Macro options for FED or Zorki?

Klink

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Hi there. I'm just about to pull the trigger on a FED-1 but I wanted to check in here regarding the quality and availably, or even specific recommendations for macro lenses for the FED-1. Is macro photography on a RF even a thing? I'm a biologist, and in the summer I like taking pictures of insects and botanical pics, usually in fully sunlight or strong indirectly light, when most insects are actually active. I'm entirely new to the M format. I'm a previous user of a Voigtlander Vito-B (broke on me), which the FED-1 will hopefully replace, and maybe even add the macro functionality lacking in the Vito-B. Help is much appreciated. I suppose I would also be interested
 
Hi there. I'm just about to pull the trigger on a FED-1 but I wanted to check in here regarding the quality and availably, or even specific recommendations for macro lenses for the FED-1. Is macro photography on a RF even a thing? I'm a biologist, and in the summer I like taking pictures of insects and botanical pics, usually in fully sunlight or strong indirectly light, when most insects are actually active. I'm entirely new to the M format. I'm a previous user of a Voigtlander Vito-B (broke on me), which the FED-1 will hopefully replace, and maybe even add the macro functionality lacking in the Vito-B. Help is much appreciated. I suppose I would also be interested
You can get a Leica Visoflex to convert your Barnack-style rf camera to an slr, but it requires special lenses and is very costly
More economical and practical to get any slr to which you can add accessory close-up lenses and bellows.
 
Do yourself a favor and get an Exa, or a Praktiflex FX, and you can find plenty of macro lenses and bellows, tubes, etc. for very little money and have a field day.

extennnnd by Berang Berang, on Flickr

steam pipe by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Strongly recommend a camera with a waist level finder. Sure you can get a later Praktica and use any M42 equipment, but the waist level finder makes critical focus much easier, and generally is just less of a pain to use on a tripod.
 
Macro with RFs is rather unusual and dates back to a period, when cameras were super expensive and the only camera you had was an RF but you wanted to take macro pictures.
Just get an inexpensive SLR (Praktica eg) and macro bellows or extension tubes.
 
@Klink, follow your dreams! Don't let the doubters bring you down! 😅

Macro with an RF is possible, just awkward. I dabble in it from time to time because I don't like or want to use an SLR, so doing three or four shots in an SLR for macro means the film will sit in there for upwards of a year until I've done enough to develop it - which is even less feasible than the Rube Goldberg arrangements needed for macro on an RF.

I'm not sure what native FED solutions there were, but as long as you get a postwar FED 1 (i.e. one with a standardised flange to film distance), most of the macro and close focus tools made for the early Leicas will work perfectly. This gives you a few options:

My preferred option is the Focoslide - I made a thread about it here: The Focoslide: not just for photocopies

1764765467061.png

This is a slow rig, but gives you the most options with regards to lenses and focusing distances. I don't know the exact reproduction sizes off the top of my head, but here's the working distances:
50mm lenses:
30cm to 26cm
OR 42cm to 19.5cm with Elmar & VXZOO mount
OR 90mm to 31.5cm with Summar & ZWTOO-HESUM mount

90mm lenses:
83cm to 53cm
OR 83cm to infinity using a 90mm Elmar with “Universal Repro Elmar” short mount

135mm lenses:
170cm to 94cm

On the other hand, the Visoflex is a more direct option - an LTM Visoflex turns the FED into an SLR when you need it, but it's only really useable from 90mm up with very specific lenses. The Visoflex 2 gives you a more direct linkage between raising the mirror and firing the shutter, but an LTM one is hard to come by.

IMG_1065.JPG
(This is a Visoflex 1 mounting the 280mm Telyt - note that the button to raise the mirror is on the mirror box and has to be operated seperately. You can get double cable releases, but it's still not a handheld setup unless you have nimble fingers!)

There's also a couple of copy stands and copy-stand-adjacent options which are more useful for flat objects, but can be used for other things at a pinch. The two I own are the BOOWU and the BELUN; the BOOWU gives you 1:4, 1:6, and 1:9 reproductions, and the BELUN gives you perfect 1:1 reproduction:

1764766015490.png

Like I said, more useful for flat objects; I've used it to get detailed photographs of things for work in the past. I doubt how useful it'd be for insects, but it is an option. However, Leica officially suggested the BOOWU for general-purpose close-up and macro work:

1764766240611.png

I've tried it. It's definitely not as useful as the Focoslide, but it is amusing.

The one catch with anything other than the Focoslide is that you'll need a Leitz lens to get the best out of it (or even use it at all). If you're going to go down that path, you'll want to adjust your FED's rangefinder to the Leica standard instead of the Soviet one so that you can use the lenses directly on the camera, too. It's an easy enough adjustment to make - all you need is a pair of good screwdrivers, a tape measure, and some patience.
 
There are good answers already but I love shooting with my Barnacks (Leicas, Japanese and Soviet) the most and rarely use my old Olympus OM-1 that I bought new so many years ago. But I bought a Zuiko 50mm macro just a few years back so I could shoot macro and that is what I use my SLR for. You will enjoy a SLR for macro so much more.
 
follow your dreams! Don't let the doubters bring you down! 😅
Thank your for such a detailed response, this is exactly the sort of challenge I'm interested. The Focoslide is such an ingenious solution. I think I'll look into getting a Focoslide by this summer. Can it be used with a bellows?

(Also I apologize to all for the bad grammar in my original post, I'm used to being able to edit my posts).
 
Yep, that should work fine, @Klink :

1764818706655.png

This is an extract from the "Close-up and Photomicrography" booklet from Leitz New York: https://www.cameramanuals.org/leica_pdf/leica_close_up.pdf

The good news is that Focoslides and their assorted adapters tend to be quite cheap by Leica standards. The bad news is that they're obscure, accurate information on what you need and what you're looking at can be a bit hard to come by, and there were at least three different systems - a Leitz New York version, a Leitz Wetzlar one, and a later Wetzlar one with a different lens mount (the other two take LTM lenses and extension tubes directly). What you want to look for is the OOZAB here:

1764819194367.png

That'll give you the most compatibility and is (handily) the easiest to identify - it's the only unit with an H-shaped pressure bar to hold the camera in place and a narrower faceplate to mount the camera to (the later one is much taller).

Pages 54-60 in this document describe all the accessories and combinations: www.cameramanuals.org/leica_pdf/leica_accessory_guide.pdf

The bellows options are described in the section for the first Visoflex in page 47 of that last link, and there's also a dedicated page for them on this Visoflex site: Universal Focusing Bellows

I'm not sure which bellows is best for fitting on the Focoslide, as I've never used them myself. I went for the helical focusing mounts as they're easier to carry and use out-and-about. A Focoslide and a small focusing helical to clip the Summar into is much easier to slip into a bag than a giant bellows setup!
 
If the film to flange distance on a Fed 1 is 27.8mm (I think it is in later standardized models) then a visoflex is really the way to go. Visoflex 1 (Leica) are pretty common and affordable. I think it's limited to the Bellows 1, but that works just fine 😎. Best macro option for a Barnack as far as I'm concerned. I have a Viso 3 and Micro Viso 3, but they're for M bodies..... still, I use them 🙂
 
If you actually want to take macro pics, buy an SLR.

If you're the sort of crazy who uses a rangefinder, no matter what the difficulties, just for the satisfaction of posting the results on RFF, then both the Visoflex and OOZAB (Focoslide) have problems, especially if you intend photographing insects in the wild. Neither system has an auto diaphragm, so you either focus at f16, or stop down manually before tripping the shutter. Obviously in the latter situation, that's only feasible with a static subject and a tripod. The OOZAB is so slow in operation that growing trees and continental drift prove problematic. A Visoflex might just be usable handheld, but only either with an OXCVO(?) release that raises the mirror and trips the shutter simultaneously, or by sprouting an extra arm. The huge extension of the Visoflex mirror box means that modest emlargements are only possible with a longer lens.

Enjoy!
 
If you're the sort of crazy who uses a rangefinder, no matter what the difficulties
Hey! I resemble that remark!

I've never understood the "just get an SLR" response to this stuff. That's the exact same thing I hear from people outside of this community whenever I mention rangefinders at all (although they're more likely to say "just get a Sony/Nikon/Fuji mirrorless now), and it's the exact same mentality behind people who say "why are you shooting film? Just shoot digital!"

All these widgets work, and they do have certain benefits, even in the modern age. As I mentioned earlier, I don't like SLRs. Never have. I've tried 'em all: Canon, Nikon, Minolta, Praktica, Exakta, whatever. Not my thing. Can't focus as reliably with them, don't enjoy the feel of them, and a roll of film going into one will often take a year plus to finish for me. They don't inspire me, and I don't want to buy more lenses for an SLR mount just to do a specific thing once in a blue moon.

But I like rangefinders. A widget that goes onto one, uses lenses I already have, and allows it to do 95% of the job an SLR can do for four frames when I need it? That's perfect.

As for the Focoslide: it's a different way of working. In use, it feels a lot like using a large format camera without the perspective correction movements. It's slow, methodical, and oddly pleasing. And while I'm never going to be doing street photography with one, it's more than capable of photographing a lot of subjects if you know what you're doing. For instance, this was taken with a Jupiter 11 and a Zorki 1 on a Focoslide:

Zorki 1 - Roll 1 - XP2 (14-R).jpg

Now, I was never going to be chasing this old girl around the house with a Focoslide, but when she was willing to "model", it worked a charm. She's been gone for two years now and this is still one of my favourite photos of this grumpy old sod.

Besides: there's an argument - and a strong one - that the tools you have change the way you work and lead to different results. Sometimes going out with this Focoslide rig, as convoluted as it may seem, means I'm looking at and for different things - things I might have passed over if I just bought an SLR and continued walking around happy-snapping all day long. That alone has value in it, as far as I'm concerned.
 
Were they built to the same spec as the Visoflex - in other words, do they have the same registration distance and take the same adapters?
Vaguely...I remember using a Komura housing (that looked like a Viso II) on a Leica III with ltm BPM (?) bellows and a ltm Novoflex adapter that would take the lens unit of a 135mm Dalrac and focus from very close to infinity.

Why...I ask myself...
 
Thanks for the great feedback everyone. Just to be clear I have lots of other macro options and take macro photos all the time, with my (too) many other cameras, including SLRs, digital mirrorless, using bellows, macro lenses etc. In terms quality my favourite macro images may have been produced with my RB67 using colour slide film, but it's not something I take on my field work (though I did a few times). My main camera for closeup is a Fujifilm X-T2 with a Pentax 1:4 50mm lens for instance. I need it for reliability and fast turn around, but it's not magical and I can't just keep it in my bag every day, I need to remember to bring it on top of all my actual work stuff.

In terms of getting a Lieca over the FED I fully get the appeal but I really prefer doing things the hard and cheap way, for one. Also I'm just trying to fill the niche a Vito-B that I bought for $30 and took some of my best photos on occupied, but hopefully adding a bit of flexibility. I could buy 15 Soviet cameras from the 50s with a variety of lenses for the price of one Leica body, and then just keep the one that works best. Fieldwork and travel are often quite brutal, so I have no desire to eventually break or have stolen an expensive camera I can't really afford to begin with. I could buy a bunch of prime lenses for my RB67 if I were just concerned about craftsmanship and image quality. Maybe macro won't work out on the FED but that's not really the concern. But maybe it will I will get a great picture of a new species of carpenter bee that I can have printed and framed.
 
Wondering if a NOOKY or NOOKY- HESUM would work on a Fed 1? Maybe?
Just curious.......I guess I could find out. I happen to have all required bits.... Am I too lazy? Ummmmmm
 
Wondering if a NOOKY or NOOKY- HESUM would work on a Fed 1? Maybe?
Very unlikely. They need very precise alignment to work correctly and they've got the same sort of shrouded cam that the Summaron does - which the sled-shaped cam follower of a Soviet camera really doesn't like.

I just mounted a NOOKY-HESUM and a SOOKY to my Zorki 1 and both appear to mount, but don't quite go far enough round for me to trust the alignment. Also, the focusing feels very stiff where the cam follower is struggling to move freely. I'll probably have to recheck the close-focus alignment on that Zorki now!
 
Honestly I would just completely steer clear of the FED 1 altogether. If you're set on a Soviet rangefinder, the FED 3 and Zorki 4 are far better cameras, IMO even better than the screw mount Leicas in some respects. A knob-wind FED 3 in good condition is a truly wonderful camera to use (mine is easily equal in quality to the Japanese rangefinders of its era). If you really must go with a tiny, squinty viewfinder, and separate rangefinder, get a Nicca, or Leotax, etc. You will then be able to have full interchangeability with Leica lenses if you desire to add any to your collection.

As for macro work, once you attach a reflex housing for macro work, the camera is an SLR. If you want to do things the "hard" way, then I still have to suggest getting an Exa or Exakta. You can even find one stamped with the "USSR OCCUPIED" label on the bottom if you must have a "Soviet" camera. You could get the camera, bellows, and macro lens for less than a Leica, and enjoy doing things the hard way all at the same time. I spent less than $100 on the set up shown in the post above. Never mind that with all the accessories sold for the Exa/Exakta line you will never get bored of finding new gadgets and lenses to try out.
 
If you want to do a bit better than the FED-1, there are several cameras that you can purchase an accessory for called an Auto-Up which clamps to the front of the normal taking lens (usually a 5cm/50mm) and covers the viewfinder and rangefinder windows with a prism to change the field of view for close-up photos. Not quite the macro you are looking for, but a lower priced alternative. There were two available for the Canon 50mm in different focus ranges.


Canon Auto-Up Sets by P F McFarland, on Flickr

These are a lot easier to use than a NOOKY-HEESUN on the Leica.

PF
 
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