Leica LTM FILCA variations

[Scrambler]

I just bought a box of reloadable film casettes for Leicas. I had seen that they were mostly FILCAs before purchase (though one turned put to be an IXMOO with FILCA internals - which doesn't work if anyone's wondering).

What surprised me was the variation between FILCAs. There are:
- two major variants of shell design (with one major variant having some branded with Leitz and others unmarked)
- Three variants of light shield (raised Z, stamped Z and unmarked; the unmarked also has slightly different molding and machining)
- Four variants of spool (based on film holding, bottom flange and end knob engraving)

Looking at the archives here, I found this post: http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=749265&postcount=4

which references 4 types of Leica cassettes. In this trove I have three of these (There are three Leitz-Agfa cassettes - type D/ KASAM).

Not all FILCA parts are interchangeable, although the unmarked light shield may work on both variant outer shells. The stamped Z light traps go with the Type C cassettes while the raised Z go with the Type B. Some of the Type B cassettes seem to require the unflanged spools. I assume the unflanged type are earlier as the simplest version of film grip devices are on the unflanged spools (with the mix-and-match going on here I can't be sure one of the spools might not have initially come from a Type D).

There is also an odd light shield in the set - it looks similar to the FED style so maybe a Contax? The catch is not grooved into the light shield but notches in the end.

I see that Lager said that in thirty years he had never seen a Type C: I now have 5 in two variations.

Once I work out what is what I'll post some ads - I definitely don't need 20 film cassettes for one Leica!

 

[Scrambler]

I just rechecked that reference - the odd light shield seems to be from a Type A. so possibly the odd-man-out spool is as well?

I'll post some photos soon.

 

[Scrambler]

3 type "B" Cassettes (FILCA)

DSC08053 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

DSC08054 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

DSC08056 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

Although this group all have flangeless spools, around 1/2 of the type B's have the same spool as the type C

 

[Scrambler]

3 type "C" cassettes (FILCA)

DSC08051 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

DSC08052 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

DSC08057 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

The visible difference is in the spring which has a small washer on it instead of a small bulge in the shell. There are other subtle differences which make the different inner sleeves incompatible.

 

[Scrambler]

6 different spools (not counting the plastic one that came in one FILCA!)

DSC08060 by Scrambler@4350, on Flickr

L -> R KASAM, KASAM, FILCA B/ KASAM, FILCA B, FILCA B & C, FILCA B

The only difference between the last 2 is the milling at the top. Both of these have the small flange extension on the bottom. None of the others have this.

I think that the 4 on the right are Leica, starting with simple and becoming more complex.

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

You'll find a lot about old film and so on here:-

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87322&page=4

but you'll have to go through a lot of posts for the interesting pictures.

EDIT and there's this:-

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89128

A while ago I sat down and measured all the old cassettes I could find but I've lost track of the thread.

Regards, David

 

[Scrambler]

Hi,

You'll find a lot about old film and so on here:-

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87322&page=4

but you'll have to go through a lot of posts for the interesting pictures.

EDIT and there's this:-

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89128

A while ago I sat down and measured all the old cassettes I could find but I've lost track of the thread.

Regards, David

Thanks David. Yes, I had come across your measurement thread and respectfully disagree with your KASAM measurement which I don't think went to the tab. 🙂

I hadn't come across the FILCA variations before and the specifics of the B and C variants seemed worth throwing up in case someone else was struggling with mismatched parts.

I found the reloading inserts for the KASAM an interesting idea. Sometimes it's easy to forget that 35mm predates the Kodak 135 cassette.

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

Any idea where the measurement thread is?

Regards, David

 

[Scrambler]

David, measurements here:

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120930

You measured the Leitz-AGFA KASAM at about 2mm shorter than the FILCA's - which is apx the height of the button/tab which on my examples makes the two the same height between the retaining tabs in the camera.

 

[David Hughes]

Thanks, I've bookmarked it again.

I didn't measure the little lump on the Agfa cassette as I wanted consistency and was mainly wondering why the negatives came out so misplaced.

FWI, I've a lot of anonymous Leitz style cassettes and wonder about them; especially the ones with the curve mark on them.

Although I've a small collection of Leitz catalogues from the 30's I've never seen a KASAM in one and wonder more about it. To confuse the issue a lot of stuff was marked Leitz meaning it fitted or was for the Leicas but wasn't made by Leitz.

Regards, David