ssmc
Well-known
Hi all,
I have a 1997-vintage Nikon AF SLR that has no dust seals, only a "light trap" type of back design. It seems to get a lot of dust inside it even in normal use, to the extent that the pressure plate has horizontal scuff-marks on it and more than a few of the negs have come out of this camera with scratches on them i.e. pretty much ruined :bang:. My much older and more heavily-used Minolta X-700 and X-570 have seals and their pressure plates are absolutely pristine, even after numerous film changes in the Utah desert; needless to say I have not had problems with scratched negatives from these cameras.
My Fuji GW690III has all-around dust seals, but I notice that some medium-format cameras don't seem to have them (from what I can tell looking at pics on the net the GF670/Bessa III is one of those). Does anyone have experience with "un-sealed" MF bodies in dusty environments? Or is dust not really a problem with 120 film because of the backing paper and/or the lack of rewind?
Does the Mamiya 7/7II have foam or felt seals? I'm looking at a MF rangefinder with some kind of built-in meter - using a hand-held meter on the Fuji drives me nuts for some reason
- and I would like to be able to use it hiking in lots of different places, though I don't expect it to be waterproof or anything like that!
Thanks for any advice on this topic!
Scott
I have a 1997-vintage Nikon AF SLR that has no dust seals, only a "light trap" type of back design. It seems to get a lot of dust inside it even in normal use, to the extent that the pressure plate has horizontal scuff-marks on it and more than a few of the negs have come out of this camera with scratches on them i.e. pretty much ruined :bang:. My much older and more heavily-used Minolta X-700 and X-570 have seals and their pressure plates are absolutely pristine, even after numerous film changes in the Utah desert; needless to say I have not had problems with scratched negatives from these cameras.
My Fuji GW690III has all-around dust seals, but I notice that some medium-format cameras don't seem to have them (from what I can tell looking at pics on the net the GF670/Bessa III is one of those). Does anyone have experience with "un-sealed" MF bodies in dusty environments? Or is dust not really a problem with 120 film because of the backing paper and/or the lack of rewind?
Does the Mamiya 7/7II have foam or felt seals? I'm looking at a MF rangefinder with some kind of built-in meter - using a hand-held meter on the Fuji drives me nuts for some reason
- and I would like to be able to use it hiking in lots of different places, though I don't expect it to be waterproof or anything like that!Thanks for any advice on this topic!
Scott
pvdhaar
Peter
Never thought about this, but when I think about it, this could be the case.
Even on 35mm cameras with seals I've had occasional scratches on the film, even when film was loaded in a non dusty environment. The most likely culprit in that case is the top film guide which scrapes a bit of the film off, causing some of it to land on the emulsion side. When rewinding, this gets caught on the felt on the 35mm cartridge and spoils a couple of shots.
Thinking about it, I can't remember ever having gotten a 120 film processed with scratches running over it, even though my 6x6 camera has no seals that I know of. The backside of the film is indeed protected by paper, and the front side doesn't have to run into a cannister through some felt. So, yes, most likely this has something to do with it, although there may be another factor still; that's that on my 6x6 SLR, the film runs vertically through the camera, so the film guides are on the sides. Any scrapings now don't land on the image area..
sanmich
Veteran
Your point is interesting but there is much more than the foam seals as a difference between your Nikon and Minolta.
the auto loading system seems much more "dangerous" to me than the light seals, and you probably have much more things touching and probing the film in the newer camera than in the older one.
the auto loading system seems much more "dangerous" to me than the light seals, and you probably have much more things touching and probing the film in the newer camera than in the older one.
oftheherd
Veteran
I don't think I have had a 35mm camera scratch film since about 1967 or 68. I had my father's Welta Welti, and it began scratching film. I wasn't so experienced with cameras and their problems then, and didn't have a clue what might help it, or even for sure what had caused it.
I wonder if some one who owned the camera previously might have tried to sand down the pressure plate. I would have to go back and look, but I don't think any of mine have marks like you mention. But you do have me curious.
I wonder if some one who owned the camera previously might have tried to sand down the pressure plate. I would have to go back and look, but I don't think any of mine have marks like you mention. But you do have me curious.
EdSawyer
Established
mamiya 7
mamiya 7
Mamiya 7 is a great choice, no doubt. It has no foam seals, of the type that the fuji and older SLRs use. It does have a single rubber seal @ the hinge area. It has no problem whatsoever with dust, in my experience. (I don't have problems with dust in the fuji GSW690III, GW670III or RZ67 either though.)
enjoy,
-Ed
mamiya 7
Mamiya 7 is a great choice, no doubt. It has no foam seals, of the type that the fuji and older SLRs use. It does have a single rubber seal @ the hinge area. It has no problem whatsoever with dust, in my experience. (I don't have problems with dust in the fuji GSW690III, GW670III or RZ67 either though.)
enjoy,
-Ed
ssmc
Well-known
Thanks for all the replies!
I never really thought about the auto-loading system on the F70 but Michael is right, there is sure a lot of "action" going on in there when you put a film in it... maybe there is also just something wrong with that particular body design, I dunno. The difference in film travel direction with some MF cameras probably helps too (thx to Peter for pointing that out)
The Mamiya 7 is looking better to me all the time for various reasons, though I'd probably have to sell my GW690III and GA645 to help fund it. Knowing how much I regret selling cameras after the fact, I am not sure I'm ready to take such a step yet! On the other hand replacing 2 cameras with one that takes interchangeable lenses and has a built-in meter does make a lot of sense... arrgh!
Regards,
Scott
I never really thought about the auto-loading system on the F70 but Michael is right, there is sure a lot of "action" going on in there when you put a film in it... maybe there is also just something wrong with that particular body design, I dunno. The difference in film travel direction with some MF cameras probably helps too (thx to Peter for pointing that out)
The Mamiya 7 is looking better to me all the time for various reasons, though I'd probably have to sell my GW690III and GA645 to help fund it. Knowing how much I regret selling cameras after the fact, I am not sure I'm ready to take such a step yet! On the other hand replacing 2 cameras with one that takes interchangeable lenses and has a built-in meter does make a lot of sense... arrgh!
Regards,
Scott
Corto
Well-known
Personally, Ive had more Dust issues with 35mm than with 120.
Maybe it is because I baby my 120's far more and they tend to be more dust resistant by design (Bellows mostly where dust can sit if not disturbed)
Maybe it is because I baby my 120's far more and they tend to be more dust resistant by design (Bellows mostly where dust can sit if not disturbed)
EdSawyer
Established
selling
selling
I had a GW670III and GSW690III. I sold the GW670III not long after getting the Mamiya 7. I don't really miss it in any appreciable way (except the nostalgia and of course desire for more stuff...) compared to the Mamiya 7. I did keep the GWW690III, but I don't use it much, usually only when I want to take the lightest possible, largest possible negative and go without a meter just for the challenge of it. They both made great negs, but the negs from the mamiya 7 are every bit as good or better.
-Ed
selling
I had a GW670III and GSW690III. I sold the GW670III not long after getting the Mamiya 7. I don't really miss it in any appreciable way (except the nostalgia and of course desire for more stuff...) compared to the Mamiya 7. I did keep the GWW690III, but I don't use it much, usually only when I want to take the lightest possible, largest possible negative and go without a meter just for the challenge of it. They both made great negs, but the negs from the mamiya 7 are every bit as good or better.
-Ed