ssmc
Well-known
Okay so up front I'll admit it - I did something I normally never do, which is buy on impulse without doing a bunch of research first :bang:
I got an absolutely mint-in-boxes Nikonos V + 35mm lens which appears to have never, ever been used. There's no grease on any of the o-rings and it's spotless inside and out. I got carried away by how beautiful it was (and that I was always fascinated by the Nikonos) and just bought it. I figured I could use it in dusty environments and just rinse it off, since I don't dive or even swim.
But...
After reading the manual, and the advice on http://www.southern-nikonos.com/, it seems that since this camera has not been serviced annually to replace/re-lube the many non-user-serviceable o-rings, I can't get it wet without risking internal damage - so no rinsing. That would seem especially pertinent because this camera, with a very early serial #, has sat in its original foam packing for almost a quarter of a century.
Despair sets in. What do I do with this beautiful thing? Use it carefully as a scale-focus land camera? Put it on a shelf and admire it? Resign myself to annual maintenance which for me involves sending it overseas? Sell it to someone who knows what they're getting into (unlike yours truly...)?
And yes, in case you're wondering, I paid a premium price to get an essentially NOS one, which is why this is bugging me so much. I know if I sold it I'd lose big time but at the moment it is a very expensive paperweight.
Any advice on whether the Nikonos V is "safe" to use on land without the requisite annual servicing, and to what extent it's splashproof, would be greatly appreciated.
TIA,
Scott
I got an absolutely mint-in-boxes Nikonos V + 35mm lens which appears to have never, ever been used. There's no grease on any of the o-rings and it's spotless inside and out. I got carried away by how beautiful it was (and that I was always fascinated by the Nikonos) and just bought it. I figured I could use it in dusty environments and just rinse it off, since I don't dive or even swim.
But...
After reading the manual, and the advice on http://www.southern-nikonos.com/, it seems that since this camera has not been serviced annually to replace/re-lube the many non-user-serviceable o-rings, I can't get it wet without risking internal damage - so no rinsing. That would seem especially pertinent because this camera, with a very early serial #, has sat in its original foam packing for almost a quarter of a century.
Despair sets in. What do I do with this beautiful thing? Use it carefully as a scale-focus land camera? Put it on a shelf and admire it? Resign myself to annual maintenance which for me involves sending it overseas? Sell it to someone who knows what they're getting into (unlike yours truly...)?
And yes, in case you're wondering, I paid a premium price to get an essentially NOS one, which is why this is bugging me so much. I know if I sold it I'd lose big time but at the moment it is a very expensive paperweight.
Any advice on whether the Nikonos V is "safe" to use on land without the requisite annual servicing, and to what extent it's splashproof, would be greatly appreciated.
TIA,
Scott
GaryLH
Veteran
No grease on the o ring is not necessarily a good thing. Make sure they are not dried out. In the box there should be a tube if grease. U need to apply a very light application before u plan on any submersion w/ it.
I have taken a nikonos on vacation w/ me as my only land/water amera before. It an take very good shots but we are talking zone focus. So how good depends on how good u are at guessing distance. I was lucky enough to find a 28lw which is a rare lens for my nikonos. It is a land only lens unlike the normal 28 which is an underwater only. So I used the 28 more than the 35 on land. The 28 is weather proof.. Probably can take a minor dunking, but I wouldn't try it.
As for splash proof, so long as there are no obvious problems, this camera can good deep.. Was the primary camera for many a diver..until underwater housing for other cameras became more readily available.
Gary
I have taken a nikonos on vacation w/ me as my only land/water amera before. It an take very good shots but we are talking zone focus. So how good depends on how good u are at guessing distance. I was lucky enough to find a 28lw which is a rare lens for my nikonos. It is a land only lens unlike the normal 28 which is an underwater only. So I used the 28 more than the 35 on land. The 28 is weather proof.. Probably can take a minor dunking, but I wouldn't try it.
As for splash proof, so long as there are no obvious problems, this camera can good deep.. Was the primary camera for many a diver..until underwater housing for other cameras became more readily available.
Gary
craygc
Well-known
You're over worrying. The issue you need to be concerned about is when you have multiples of atmospheric pressure trying to force water into the body. On land I wouldn't worry about it. Use it in any weather and don't give it a second thought. I would even suggest a quick dip into a bucket of water to rinse muck off it would provide no ill effect either. These are all from a very unserviced Nikonos V, which was being regularly dipped into water to clean it. As a suggestion, which I only considered after the first year of shooting this event, is to get a metal screw on hood - it helps keep water drops off the front element. As well, I carried slices of apple and rubbed them on the front element to stop any water beading. Enjoy the camera...
peterm1
Veteran
I agree about safety of single atmosphere dampness if I can express it that way. But I would be a little careful about too much dunking. I only say this because I know that in-body (i.e. non-serviceable) O rings can leak - I had it happen when snorkelling with a S104 Nikon Speedlight. As you cannot get to them to examine their condition or to lube them, there is a slight risk.
I started my serious interest in photography with a Nikonos 5 (initially while scuba diving and later while on land) so they hold a special place in my heart. I sold my Nikonos 5 years ago after giving up diving regularly. But they are now so inexpensive that I have on several occasions been tempted to buy one just for the sheer joy of owning one and being able to have a go anywhere camera. And you know what I recall most about these - well two things really. The first is the distinctive smell of rubber and grease that brings back wonderful memories every time I smell it. The second was the almost silent but authoritative "clunk" of the shutter. I know of no camera that sounds better - and that includes a Leica M. The only sight disadvantage is the zone focusing but honestly the Nikonos depth of field system is so good it makes zone shooting simple after just a little practice at estimating distance.
In short these are darn nice cameras and if you still shoot film they can be great fun particularly if you enjoy "going bush" in inclement weather.
Check out this site - me in the mid 1980s, photo most likely taken with a Nikonos 5. Skinny as all get out and in my mid to late 20s. ahhhhhhhh memories.
http://www.tallshipstales.de/80s/Sailing_Solomons.php
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
The sealing rituals in the manual are for deep water activities - to keep the camera splashproof all you have to do is keep the seals reasonably clean and undamaged. I used my IV for a decade of swimming and snorkelling without doing anything more about it - what eventually killed it was that I did not notice that I lost a seal for good when changing films...
tj01
Well-known
It's a great camera. I've used it up to 40m under and on land. A little heavy to use on land, and the distance focusing takes a bit of getting used to. Keep in mind the distance scale is meant to take into account for water diffraction.
skibeerr
Well-known
I killed my sea&sea wen I had the brilliant idea to blow it dry after a dive. I chased the salt water thru the relaxed O rings ( they need the pressure to close tight) opened it after a couple of days, it was a total loss.
--
Well-known
I bought one before the small and waterproof digital compacts were available. It is a very enjoyable camera but don't drop it on your foot. In the end I sold it to a collector. It was too heavy and cumbersome. If I had lost of space I would have kept it. To me it is one of the truly iconic cameras. Hope you will find use for yours or sell it on.
/Xpanded
/Xpanded
Mackinaw
Think Different
Just use the camera. I bought a used Nikonos 5 about 15 years back for use in my kayak. I've never replaced the O-rings (I do check them regularly and do occasionally lubricate)) and the camera works fine both above and under water. A bit clunky perhaps, for above water use, but it takes fine pics. Plus you can also take nifty photos like this one, which I took last Thursday in the frigid waters of Lake Huron.
Jim B.
Jim B.
pgk
Well-known
OK so the manual says it should be serviced annually. As a pro underwater photographer for 30 years I can honestly say that I've never come across a Nikonos which has been serviced annually!
As the camera has sat unused you do need to check out its condition iro its seals and this is actually very easy.
Firstly you can grease the user maintainable seals (main, lens and flash socket seals) yourself using some of the supplied lubricant. If these seals are at all rough or perished, replace them, otherwise they will be fine for above water use. They are sufficiently greased when they have just a thin coat of grease on them - it acts as a lubricant which allows the seals to move in their grooves, nothing more.
Secondly you can check the non-user maintainable seals below the controls, back fastener, etc., simply by trying these controls. Over time its possible for the lubricating grease on such seals to 'dry' out (or displace). If this has happened the seal will no longr allow the control/mechanism using it, to move freely (as it won't be lubricated) and accordingly the control will feel 'stiff' with some tendency to bind or move backwards against the direction of movement when rotated, as though its working against a rubber band which is trying to pull it backwards (which is in fact exactly what is happening - a dry, sealing 'O' ring will doing just this). In it does this then it needs attention.
If all the controls, etc., feel smooth and operate as you would expect them to, then the seals are probably fine to use, and will certainly be ok above water in rain or splashing water. There are many specialist repairers who will still service Nikonos cameras and if needed it really isn't a massive problem to get one serviced up.
FWIW the 35mm Nikonos lens is the same lens that was originally fitted to Nikon rangefinder cameras in the 1950s but late copies have far better coatings than those on early lenses. So the Nikonos has a heritage which is directly linked to rangefinders and is actually derived from the French Calypsophot (built by Atom for Cousteau) which appears to have originally use a Som-Berthiot lens which was itself originally a Leica screw mount lens. So the Nikonos camera probably owes its lineage to the Leica screw thread cameras......
As the camera has sat unused you do need to check out its condition iro its seals and this is actually very easy.
Firstly you can grease the user maintainable seals (main, lens and flash socket seals) yourself using some of the supplied lubricant. If these seals are at all rough or perished, replace them, otherwise they will be fine for above water use. They are sufficiently greased when they have just a thin coat of grease on them - it acts as a lubricant which allows the seals to move in their grooves, nothing more.
Secondly you can check the non-user maintainable seals below the controls, back fastener, etc., simply by trying these controls. Over time its possible for the lubricating grease on such seals to 'dry' out (or displace). If this has happened the seal will no longr allow the control/mechanism using it, to move freely (as it won't be lubricated) and accordingly the control will feel 'stiff' with some tendency to bind or move backwards against the direction of movement when rotated, as though its working against a rubber band which is trying to pull it backwards (which is in fact exactly what is happening - a dry, sealing 'O' ring will doing just this). In it does this then it needs attention.
If all the controls, etc., feel smooth and operate as you would expect them to, then the seals are probably fine to use, and will certainly be ok above water in rain or splashing water. There are many specialist repairers who will still service Nikonos cameras and if needed it really isn't a massive problem to get one serviced up.
FWIW the 35mm Nikonos lens is the same lens that was originally fitted to Nikon rangefinder cameras in the 1950s but late copies have far better coatings than those on early lenses. So the Nikonos has a heritage which is directly linked to rangefinders and is actually derived from the French Calypsophot (built by Atom for Cousteau) which appears to have originally use a Som-Berthiot lens which was itself originally a Leica screw mount lens. So the Nikonos camera probably owes its lineage to the Leica screw thread cameras......
ChrisPlatt
Thread Killer
A Nikonos III was my take anywhere, shoot in any weather camera. I never
attended to the seals, as I never submersed it. It never once missed a beat.
Alas I sold it, and now that I live near the beach lately I've been missing it.
The Nikonos V is dirt cheap now, and metering/AE would be handy, so I just
bought one. It will serve the same purpose, so no worries about the seals...
Chris
attended to the seals, as I never submersed it. It never once missed a beat.
Alas I sold it, and now that I live near the beach lately I've been missing it.
The Nikonos V is dirt cheap now, and metering/AE would be handy, so I just
bought one. It will serve the same purpose, so no worries about the seals...
Chris
Gumby
Veteran
I used a Nikonos IVA in both dusty and explosive environments in my past. The advise I received from my srevice tech at the time (and followed) was to NOT grease the o-rings. The concern was that the grease would attract more grit when changing film than a dry o-ring would. Even though I have full confidence that teh camera is watertight even without grease, we would brush the dust off, or blow with compressed air, to clean the camera rather than giving it a bath.
We found that the Nikonos had its place in difficult environments but was a real pain-in-the-neck to use. After a while we would use it "for show". our clients LOVED the look and story associated with the underwater camera and the huge (but extremely low power) explosion-proof strobe. For real work - when explosion wasn't a concern - we used Nikormats and Vivitar 285s. The camera/lens was overhauled frequently and thrown out when they got the least bit unreliable. The 285s seemed to live on forever and were only replaced when they were dropped in water or run over by a mining truck. Oh... and there was the one that I accidently dropped down a 50 ft shaft once. It flashed at the bottom and never flashed again. RIP.
We found that the Nikonos had its place in difficult environments but was a real pain-in-the-neck to use. After a while we would use it "for show". our clients LOVED the look and story associated with the underwater camera and the huge (but extremely low power) explosion-proof strobe. For real work - when explosion wasn't a concern - we used Nikormats and Vivitar 285s. The camera/lens was overhauled frequently and thrown out when they got the least bit unreliable. The 285s seemed to live on forever and were only replaced when they were dropped in water or run over by a mining truck. Oh... and there was the one that I accidently dropped down a 50 ft shaft once. It flashed at the bottom and never flashed again. RIP.
semilog
curmudgeonly optimist
Great thread. I still have a IVa that I use in crappy weather on boats in saltwater environments. But actually I prefer using one of my 3 Yachica T5's. Just about as capable, 1/10 the weight.
raid
Dad Photographer
Can it be modified to be used on land?
burancap
Veteran
That is all relative to the lens. The 35 and 80 are "amphibious" lenses as well as one other that was more land oriented -a 28. I loved mine, shooting with the 35.
bobkonos
Well-known
I collect mint Nikonos examples so I understand both sides of the question here. (My user name here is a mix of bob and nikonos). These problems are way overblown and really not problems. It is easy to remove and apply a thin film of grease on the body and lens seals, and re-install the seals on the body and the lens. Then install the lens, load some film, and go go go. It is a Nikonos-it is tough and designed for far more than outdoors in a drizzle. I do not dive but use mine outdoors a lot. Keep it, enjoy it.
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
There is one underwater and one surface 28mm - neither will focus in the respective other medium, as they are designed with a curved glass/water respectively glass/air front surface. The "amphibious" lenses have a flat glass front, so they work either way. The more extreme wides unfortunately are underwater only and will neither focus nor cover the full frame on land.
pgk
Well-known
There was a 'splash-proof' 28mm - not designed for submersion - and the commoner underwater 28mm which, it was apparently claimed, could be used at small apertures above water. This had a slightly concave front rather than flat. That said I've never seen any images from it taken above water.....
Mackinaw
Think Different
As others have noted, you have to use an above-water lens for use on land. The standard 35/2.5 can be used above or below water. Other than that, there's no rangefinder so you have to scale-focus. No big deal if you use fast film and a wide-angle lens (which is what you usually use on a Nikonos).
Jim B.
pgk
Well-known
If anyone is interested, I wrote an article for the RPS Journal about the Calypsophot. If anyone would like to read it they can pm me their email and I will forward a pdf version.