, and, yes a 35mm frame (FM2n).

planar_006.jpg


I might fill the tank with water to see how close to the top of the roll it is. It just looks like the band is way below the top of the film suggesting that it was missing loads of liquid, and, looks like two bands...
 
what camera did you use to make this image?
is this the full un-cropped frame?
one cannot get this defect from a leaf shutter or a horizontal FP shutter if this is the full 35mm frame 24x36. the horizontal FP shutter would have the line on the short side of the full frame, if it is shutter curtain bounce.
the line does not seem to extend all the way down.
 
Well, the recommended 290ml seems to be about half an inch over the top of the film. Perhaps I didn't fill the tank with the right amount of fluid - although I doubt that.
 
I would agree with Mark, I would think that the dev. tank was low in developer solution.
 
beethamd said:
Well, the recommended 290ml seems to be about half an inch over the top of the film. Perhaps I didn't fill the tank with the right amount of fluid - although I doubt that.
Click to expand...

did you agitate the tank regularly and for the whole development period?
 
I actually over did it a little 9 mins at 20 degrees because the developer was a bit old. I actually over developed it on the negs. Would old dev give me the bands on the negatives?
 
could it be possible that you have a light leak onto one edge of the film? i have problems with low level leaks in my kiev that seems to add density to skies etc. I left the camera on a bright windowsill which then gave marks in the film borders.
 
fidget said:
could it be possible that you have a light leak onto one edge of the film? i have problems with low level leaks in my kiev that seems to add density to skies etc. I left the camera on a bright windowsill which then gave marks in the film borders.
Click to expand...

I think that the borders are OK.
 
fidget said:
could it be possible that you have a light leak onto one edge of the film? i have problems with low level leaks in my kiev that seems to add density to skies etc. I left the camera on a bright windowsill which then gave marks in the film borders.
Click to expand...
would not a light leak appear as light or white-ish in colour on the finished print?
 
xayraa33 said:
would not a light leak appear as light or white-ish in colour on the finished print?
Click to expand...

Absolutely right, a lightstrike would give greater density on the negative so would print as white.
I've always used 300ml per roll in a Paterson tank for a safety margin as well as being easier to calculate then 290ml. In fact when I reuse ID-11 stock I just pour it in until it fills to above the central hole, no measure needed. Bear in mind that the developer will froth a bit with agitation which can stick to the top edge of the film and cause local underdevelopment.
 
I had this trouble on the short side of my 35mm negs, which stands to reason since it's a horizontal FP shutter. Although it's not as pronounced as yours the examples I posted (now deleted) showed almost the exact same defect you show here.
I brought the M3 to my shop and the technician popped open the back, pressed the release and said "yup, it's bouncing". Apparently easy to see if you know what to look for. He adjusted the shutter brake and I had it back next day, very cheaply. Never had a problem since.
This looks so much like my defect I'm pretty certain it's shutter bounce.
 
Thanks dadsm3 - the more I think about it, the less likely I think it was a measuring error. I'm absolutely meticulous about that sort of thing. It's not impossible though, and I'm reluctant to disagree with Mark, who's very experienced.

When I squint my eyes at the images and move down a little to darken the screen on my laptop, I see a few bands.

The dev answer seems appealing but I think it's still possible that it's a shutter issue. I've emailed a picture to Ed Tzroska to see if he thinks it's a shutter problem. Is it on the right side for a shutter problem?
 
I'm going to go with the developer issue, too but...

-1 or 2 reel tank?

-if 2 reel, did you have 2 reels in there?

-if you did, was this reel on the top (potentially - it's hard to keep track for me, I know)

-does the tank leak at all?

Finally, if you look at the bottom of the center column in your tank, you'll notice that it is not flat. It is designed such, if you use center rod rotation for agitation, the reels will move up and down by a few millimeters. Now, with the 290ml, and the rod higher rather than lower, and allowing for leakage...still sure that you might not have fallen below the line?

allan
 
Kaiyen,
I used a Patterson tank that takes two 35mm rolls, but I only used one, with 290ml which should have been half an inch over the top of the reel. Definately no leaks, but maybe a little escapes when I take the lid off after inverting to twiddle the thingy.

Using the rod to rotate the spiral, it doesn't seem to move up much, but ... now I wonder if I didn't push the sprial down onto the central inner cylinder. That would lift the spiral a bit higher. I wonder. The spiral fits fairly tight so it wouldn't fall down even when rotated by the rod. Kaiyen - I think you've helped me work it out.

Did you like the photo of my helper - Helen? She does get a bit bored sometimes holding things for me.
 
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