Getting Paid - Best Tactics ?

CameraQuest

CameraQuest

Head Bartender
Staff member
Local time
11:08 AM
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Messages
6,601
You have sold pics, they have published your pics and or articles, they have agreed to pay, but yet they keep trying to evade payment.

Of course you can hire a lawyer, but that gets expensive quickly.

What tactics have worked for you to get paid from reluctant "buyers"?

Stephen
 
Well, your invoice should read something like one-time reproduction rights are after final payment is received. And your payment terms. And get an advance. And ask for accounts payable and ask when your invoice is scheduled for payment. Same things one does for any real business.
 
Are they local? If not the chances are slim.

I've been in business since 1968 and had a few that tried to shaft me but with one exception I e collected. The one I didn't collect was across the country

I had to take one to small claims court. This was about 20 years ago and the amount was around $1k or just under. There are no lawyers involved and you present your own case and the defendant presents theirs. I won a judgement above the actual dispute. The defendant though did not pay the judgment and I had to file additional papers and had her car impounded. In the end it cost the defendant several times the judgment. On investigation I discovered she had done this to every photographer she had assigned work to.

There have been a few others too. It really depends on who and what as to how to handle it.

Good luck!

Isn't business fun!!!
 
No full rez shots till they are paid for, unless I really know the client well. I made many wedding movies last decade and I quickly learned, get the money then send the movie. Never had a complaint that way. Never worth the hassle to be a bill collector.
 
I warn people that are trying to become professional photographers about this kind of thing. It's fun to make photos and sell them but you must have a good head for business and a strong stomach and not let people run over you. I spoke with a lawyer on a shoot a few years ago and discussed this exact thing. She told me this is the new way of doing business. If a company can screw 10% of their vendors that's 10% more on the bottom line. These companies know that individuals can't afford to take them to court and if they're out of state it's nearly impossible. Also if you don't have a written co tract then it's he said and she said.
 
I've been self-employed (publishing - everything from copy-editing to photography) since 1989 and haven't had a client not pay. Mostly it's common sense and being seen as professional - have a well-designed website and stationery, agreeing terms, and contracts if you think they're necessary, researching the client, providing quotes, requesting a formal written brief, etc. If it's a new client and you're unsure about them, agree payment in advance of starting the job or payment before delivery, and send an invoice (on time).

Both you and the client should know exactly where each stands, and have all the necessary info - including penalties (for you if, say, you don't deliver by a crucial deadline; for the client, if, for example, they don't adhere to the agreed payment terms). And it's not about being hard nosed either - you should be open and friendly with the client while doing the aforementioned stuff.

If clients realise they're dealing with a serious business not a clueless bumbler, they're less likely to try anything dodgy (I should point out that 99% of clients are totally decent - dodgy clients are very rare, thankfully!).

Always join a trade union and/or a professional body for your trade - they will be able to offer advice and practical help if needed (mine gives free legal advice and will investigate cases and blacklist offending clients). And, as X-Ray said, there's the small claims court if the client won't pay (most countries have something similar) that's designed to handle this kind of thing easily - you don't need a solicitor, it's straightforward, fast and costs you nothing to bring a legitimate claim. Expensive lawyers are not needed. If the client loses the case - which they will if it's non-payment and you've followed the brief to the letter - they'll have to pay any court costs.

Most clients have a reputation to protect, so if they're messing you around and are reticent to pay, make it clear you will take them to the small claims court, which will affect their credit rating, and will report them to your trade organisation, who will warn their members about the client or blacklist them. And be professional - do not be rude, threaten or bluster. They need to understand that you've a clear head, know exactly what you're doing, and won't be going away.

In most cases of non-payment I know of, the person supplying the work did not act as a business should - making mistakes such as supplying work to a new client without finding out about them and then invoicing after giving the client the work. That's no excuse for the client of course, but trust should only be given if it's deserved.
 
It happened to me Stephen, I was published in View Camera magazine, and promised our agreed upon rate. After the article came out, I never got paid, and spent many months trying to get a return call or email from the editor. I eventually gave up, after discovering he did that to many authors and photographers (and his website developer). You just move on....but spread the word.
 
Had very few problems when I had my business. For most gigs I got a retainer up front (that covered my expenses), and, at first I was thinking, if I get stiffed, then what actions would I take. After the gig, I had a business meeting and received final payment. No payment, no photographs. Never had to say that though. After my education with Monte I quickly moved up to a client base that could afford me. One of the ingredients I saw, associated with various pro organizations, was how little photographers charged. Last few years, primary income were business headshot portraits where I received entire payment up front.

Maybe I was lucky but maybe some other stuff was there with my biz.
 
Sustaining a small percentage of loss due to unpaid invoices i simply part of being in business. It happens.

In the US small claims court nay be one avenue to pursue.

For local transactions I signed up as a credit card merchant with a nation-wide bank. The bank provides a card swiper and App for my mobile phone. It is simple and secure to receive payment at the time of the transaction. I don't mind the bank fees because the time I spending, tracking and recording invoices is reduced (and it's a tax write off).
 
goamules said:
It happened to me Stephen, I was published in View Camera magazine, and promised our agreed upon rate. After the article came out, I never got paid, and spent many months trying to get a return call or email from the editor. I eventually gave up, after discovering he did that to many authors and photographers (and his website developer). You just move on....but spread the word.
Click to expand...

There is always the small claims court option.
 
I get paid for my prints upfront. Jobs are another story. I had a client in London try to shaft me after they hired me to do a portrait shoot. I found out the publisher had an office here in NYC and called them. It took over 6 months after publication to finally receive a check. The editor and photo editor in London did not return my emails or phone calls. Luckily it came from their NY office and was in dollars. Luckily I kept all my correspondence.
 
Getting Paid

Getting Paid

Depending on the "shoot" I recommend registering your copyright. Learn the on line process. Once registered, for instance a fashion shoot that includes jewelry, carry bags and clothes on a model for a fashion magazine, you will have no problem finding a lawyer - after all else fails in the collection process. There are statutory fees and damages and under some circumstances, the jeweler, bag maker and publisher could be responsible for payment. Nothing more embarassing than a publisher being accosted for non payment for a paid for advertisement. If all else fails......
 
goamules said:
It happened to me Stephen, I was published in View Camera magazine, and promised our agreed upon rate. After the article came out, I never got paid, and spent many months trying to get a return call or email from the editor. I eventually gave up, after discovering he did that to many authors and photographers (and his website developer). You just move on....but spread the word.
Click to expand...

Avoid View Camera magazine like the plague. Noted. Helping spread the word.
 
goamules said:
It happened to me Stephen, I was published in View Camera magazine, and promised our agreed upon rate. After the article came out, I never got paid, and spent many months trying to get a return call or email from the editor. I eventually gave up, after discovering he did that to many authors and photographers (and his website developer). You just move on....but spread the word.
Click to expand...

Huh... I didn't know they were such scumbags. Spread the word indeed.

I warn people that are trying to become professional photographers about this kind of thing. It's fun to make photos and sell them but you must have a good head for business and a strong stomach and not let people run over you. I spoke with a lawyer on a shoot a few years ago and discussed this exact thing. She told me this is the new way of doing business. If a company can screw 10% of their vendors that's 10% more on the bottom line. These companies know that individuals can't afford to take them to court and if they're out of state it's nearly impossible. Also if you don't have a written co tract then it's he said and she said.
Click to expand...
Good Gawdamighty, why do people have to be such sh@t-heads??

There's a lot of that in my area, too. Some people have decided that it is their God-given right to exploit, cheat, use, abuse, not pay and steal from photographers. There are ways to aviod being buggered by scumbags, though. Several have been pointed out -

Copyright register all images from each shoot (include registration cost in your fees so client pays them);
Get and use a credit card swiper
Do not do a shoot without a written and signed contract that spells out every last detail of the job and payment requirements
Do not deliver files till you are paid in full
Do not deliver prints/albums until you are paid in full
Get a 50% retainer up front

There is no reason an unknown, unproven client should expect you to extend them credit by doing their shoot, letting them have the files or prints and then hoping they will deign to actually pay you in 30 days. Or in 60. Or in 90. Or in 120. Or in 287,000.

Car dealers don't do that. Camera stores don't, either. Neither do banks. Why should photographers do that? The answer is simple: We shouldn't. Extending credit to unknown, unproven clients is just asking to get buggered.

Bottom line: In God We Trust, All Others Pay Up Front.
 
daves said:
No publication in the world, as far as I know, and I've been published in a few of them, pays for images before they've been printed.
Click to expand...

What I wrote is that your invoice can have wordage that reproduction rights are not granted until full payment has been received. Some publications will go ahead and publish, but they do so having been forewarned that they don't have the reproduction rights -- as such it is an easier matter to point that out and get paid. What's interesting is to read said publication's contract with advertisers -- they generally insist upon getting paid net 10 from acceptance of ad. So they have your money and it's not a hardship for them to pay -- well not really.
 
My contract includes late payment language specifically addressing the increasing percentage they owe the later it gets. A reminder of that fact from time to time, usually gets results.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom