Steve M.
Veteran
Guess the title says it all. Just buy a Leica or even a Bessa, don't screw around w/ a FSU camera. I will NEVER buy another one of these pieces of junk ever again.
It all started a few years ago when I bought a Zorki 4. Great viewfinder, but I never could get a whole roll of photos out of it due to intermittent shutter capping. Sold it a loss and decided, what the heck, this guy Oleg in the Ukraine is highly rated, I'll buy a camera from him. They're supposed to be fully ckd out and CLA'd. Ha! The Fed 1 I bought arrived in the customary brown paper and yak string and at first I was happy. It sure looked good, but after a roll of film it was apparent the shutter was full of pin holes. So I sent it back, waited forever, and it came back w/ new shutter curtains and a freebie J8 lens he threw in. Guess what? The new shutter had pinholes. Not as many as the first ones, but enough to ruin almost every photo. Sold it at a loss.
Bought a Fed 2. Worked great for one roll. A miracle! But the second roll showed, what else, pin holes in the shutter. Sat it aside.
Bought a Fed 2 that had been CLA'd from a member here. Light leaks on the first roll. Tried to see where they were coming from, tried another back on it from my other bad Fed 2. Light leaks again. Sent it back to the seller and lost the shipping money both ways.
Bought two Fed 2's from fleabay, thinking MAYBE one will work. First one arrived. Hey, where's the strap lugs? Turns out that some of the later models didn't have them. OK, that's on me. Should have looked at the photos on the ad better. Hmmm, the film wind knob sure is stiff. And the shutter curtain is very slow to close on 1/30. Other speeds seem somewhat OK, except for 1/500 which is actually slower than 1/250. Put my sacrificial roll of film in it. Got the film back. Hmmm, the shutter is capping. Ok, what the heck I'll sell it at a loss. I know the drill now.
In a desperate fit of insanity I emailed Yuri over at FEDKA. Explained the troubles I've had. He replies that the Fed's have the simplest and most reliable shutters of all the FSU cameras. Says I just have bad luck w/ the Fed 2's. Ok, I'll send him the Fed 2 that has pinholes in the shutter for a CLA & shutter replacement.
So now I sit here waiting on my other fleabay Fed 2 to arrive, as well as the overhauled camera from Yuri. When they arrive, I won't even run any film through them. I am selling them. At a loss of course. And I will Never, Ever buy another one of these tin cans again. No one consistently has this sort of bad luck, as Yuri suggested. It's that these things are junk. I'll just buy a Leica or even a clacking Bessa R variant (plastic feel, loud shutters, but they work).
It all started a few years ago when I bought a Zorki 4. Great viewfinder, but I never could get a whole roll of photos out of it due to intermittent shutter capping. Sold it a loss and decided, what the heck, this guy Oleg in the Ukraine is highly rated, I'll buy a camera from him. They're supposed to be fully ckd out and CLA'd. Ha! The Fed 1 I bought arrived in the customary brown paper and yak string and at first I was happy. It sure looked good, but after a roll of film it was apparent the shutter was full of pin holes. So I sent it back, waited forever, and it came back w/ new shutter curtains and a freebie J8 lens he threw in. Guess what? The new shutter had pinholes. Not as many as the first ones, but enough to ruin almost every photo. Sold it at a loss.
Bought a Fed 2. Worked great for one roll. A miracle! But the second roll showed, what else, pin holes in the shutter. Sat it aside.
Bought a Fed 2 that had been CLA'd from a member here. Light leaks on the first roll. Tried to see where they were coming from, tried another back on it from my other bad Fed 2. Light leaks again. Sent it back to the seller and lost the shipping money both ways.
Bought two Fed 2's from fleabay, thinking MAYBE one will work. First one arrived. Hey, where's the strap lugs? Turns out that some of the later models didn't have them. OK, that's on me. Should have looked at the photos on the ad better. Hmmm, the film wind knob sure is stiff. And the shutter curtain is very slow to close on 1/30. Other speeds seem somewhat OK, except for 1/500 which is actually slower than 1/250. Put my sacrificial roll of film in it. Got the film back. Hmmm, the shutter is capping. Ok, what the heck I'll sell it at a loss. I know the drill now.
In a desperate fit of insanity I emailed Yuri over at FEDKA. Explained the troubles I've had. He replies that the Fed's have the simplest and most reliable shutters of all the FSU cameras. Says I just have bad luck w/ the Fed 2's. Ok, I'll send him the Fed 2 that has pinholes in the shutter for a CLA & shutter replacement.
So now I sit here waiting on my other fleabay Fed 2 to arrive, as well as the overhauled camera from Yuri. When they arrive, I won't even run any film through them. I am selling them. At a loss of course. And I will Never, Ever buy another one of these tin cans again. No one consistently has this sort of bad luck, as Yuri suggested. It's that these things are junk. I'll just buy a Leica or even a clacking Bessa R variant (plastic feel, loud shutters, but they work).
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aad
Not so new now.
I never did understand the attraction.
I have two Zorki 3M's, just sold the third to an RFF member. They do not give me trouble.
apconan
-
what a troll
Pickett Wilson
Veteran
I have several Feds that have been good cameras. I've had some duds, too. But, they are old cameras. I've had dud Leicas, as well.
Drewus
Established
Personally I think you're better off just buying a barnack than going for one of the Russian copies. It's more expensive, but in the long run you get a far better product.
dee
Well-known
I can understand your frustration , but back in 2005 I took two new to me Fed 1gs and one Leica IIIc body on holiday .
The Feds behaved perfectly and the Leica leaked like the proverbial sieve .
... those Feds were much maligned rebuilt black ' Leicas ' .
These , at least , were rebuilt cameras , any 1950s camera which has never been serviced is likely to fail .
I hope that Yuri comes up trumps - try the Yuri camera .
The Feds behaved perfectly and the Leica leaked like the proverbial sieve .
... those Feds were much maligned rebuilt black ' Leicas ' .
These , at least , were rebuilt cameras , any 1950s camera which has never been serviced is likely to fail .
I hope that Yuri comes up trumps - try the Yuri camera .
jmcd
Well-known
I had two Fed 2 cameras worked on by Yuri. One worked great and one still had a problem. Any camera can be finicky. Yuri admitted that Russian cameras can be finicky, and promptly offered to refund my money for the problematic camera—I took the refund in Ilford film. So, yes, the Russian cameras are an adventure, and there are probably better bets for outright reliability. And Yuri in my book is a real stand-up guy.
gliderbee
Well-known
I can understand your frustration, but there are good FSU's; you just need some luck (I was lucky with 2 out of 3; the 3rd one has a lose shutter dial).
What I don't understand is your comment about Bessa R variants, and for me, it starts feeling as "good custom" when talking about Bessa's to sneer a bit; if you say "plastic feel", have you ever had a (e.g.) Nikon or Canon DSLR in your hands ? THAT's plastic; I agree the Bessa's are not like the Leica's or Canon P's, and the shutter is indeed louder, but I think they are VERY nice and well made camera's (and I'm not even taking the price into the equation). I have owned a M3 and a few Leica III, still own a Canon P, two Canon IV, and Bessa R3A, R3M, R2M and R2A and R4A (don't tell my wife
) and quite some "modern" camera's, and I think nor the feel nor the Bessa's shutter sound are that bad as you make it sound here Regards,
Stefan.
Steve M.
Veteran
Why am I a troll? That's an idiotic comment. Is stating my experiences w/ these things trolling? I could care less what you think apconan, it's just that some people may not realize what they're getting into w/ these cameras. Wish that it weren't that way, as they sure are pretty. I love the way the Fed 2 cameras look. But actually relying on one to bring home the shots? Not on your life. No one could possibly have had simply a bad patch of buying these AND attempting to get them fixed. Must be the cameras, which may explain why they go for 25 bucks. Ah, but that's just the beginning of the money pit.
My main problem w/ the Bessa cameras Stefan is the loud shutters on them (ok, I did have a rewind crank break in half on a Bessa R once). It isn't snobbery (I bought a bunch of cheap Russian cameras, remember). The whole camera sort of vibrates when you fire the shutter on the R's, and I've owned a few as well as an R3a. They are fine for what they cost, but anyone who appreciates the fine craftsmanship of good cameras will be disappointed. On the other hand, tactile feel not withstanding, if I had simply bought a Bessa R to begin with I would have saved a ton of money, time, and film, and had a few rolls of properly exposed photos to show for it, so the Bessas have their points to be sure.
My main problem w/ the Bessa cameras Stefan is the loud shutters on them (ok, I did have a rewind crank break in half on a Bessa R once). It isn't snobbery (I bought a bunch of cheap Russian cameras, remember). The whole camera sort of vibrates when you fire the shutter on the R's, and I've owned a few as well as an R3a. They are fine for what they cost, but anyone who appreciates the fine craftsmanship of good cameras will be disappointed. On the other hand, tactile feel not withstanding, if I had simply bought a Bessa R to begin with I would have saved a ton of money, time, and film, and had a few rolls of properly exposed photos to show for it, so the Bessas have their points to be sure.
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Philly
-
RichC
Well-known
I'm a digital-only photographer and never used film until recently - my first camera was a Canon digital SLR.
A year or so ago I fancied trying film. I decided on a medium-format camera as my digital camera already meets my "35mm" needs. I wanted a folder because they're compact.
The first camera I bought was an Iskra, going by its high specifications (on paper) and glowing reports by users waxing lyrical.
Big mistake! I’ve never seen such a crude, poorly built and finished machine in my life - it looks like it was made and designed by a blacksmith! And it’s an ergonomic nightmare; for example, the knurling on the controls is so sharp that it takes the skin off your fingers, and the focusing lever disappears awkwardly behind a strut! And the leather case smelt like urine - really, it did! Then the shutter jammed, tearing the blades!
I really can't see the attraction of Soviet cameras if you want a camera for serious use as opposed to an ornament...
It's replacement is a Certo-Six, which I've heavily modified (required a hacksaw and files!) to make it more usable and behave more like a modern camera. The ergonomics still aren't brilliant, but at least it's usable...
A year or so ago I fancied trying film. I decided on a medium-format camera as my digital camera already meets my "35mm" needs. I wanted a folder because they're compact.
The first camera I bought was an Iskra, going by its high specifications (on paper) and glowing reports by users waxing lyrical.
Big mistake! I’ve never seen such a crude, poorly built and finished machine in my life - it looks like it was made and designed by a blacksmith! And it’s an ergonomic nightmare; for example, the knurling on the controls is so sharp that it takes the skin off your fingers, and the focusing lever disappears awkwardly behind a strut! And the leather case smelt like urine - really, it did! Then the shutter jammed, tearing the blades!
I really can't see the attraction of Soviet cameras if you want a camera for serious use as opposed to an ornament...
It's replacement is a Certo-Six, which I've heavily modified (required a hacksaw and files!) to make it more usable and behave more like a modern camera. The ergonomics still aren't brilliant, but at least it's usable...
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julio1fer
Well-known
Hard to argue with your experience, Steve M. Indeed you'd be better off with a modern camera, and you were unlucky. But maybe you expected too much of these little FSU instruments?
These Russkies are 50+ year old cameras, usually never serviced, often badly adjusted at the factory itself. Some materials, such as shutter curtains, were never intended to last so long and will need replacement (even Leicas and Contaxes need it). Mechanical issues are to be expected. Patience and a friendly technician (or your own mechanical skills) are a necessity if you are going to mess with the FSU world at all. These are not shining new models made by robots and fresh from the factory.
That said, it's quite amazing that these cameras sometimes can work right out of the brown paper and yak string package (all but one of my five FSU have). I find it even more amazing that their optics are often par of much more expensive and classy cameras.
As for handling and ergonomics, RichC, these FSU designs are contemporary of the A-model Ford. Rough, quirky and made to last. Not the place to look for brilliant ergonomics, least of all in folders. I'd actually recommend a TLR as a first step on film for digital users, but that is quite OT.
Note: as I understand it, "troll" is Internet slang for a wily post intended to raise flames - don't believe the original post was a troll, but rather a reminder of what the FSU experience may be like. Trolls are best left unanswered!
These Russkies are 50+ year old cameras, usually never serviced, often badly adjusted at the factory itself. Some materials, such as shutter curtains, were never intended to last so long and will need replacement (even Leicas and Contaxes need it). Mechanical issues are to be expected. Patience and a friendly technician (or your own mechanical skills) are a necessity if you are going to mess with the FSU world at all. These are not shining new models made by robots and fresh from the factory.
That said, it's quite amazing that these cameras sometimes can work right out of the brown paper and yak string package (all but one of my five FSU have). I find it even more amazing that their optics are often par of much more expensive and classy cameras.
As for handling and ergonomics, RichC, these FSU designs are contemporary of the A-model Ford. Rough, quirky and made to last. Not the place to look for brilliant ergonomics, least of all in folders. I'd actually recommend a TLR as a first step on film for digital users, but that is quite OT.
Note: as I understand it, "troll" is Internet slang for a wily post intended to raise flames - don't believe the original post was a troll, but rather a reminder of what the FSU experience may be like. Trolls are best left unanswered!
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brachal
Refrigerated User
I've bought several cameras from Yuri. Only one had any problems at all, and he promptly replaced it. I've used his repair service twice, and have been thoroughly pleased. My first Barnack Leica worked for 3 shots, and then the shutter failed completely. My second started capping after a couple of months. All of these things are at least 50 years old at this point; what do you expect? Any 50 year old camera will probably need work before you use it.
Personally, I will never buy another late-production Kiev. Those are to be avoided. On the other hand, I've had very good luck with a Fed-2, Fed-3, and Kiev-2a.
Personally, I will never buy another late-production Kiev. Those are to be avoided. On the other hand, I've had very good luck with a Fed-2, Fed-3, and Kiev-2a.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Steve, I can understand your pain, were I in your shoes, I'd be huffing mad also.
I think it's best for you not to mess with FSU cameras for a while, maybe a long while
Come back several years from now and find a good CLA'd Zorki 6, the latter production, the better. It has bright and contrasty rangefinder patch, and swing-back with no removable spools to mess with. The shutter on mine is not leaking light, here's a picture:
I think it's best for you not to mess with FSU cameras for a while, maybe a long while
Come back several years from now and find a good CLA'd Zorki 6, the latter production, the better. It has bright and contrasty rangefinder patch, and swing-back with no removable spools to mess with. The shutter on mine is not leaking light, here's a picture:
pakeha
Well-known
Bad experience Steve, of course there is no way any of the cameras were left in direct sunlight with caps off ?
Yeah, the Troll comment a bit heavy but to be expected , you see you had a problem with a couple of FED cameras, but your post is aimed at all FSU. If it happened to be a canon with problems would you post against buying Japanese - Argus, American, Telka, French etc, etc?
Scoose me, but i`ve seen a few Leica/Bessa problems discussed here, ah, quite a few.
Part of the whole deal i quess, some are lucky, some not. Hopefully better luck for you with a Bessa/Leica. regards
Yeah, the Troll comment a bit heavy but to be expected , you see you had a problem with a couple of FED cameras, but your post is aimed at all FSU. If it happened to be a canon with problems would you post against buying Japanese - Argus, American, Telka, French etc, etc?
Scoose me, but i`ve seen a few Leica/Bessa problems discussed here, ah, quite a few.
Part of the whole deal i quess, some are lucky, some not. Hopefully better luck for you with a Bessa/Leica. regards
xxloverxx
Shoot.
I think your shutter pinholes were due to pointing the camera towards the sky for a period of time (the lens magnifies the light and sets the shutter burning).
Never tried a Fed or Zorki, but I have a Kiev 4a (1973) (metal shutter) and it works perfectly. And it's been banged around like crazy.
Never tried a Fed or Zorki, but I have a Kiev 4a (1973) (metal shutter) and it works perfectly. And it's been banged around like crazy.
-doomed-
film is exciting
I had a zorki 1c that was almost as good as my IIIf , the Leica is really a better camera but that zorki was pretty good
bgb
Well-known
I feel you pain mate as a non working camera isn't even a good hammer, my Fed 2 was ok but maybe i got lucky
A Leica would be a better bet any day but sometimes we need to learn the hard way ...
A Leica would be a better bet any day but sometimes we need to learn the hard way ...
gilpen123
Gil
Definitely not a troll, I appreciate this kind of info as it help people's decision making process easier. A hit or miss is a gamble, if the person buying is a 1st time RF user, it may completely turn him off. I've seen some nice working FSUs and some problematic ones as well though I've never used or owned one.