Creagerj
Incidental Artist
To clarify, I mainly mean documenting drug use, but any kind of illegal activity applies to the subject.
Has anyone here on RFF ever done any projects that document individuals engaging in illegal activities. I have, but I've never really put them out there for public viewing. The reason is that I am concerned about consequences that my subjects could face if these projects were seen by the wrong people.
Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
Has anyone here on RFF ever done any projects that document individuals engaging in illegal activities. I have, but I've never really put them out there for public viewing. The reason is that I am concerned about consequences that my subjects could face if these projects were seen by the wrong people.
Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
Mike Ip
Vagabond Light Collector
Likewise, don't mention full names in captions if you don't have to and don't "incriminate" them by writing things such as "Joe Schmoe smokes a joint. He smokes it a few times a day." etc..
Bob Michaels
nobody special
There is a big difference in "documenting people engaged in illegal activity" and documenting people and culture that just happen to engage in illegal activity. The key difference is if you are documenting the illegal activity or the people.
I have photographed, with subject permission, working prostitutes ("just don't call me a crack whore"), people doing drugs, drug dealers, and street con men. They all had experience with me treating them just as another human being. They knew I would step back when business was at hand and would walk away before money was ever exchanged.
There is always something about you extending your hand, introducing yourself, and truthfully explaining why you want to photograph them. You know you are going to be solicited anyway and just graciously say no when it happens. Oh, and you have to not be bothered with the occasional strong rejection.
I have photographed, with subject permission, working prostitutes ("just don't call me a crack whore"), people doing drugs, drug dealers, and street con men. They all had experience with me treating them just as another human being. They knew I would step back when business was at hand and would walk away before money was ever exchanged.
There is always something about you extending your hand, introducing yourself, and truthfully explaining why you want to photograph them. You know you are going to be solicited anyway and just graciously say no when it happens. Oh, and you have to not be bothered with the occasional strong rejection.
emraphoto
Veteran
done lot's and can't really ad any more to what Bob (and the rest) have said.
Gumby
Veteran
Use a pseudonym, for yourself... just in case!
ampguy
Veteran
Just refer to them as Mr. X
--
"I find that most of the insights I achieve when high are into social issues, an area of creative scholarship very different from the one I am generally known for. I can remember one occasion, taking a shower with my wife while high, in which I had an idea on the origins and invalidities of racism in terms of gaussian distribution curves. It was a point obvious in a way, but rarely talked about. I drew the curves in soap on the shower wall, and went to write the idea down. One idea led to another, and at the end of about an hour of extremely hard work I found I had written eleven short essays on a wide range of social, political, philosophical, and human biological topics. Because of problems of space, I can't go into the details of these essays, but from all external signs, such as public reactions and expert commentary, they seem to contain valid insights. I have used them in university commencement addresses, public lectures, and in my books."
-- Mr. X (Carl ...)
--
"I find that most of the insights I achieve when high are into social issues, an area of creative scholarship very different from the one I am generally known for. I can remember one occasion, taking a shower with my wife while high, in which I had an idea on the origins and invalidities of racism in terms of gaussian distribution curves. It was a point obvious in a way, but rarely talked about. I drew the curves in soap on the shower wall, and went to write the idea down. One idea led to another, and at the end of about an hour of extremely hard work I found I had written eleven short essays on a wide range of social, political, philosophical, and human biological topics. Because of problems of space, I can't go into the details of these essays, but from all external signs, such as public reactions and expert commentary, they seem to contain valid insights. I have used them in university commencement addresses, public lectures, and in my books."
-- Mr. X (Carl ...)
Gumby
Veteran
Whatever you do, don't let any of the crackheads (or whatever the PC polite word for them is) know that you are Joe Creager. In less than 45 seconds I found your address, phone number, photo... and I'm not even interested in "getting even" for anything!
Have some fun: introduce yourself as Bob Michaels, Bill Mattocks, Joe the Sicilian Caunuk/former-Brooklynite, or even Roger Hicks. That will throw them off of your tracks!
Have some fun: introduce yourself as Bob Michaels, Bill Mattocks, Joe the Sicilian Caunuk/former-Brooklynite, or even Roger Hicks. That will throw them off of your tracks!
emraphoto
Veteran
if you aren't honest and there isn't a degree of trust you aren't going to come out of it with the images you want.
^^^personal experience.
^^^personal experience.
Pablito
coco frío
radambe
Member
Awesome reply. The "occasional strong rejection" can actually be quite disheartening. I think the reality is that people who may not have much pride left will often have a strong distaste for being photographed. I believe that it is up to the photographer to be assertive and communicate a clear sense of honesty and empathy in order to gain trust. You can't go wrong by showing people that you have an honest interest in them and want nothing in return.
Bob Michaels
nobody special
I have always used my real name. And, I am not hard to find at all. I am careful to insure no one ever has a reason to "get even". That relates to every aspect of my life. Everyone I have photographed believes that I have treated them with the utmost respect and no surprises. I do use good judgment and not flash large amounts of cash. But those are just common sense things.
Pablito
coco frío
No matter how careful, there can be reasons to "get even" that you might never think of or understand, no matter how respectful or honest you are. See the link I posed above, and read the text. The photographer / film maker's got killed even though he was intimately familiar with the territory.
Pablito
coco frío
"I think the reality is that people who may not have much pride left will often have a strong distaste for being photographed."
This varies, you never know. Such folks can perceive the attention of a photgrapher as an affirmation of self-worth; this can lead to genuine pride or disappointment and anger.
"I believe that it is up to the photographer to be assertive and communicate a clear sense of honesty and empathy in order to gain trust. "
Sure, but it's naive to think that honesty and empathy can always gain trust.
"You can't go wrong by showing people that you have an honest interest in them and want nothing in return."
But you DO want something in return. And you can get robbed, beaten or killed by doing that ONLY. This is a troubling thread about a very complex issue.
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Frank Petronio
Well-known
Of course the best way to document illegal activity is to be complicit with it.
Pablito
coco frío
Yes indeed, and there are degrees of complicity as well.
35mmdelux
Veni, vidi, vici
Not much choice if its a hashish den.
Pablito
coco frío
radambe
Member
What did you mean by "only"? I think I may have misspoke or been misunderstood as saying honesty alone will gain trust...it won't, but lying has never gotten me anywhere I could've avoided.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Joe,
Not exactly the same thing, but close:
I have photographed Tibetan refugees who have walked for days across the Himalayas to reach India. They have had to dodge Chinese patrols; they often arrive with bare feet, bloody from being cut with stones, because their Chinese shoes wear out after the first few days.
There is always a risk that some of them may be forced to go back to Tibet. Others, with bravery I find unimaginable, volunteer to go back, to tell people that HH Dalai Lama is OK and to bring news of friends. If they do go back, they face possible torture and death if they are recognized. Have you ever met anyone who has been raped with an electric cattle prod? I have.
In pictures for publication, I make sure their faces are not visible, or are blurred beyond recognition (e.g. 2-second exposure, head moving the whole time). If I take portraits for them (purely as gifts), I give them the negative.
Tash delek,
Roger
Not exactly the same thing, but close:
I have photographed Tibetan refugees who have walked for days across the Himalayas to reach India. They have had to dodge Chinese patrols; they often arrive with bare feet, bloody from being cut with stones, because their Chinese shoes wear out after the first few days.
There is always a risk that some of them may be forced to go back to Tibet. Others, with bravery I find unimaginable, volunteer to go back, to tell people that HH Dalai Lama is OK and to bring news of friends. If they do go back, they face possible torture and death if they are recognized. Have you ever met anyone who has been raped with an electric cattle prod? I have.
In pictures for publication, I make sure their faces are not visible, or are blurred beyond recognition (e.g. 2-second exposure, head moving the whole time). If I take portraits for them (purely as gifts), I give them the negative.
Tash delek,
Roger
Creagerj
Incidental Artist
Are you sure you found the Joe Creager that is actually me? PM me the phone number and address you found, I'd be interested to find out.
Anywho, I'm not to worried about being killed by my subjects as I'm mainly documenting cannabis users, and they are typically low key. Also, I'm not trying to sneak shots or publish any photos that someone didn't say I could publish.
For those of you who don't live in the US, cannabis use is quite a hot-button issue, which is my main reason for being concerned.
This thread has had some helpful replies though, I especially felt that Bob Michaels input was sound advice. Thanks everyone!
Of course, any more insight would be appreciated.