rayfoxlee
Raymondo
I am thinking of adding one of these for street photography. I normally shoot M7 or M2, but I am struggling with water marks, dust etc on my films to such an extent, that I am wondering if all the effort is worthwhile, especially now that the Fujis are able to deliver great IQ. I have developed my own films for many years, and never had the problems I am having now. My technique has not changed, but something has got to change if I am to keep shooting film! Still, this post is not about how to improve that situation (I may come back for help here on this!).
What is so great about the Ms is the speed at which you can shoot with zone focusing, especially with the M7 set on aperture priority. My question is this - how well do the Fujis compete in this specific focusing area? Is the auto focus quick enough and is using manual with zone focusing do-able, without resorting to endless menus?
Can anyone with experiences of these cameras vs the Leicas for street work give tell me how they get on?
Thanks all
Ray
What is so great about the Ms is the speed at which you can shoot with zone focusing, especially with the M7 set on aperture priority. My question is this - how well do the Fujis compete in this specific focusing area? Is the auto focus quick enough and is using manual with zone focusing do-able, without resorting to endless menus?
Can anyone with experiences of these cameras vs the Leicas for street work give tell me how they get on?
Thanks all
Ray
rbelyell
Well-known
ray my success rate relative to auto focus with my x100 is way over 90%. in addition, i often zone focus by simply putting the cam in 'manual focus' mode, setting aperture to either 5.6 (DOF=f8 in 35mm terms) or f8, manually setting distance with on screen (or on evf) distance scale. the scale shows in blue the in focus distances at any fstop. it is very conservative and very easy and it works. for manual exposure lovers, it has a shutter speed dial right on top.
my only caution generally regarding the x100 is to remember it is built as an autofocus camera, not a manual focus camera. auto focusing, excellent. zone focusing, no problem. manual focusing, not the right tool.
tony
my only caution generally regarding the x100 is to remember it is built as an autofocus camera, not a manual focus camera. auto focusing, excellent. zone focusing, no problem. manual focusing, not the right tool.
tony
gavinlg
Veteran
The AF on the x100/x-pro1 is more accurate than an equivalent DSLR's autofocus, when you know how it works. The AF is certainly fast enough for daily street use, and the manual focus is designed to be used for scale focussing - not so much 'through the finder' manual focussing. If you use it for the former, it's very very easy.
Many people who like M cameras do not like the Fujis due to the Fujis being very fidgity compared to a M. I would try it in a store before you buy. I love the Fujis and the M, but I've seen many M users get disappointed once they have the X series in their hands.
gavinlg
Veteran
Yep I prefer to think of the fuji's as digital versions of the Contax G's rather than leica M's. And the x100 is more like a hexar AF with manual controls.
furcafe
Veteran
I only have experience w/the X-Pro1, but I agree.
To the OP, the main problem that I've experienced, w/both the Contax G2 & X-Pro1, is that there is no visual confirmation of where the camera has actually focused (unlike an optical RF where you can see the secondary image in the patch); the X-Pro1 is a little better than the G2 because the focus patch/spot does move in the VF to correct for parallax (if you have that function turned on). In practical terms, what this means is that you should always check the distance scale to make sure you're focusing on the right part of the scene (e.g., person's face instead of the street sign behind them). Of course, this is more of an issue when you're shooting at larger apertures (which I often do even when on the street, e.g., @ night or crappy light).
To the OP, the main problem that I've experienced, w/both the Contax G2 & X-Pro1, is that there is no visual confirmation of where the camera has actually focused (unlike an optical RF where you can see the secondary image in the patch); the X-Pro1 is a little better than the G2 because the focus patch/spot does move in the VF to correct for parallax (if you have that function turned on). In practical terms, what this means is that you should always check the distance scale to make sure you're focusing on the right part of the scene (e.g., person's face instead of the street sign behind them). Of course, this is more of an issue when you're shooting at larger apertures (which I often do even when on the street, e.g., @ night or crappy light).
edge100
Well-known
Zone focusing is straight-forward on the X100 and X-Pro1; set your f/stop, and read off the in-focus area from the scale in the OVF or EVF. What I sometimes will do is to turn the LCD on, so that I can easily read off the focusing distance, but set it to switch to the OVF when I put my eye to the camera.
Prior to the 2.0 firmware, there was an annoyingly large amount of shutter lag, that one had to compensate for by half-pressing the shutter. This has been completely rectified.
Also note that the X100 and X-Pro1 are very conservative about the DoF when zone focusing. You'll typically have about 1 stop more DoF than what is indicated.
As for autofocus, I certainly find it fast enough to work with for street photography. It's not DSLR fast, but it focuses as quickly as I can focus a rangefinder. There is a small annoyance with AF, in that the AF point selection button is awkwardly placed on both the X100 and X-Pro1, which leads me to focus and recompose, rather than change the AF point. Not an issue at f/8, but at f/1.4, this could be problematic.
No Leica experience yet, but I'm a previous Bessa R3A user (and current Canonet user), and the X-Pro1 is just as easy to use for street photography as a rangefinder. The Fuji cameras can be as simple or as complicated as you want them to be.
greyelm
Malcolm
You've overlooked the EVF in the X series. With the X100 even in AF you can magnify the EVF to confirm focus as with MF. I have also used micro 4/3 cameras with a number of legacy lenses without focus problems using this method. The new Fuji X-E1 has a higher resolution EVF than both the X100 & X-Pro 1 so this should be even better for confirming focus.
For street photography, whatever the camera, zone focussing, in my opinion is the method of choice.
gavinlg
Veteran
Well - thats only half fair - as you said the focussing point lights up green in the viewfinder in between the 2 'guide' points to show where in the range the camera has locked focus - as can be seen in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rrlp4T3GuL0
Just have to make sure AF correction frame is turned on (as it should be) and if you need really really precise focusing (like f1.4, minimum focus distance) just switch over to the EVF.
Kavenzmann
Member
My only problem with zone focussing on the Fujis:
You have to look at either the Display or the viewfinder. The fly-by-wire focusring isn't that respinsible either.
It's completely different than zone focussing with an M. I usually like to adjust the focus distance with the camera down just by a quick move of the focus lever and the aperture ring. The camera doesn't necessarily to be on.
With the Fuji I turn on the camera first.
Meanwhile I adjust the aperture. Then I set liveview to the display and need 1-3 seconds for adjusting the focus distance (which is not that exact!).
Now I'm ready to shoot...
It works, but I'll get the X-E1 and try my M-Rokkor 28/2,8 for better zone focussing experience.
You have to look at either the Display or the viewfinder. The fly-by-wire focusring isn't that respinsible either.
It's completely different than zone focussing with an M. I usually like to adjust the focus distance with the camera down just by a quick move of the focus lever and the aperture ring. The camera doesn't necessarily to be on.
With the Fuji I turn on the camera first.
Meanwhile I adjust the aperture. Then I set liveview to the display and need 1-3 seconds for adjusting the focus distance (which is not that exact!).
Now I'm ready to shoot...
It works, but I'll get the X-E1 and try my M-Rokkor 28/2,8 for better zone focussing experience.
furcafe
Veteran
I haven't overlooked the EVF, I deliberately ignored it. The whole reason I bought the X-Pro1 is that it has a good OVF. I hope I'm not assuming too much, but since the OP is coming from using an M7 & M2, I'm guessing he wants to know about using the OVF.
As far as zone focusing, it has its place, but it's not a substitute for actual focus (if you have the time to nail it).
As far as zone focusing, it has its place, but it's not a substitute for actual focus (if you have the time to nail it).
furcafe
Veteran
I think I was being wholly fair. I specifically mentioned turning on the corrected AF patch function. My point was that the focus patch is large enough that it can, "corrected" or not, still include something in the scene that you don't want to focus on, hence my advice to check the distance scale. In my experience w/traditional RFs, the only time this can happen w/them is when you're focusing on something w/a repeating pattern.
rbelyell
Well-known
yes yes yes, focusing with traditional RFs is foolproof. thats why i can fill a trashcan with OOF film negatives. my focus-success rate with the X100 is well over 90%, probably close to 95%, counting both AF and zone focus, and my bet is i,m not nearly as good a photographer as the OP. if anyone using a film RF has a better success rate than that, or expects a better rate, my hats off to you!
tony
tony
furcafe
Veteran
Of course traditional RF focusing isn't foolproof. Given enough time, us fools will always find a way to mess things up.
When shooting an RF, I may not be able to focus in time to capture the moment, but I can't remember the last time I focused on the wrong thing. When shooting my G2 or X-Pro1, I will occasionally let the camera focus on the wrong thing when I forget to check the distance scale. Is that a dealbreaker? Obviously not for me because I still own & use both cameras, but it is something that I thought worth pointing out. BTW, I actually started out shooting a G2 (& AF point & shoots, which behave the same way) before I ever got an RF.
When shooting an RF, I may not be able to focus in time to capture the moment, but I can't remember the last time I focused on the wrong thing. When shooting my G2 or X-Pro1, I will occasionally let the camera focus on the wrong thing when I forget to check the distance scale. Is that a dealbreaker? Obviously not for me because I still own & use both cameras, but it is something that I thought worth pointing out. BTW, I actually started out shooting a G2 (& AF point & shoots, which behave the same way) before I ever got an RF.
rbelyell
Well-known
FC, its not just a matter of focusing on the wrong thing. RF focusing is simply not accurate when focusing on the 'right thing' in certain situations. perhaps the same is true for you with the x100. that would the make it no worse than a trad RF. honestly, that has not been an issue for me with the x, and may not be for others.
boomguy57
Well-known
I have to say that IMO the EVF is basically useless on the X100 (no experience with the XP1 for me). It's laggy and stutters when you're focusing. The OVF is the raison d'etre for this X series, which is why I'm puzzled by Fuji's XE1.
rayfoxlee
Raymondo
Thanks for all your posts so far. It occurs to me that there might be an issue with the main subject being towards one side of the frame when using the Fujis - is there? I had just this situation over the weekend when the light was horrible, yet I managed to get a reasonable zone of focus with Tri-X and a fairly large aperture.
Ray
Ray
GaryLH
Veteran
Xp1 evf was laggy as well until the fw2.0 upgrade. It may still be a bit laggy but so far i have not noticed it any longer...
Xe1 is there to capture the nex6/7 types who are not interested in ovf, just the entry price.
Gary
No, because you can use focus and recompose method like you do with a rangefinder.
GaryLH
Veteran
No different then rf camera, just different way of doing things...
af lock either w/ half press or in manual mode afl/ael button, then recompose.
Use zone focus info in ovf/evf/LCD which is part of distance info as u change the f stop a white bar around the current focus points changes accordingly to indicate the dof related info...
The new 14mm lens has distance and dof markings but it maybe the only or of new lenses. All other prototype lenses, the photo don't show the dof info or distance on the lens.
Am I missing something?
Gary