bwcolor
Veteran
segedi
RFicianado
Very interesting rumor. The A-12 was only announced on August 5th! And I have one on the way... And a NEX-5n just arrived today. Really like the handling of the Ricoh, the NEX is a tad small. It would be nice if a new GXR body with built-in VF were also announced soon.
Chyn
Established
This rumor certainly complicates plans for a backup to the M8. Ricoh's dedication to ergonomics is legendary and the A12 M-mount is really good, but the NEX-5n is available now and I can get close-focusing ability with the aid of adapters. Hmmmm.
bwcolor
Veteran
You might want to wait until mid January prior to taking the plunge. Fujifilm will have announced their new mirrorless.
Adanac
Well-known
I shot the NEX-5N for several weeks - and had a Hawk adapter - and generally liked the experience, but I sold the NEX and EVF and now have a GXR and EVF and wouldn't go back.
The thing I miss most about the NEX is not the NEX but missing the Hawk adapter.
The thing I miss least about the NEX is overall performance with my Biogons. The GXR delivers better results, edge to edge, corner to corner.
There are a few things the NEX does better today than the GXR but of those that are important to me, the A16 Mount will probably fix a few of them - certainly we'll see much improved sensitivity, and even higher resolution which good lenses will give a work out to. Maybe raw write times will improve, if the bottleneck was at the sensor.
Maybe a body and EVF refresh is also in the works for early in the new year too. If not, I can wait.
The thing I miss most about the NEX is not the NEX but missing the Hawk adapter.
The thing I miss least about the NEX is overall performance with my Biogons. The GXR delivers better results, edge to edge, corner to corner.
There are a few things the NEX does better today than the GXR but of those that are important to me, the A16 Mount will probably fix a few of them - certainly we'll see much improved sensitivity, and even higher resolution which good lenses will give a work out to. Maybe raw write times will improve, if the bottleneck was at the sensor.
Maybe a body and EVF refresh is also in the works for early in the new year too. If not, I can wait.
Chyn
Established
bwcolor: Definitely waiting for Fuji's next offensive on this front.
Adanac: Thank you for that, it was exactly this setup that I was interested in. The GXR's main competitive edge is its ability to maximize the most important properties of the M-mount lenses. However, after seeing the close-up focusing ability of the Hawk adapter, I wonder if it's technically feasible for Hawk Peng or anyone to come up with such a mod for the GXR. It's not a necessity, but it does open up some new possibilities.
When you mean Biogon, are you referring to the 21mm or the 35mm variants?
Adanac: Thank you for that, it was exactly this setup that I was interested in. The GXR's main competitive edge is its ability to maximize the most important properties of the M-mount lenses. However, after seeing the close-up focusing ability of the Hawk adapter, I wonder if it's technically feasible for Hawk Peng or anyone to come up with such a mod for the GXR. It's not a necessity, but it does open up some new possibilities.
When you mean Biogon, are you referring to the 21mm or the 35mm variants?
bwcolor
Veteran
I've had a NEX-7 on order since August 24th, but also have 21mm and 35mm Biogons... the latter is my favorite lenses. Both lenses pretty useless with the NEX-7. The A16 would be a good choice for me, but I just can't make the switch until I get a NEX-7 type EVF in the GXR. Of course, Fuji may make all these considerations moot.. maybe
Chyn
Established
Is it because of the color shifts at the edges? There's no way that this effect could not be fixed via firmware?
In an ideal world, I will be using a GXR with an built-in OLED EVF matching Sony's, with a standard hot-shoe and no color shifts when using wide-angle lenses.
In an ideal world, I will be using a GXR with an built-in OLED EVF matching Sony's, with a standard hot-shoe and no color shifts when using wide-angle lenses.
Adanac
Well-known
The issue with the NEX-7 and certain rangefinder wides unfortunately isn't limited just to colour shift and vignetting in the corners and edges - the real problem is detail smearing with at least some of these lenses. The problem exists on the 5, was mitigated somewhat on the 5N, and is back with apparent vengeance on the 7.
It may be that we could pick and choose our lenses and avoid the worst of these issues, but that doesn't seem very reasonable to me given it is possible to design a camera to work well with Biogons and other such affected designs, and there is no guarantee that Sony's next camera won't inflict some other pain on rangefinder lenses. If one is to tie their fortunes that tightly to what Sony is doing, then one should simply by E or A mount lenses and be done with it.
It may be that we could pick and choose our lenses and avoid the worst of these issues, but that doesn't seem very reasonable to me given it is possible to design a camera to work well with Biogons and other such affected designs, and there is no guarantee that Sony's next camera won't inflict some other pain on rangefinder lenses. If one is to tie their fortunes that tightly to what Sony is doing, then one should simply by E or A mount lenses and be done with it.
Chyn
Established
Adanac,
Just today, I came across a thread over on the Ricoh Forum at dpreview which clearly demonstrated the color smearing you referred to. What a bummer. It would seem that Ricoh's GXR is the most promising in terms of maximizing our M-mount lens performance. Sony might be cutting edge, but Ricoh seems to be more committed towards the niche that I care more about.
Just today, I came across a thread over on the Ricoh Forum at dpreview which clearly demonstrated the color smearing you referred to. What a bummer. It would seem that Ricoh's GXR is the most promising in terms of maximizing our M-mount lens performance. Sony might be cutting edge, but Ricoh seems to be more committed towards the niche that I care more about.
willie_901
Veteran
I wonder if SONY's product managers care one tiny bit about performance with M mount lenses. I would enjoy reading the functional specs for the NEX cameras to see if M lens performance is even discussed.
Adanac
Well-known
Willie, I've wondered exactly the same thing. It'd be great to be a fly on the wall at Sony design HQ.
No doubt the camera designers were well aware that by choosing a very small flange focal distance, there would be plenty of opportunity to adapt other lenses. That's not exactly a new development in photography, but Sony having the about the shortest FFD means almost any lens used on interchangeable cameras could be adapted.
I've always wondered if they made that conscious decision mostly to achieve an ultra-thin body, and that being a host for adapted lenses was a secondary concern, albeit a very nice to have ability they can use for marketing without any real cost to the company.
No doubt the camera designers were well aware that by choosing a very small flange focal distance, there would be plenty of opportunity to adapt other lenses. That's not exactly a new development in photography, but Sony having the about the shortest FFD means almost any lens used on interchangeable cameras could be adapted.
I've always wondered if they made that conscious decision mostly to achieve an ultra-thin body, and that being a host for adapted lenses was a secondary concern, albeit a very nice to have ability they can use for marketing without any real cost to the company.
useless generation
Established
would be keen on this!
kanzlr
Hexaneur
you know you can add an R-M Adapter and use, say an Elmarit-R 60 Makro?
artur5
Member
In fact, almost any SLR lens can be adapted to a M camera - Plenty of adapters, even for exotic mounts. With a Leica M, it doesn't makes much sense, you couldn't focus with the rangefinder, but for the Ricoh module that option opens a whole world of macro, long teles, zooms.. in case you need it.
The only range of lenses which you can use on the NEX but not on the GXR A12-M are the Contax-G RFs
( a Contax G to M mount conversion is feasible but so pricey that it defeats the purpose )
The only range of lenses which you can use on the NEX but not on the GXR A12-M are the Contax-G RFs
( a Contax G to M mount conversion is feasible but so pricey that it defeats the purpose )
dreilly
Chillin' in Geneva
Olympus Pen F lenses should be added to the list of those which work on Nex but not on M. And they are spectacular little lenses. I just recently tried the 25mm f2.8 and in most of the frame it was as good as the Zeiss ZM. The edges were a little less sharp wide open. I have the 38 f1.8 on the Nex and it's also a cracker of a lens, extremely sharp.
I'm thinking about moving back to the Ricoh for a number of reasons, but I would miss the Pen 38mm. My other favorite on the Nex, my Contax G 45/2, is off to be converted. Digitalintrigue is sending a bunch of lenses over to Taiwan to get converted to M, you can read about that in the Contax forum. It's not cheap but the final price with the lens donor doesn't exceed the Zeiss ZM 50/2 Planar, which i found to be just okay. The 45/2 Planar, on the other hand, is a wicked, wicked lens.
I'm thinking about moving back to the Ricoh for a number of reasons, but I would miss the Pen 38mm. My other favorite on the Nex, my Contax G 45/2, is off to be converted. Digitalintrigue is sending a bunch of lenses over to Taiwan to get converted to M, you can read about that in the Contax forum. It's not cheap but the final price with the lens donor doesn't exceed the Zeiss ZM 50/2 Planar, which i found to be just okay. The 45/2 Planar, on the other hand, is a wicked, wicked lens.
kanzlr
Hexaneur
true. I use a Leica Elmarit-R 60/2.8 and Minolta MD 85/2 and 200/4 with great results.
craygc
Well-known
Well for the effort that seems to go into the Nex bodies, Sony doesn't even seem to care much about the performance of their own lenses ...they're all relatively pedestrian performers
Matus
Well-known
Any "updates" on the rumors about the A16 M-mount module (that should replace the current A12)? Just being plain curios ...