Not quite 'M', Leica R advice wanted.

[Steve_F]

Firstly I'd like to say that I know this in an 'M' thread but I couldn't think of anywhere else for in-depth Leica knowledge.
I' m considering the purchase of an R8 or R9 to go alongside my M6TTL.
Leica SLR's are whole new field to me, so any advice or pointers would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Steve.

 

[nobbylon]

Steve,
I had an R8 in the past and liked it. If you are settled on an R8 or R9 get the latest camera you can. Early R8's had gremlins in the electrics. The 9 I believe had a push lock on the mode dial and would be nice as I remember being bugged by the dial on my 8. Sticky DOF levers are common.
Is there a particular feature you want from them as I would highly recommend looking at a Leicaflex SL before you buy. The viewfinder is nicer and manual focus is a delight. The only downside to the SL is the meter sensitivity in low light, the SL2 is better however it doesn't bother me and I liked the none split screen in the SL. Good SL's can be found for 100 quid or so if you shop.
Is there a particular reason you want an SLR? For me it was focusing difficulties with M's due to my eyesight. What I'm getting at is lens choice really. I see no advantages to an R camera if you use 35, 50, 60 and 90's as I do unless it's for focus reasons. If it's tele lenses then sure I'd go for it.
Maybe you just like an SLR in which case I'd also go for it!
Lens wise I use the summicron 35 and 50, my favorite ever lens, the 60 macro elmarit and a 90 elmarit. All fantastic and comparable to all my M lenses.
Good luck with your choice.
The only R's to dodge are the R4 series UNLESS it's been serviced recently by someone who knows what they are doing. I've had 4 or 5 in trades and all but one had electrical problems or sticky mirrors. The viewfinder is dimmer than R8/9.
For a smaller size camera I'd pick an R6.2, basically an M6 with a mirror or an R7.
No viewfinder is better, clearer or easier to focus with than an SL's full microprism screen though. I've looked through them all and compaired them and that's why I ended up with the SL.

 

[thegman]

I had an R8 for a little bit, quite honestly, it's probably the least favourite camera I've ever had.

It was just a few things I did not like, like the exposure compensation toggle, you have to look at a display to see what it is, whereas on say a Zeiss Ikon, it's just a dial.

It's enormous, but that may not bother you.

All a bit too electronic-y for my taste. Very well built, but for a 35mm frame I'm not sure why I'd carry around something so big, many medium format cameras are smaller and lighter.

I got rid of mine pretty quick, even though it was a camera I'd lusted after for a while. For far less money you can get other SLRs, or a little bit more, get a real beauty like an Alpa 10d or 11e.

Leicas are expensive, we all get that, but when I feel an M3, and ask "is this worth the money?" I can easily answer "yes". With the R8, it's an easy "no".

I don't mean to criticize anyone's camera choice, for some people, the R8 or R9 may well be the holy grail, but for me, like I say, probably of my cameras, the one I liked the least.

 

[mfogiel]

I don't know R8, I know and do not recommend R5 - too small VF, but I would say that the R4s is a perfectly nice camera, particularly the R4s2 version - the only downside it has is a slight shutter lag. Get a Summicron 90 and Macro Elmarit 60, both 3 cam and you are set. You can use the wide angles on the M6. Leicaflex is good, but huge, lacks AE and is in practice not serviceable ( the cost exceeds the value of the camera).

 

[Cron]

as said, early R8 had some trouble with electronics but beside of these problems it is a great camera. In my eyes. I think most of the early cams had a service meanwhile and the problem should be solved. As with my R8. It is bigger than other SLR but use it with the winder and it perfectly fits into my hands.
Great finder, reliable metering.
If you want to go small I would prefer R7 or RE. No problems with these. And I own them about 10 - 15 years. No service needed. Fun to shoot even in snowy weather like now here in Vienna.

 

[nobbylon]

I don't know R8, I know and do not recommend R5 - too small VF, but I would say that the R4s is a perfectly nice camera, particularly the R4s2 version - the only downside it has is a slight shutter lag. Get a Summicron 90 and Macro Elmarit 60, both 3 cam and you are set. You can use the wide angles on the M6. Leicaflex is good, but huge, lacks AE and is in practice not serviceable ( the cost exceeds the value of the camera).

Peter at CRR does a service for £175, same as the M's. If the camera only costs £100 you end up with the best M/F slr for £275!
Leicaflex is no bigger than an R8.
Granted there's no AE but that doesn't seem to bother most Leica users 🙂
I was lucky with my SL I suppose as it had been well looked after and serviced, near mint with a clear finder for £85 off of ebay!
I forgot to mention the prism issue with Leicaflex. Quite a few have de silvering prisms which cause spots and discolouration in the finder. Expensive fix with a re (aluminiumised) prism instead of original silvered one and a bit dimmer. My preference would be to keep looking as there's plenty of them.

 

[dave lackey]

Firstly I'd like to say that I know this in an 'M' thread but I couldn't think of anywhere else for in-depth Leica knowledge.
I' m considering the purchase of an R8 or R9 to go alongside my M6TTL.
Leica SLR's are whole new field to me, so any advice or pointers would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Steve.

Go for it! I have been wanting an R8 for the last several years. It is next on my list to go with my fantastic R4 that has served me and continues to serve me so well.

My IIIF will be up for sale soon to fund half of the R8. Cannot wait for this exquisitie SLR!🙂

 

[nobbylon]

I just found this Steve,
http://stefanansorge.wordpress.com/2009/09/20/camera-review-leicaflex-sl/

 

[ktmrider]

R6.2 is Great

R6.2 is Great

Have a R6.2 which is a great manual focus SLR. It is the size of an M with a much greater array of lenses. I just bought another M6 from Classic Connection and they have an extensive collection of Leica reflex bodies.

 

[Rob-F]

I have a drawer full of Leica M bodies & lenses, have been a Leica shooter for over 50 years, and a Nikon SLR guy as well for maybe 40 years. At some point I thought I ought to have a Leica SLR as well. I bought an R4, didn't like using it, sold it, got an R5 and R6. I liked the exposure display of the R6. It's just like the M6, with red LEDs. I had 9 or 10 lenses, too. But the Leica SLRs never felt right in my hands, the way my Nikons feel right. . And the mirror action seemed too slow, even after DAG worked on them. I kept my 90mm Elmarit, my 135mm Elmarit, and my 180mm APO-Telyt, converted them to Nikon mount, and sold the rest.

I'd say if you want a nice film SLR get a Nikon F3, or maybe an F100 if you want autofocus. Or, if you want the SLR that feels like a Leica, get an Olympus OM-2 or OM-4. That's the camera that Leica should have made!

 

[splitimageview]

Leica R glass is wonderful. The bodies are hit or miss. In my experience the 8 and 9 are just Too Damn Big. 🙂

But the lenses are just Too Damn Heavy. Typical German Leica over-engineered - wonderful feel, mechanically superb, but that means Heavy.

If I wanted Heavy, I'd lug medium format. 🙂

 

[dave lackey]

I like heavy...the M3 (same as the wonderful R4). I like the M3 size, same as the R4. Do I need another SLR? Yes, if it is a Leica. No, if anything else. I have had just about every Nikon ever made and I am sick and tired of them. YMMV.

I want the R8/R9. Life is too short, it is later than you think so it is time reconfigure what I want, not what others want.

As Thorsten says, get the camera you LOVE and use it. Doesn't matter what anyone else thinks....so, having said that, why would you believe anybody? Just get one, try it, sell it or keep it. Certainly not going to lose any money on a resell.🙂

 

[dave lackey]

For the ultimate in heavy...get the R8 with DMR and tele lenses. Then go out and shoot the best wildlife shots you can imagine! Love Doug Herr's work.

 

[Vickko]

Yeah, heavy. I really liked the R9, not so much the R8. Sold them both, and remain loyal to the R6.2. Mechanical, reliable, smallish. But really liked the R9 when I had it - it fit my hands really nicely.

Also had R3, R4, R5, R7. Sold them all, they had a shutter lag that I found really really objectionable.

 

[splitimageview]

They won't really take pictures any different from any number of other SLRs, but if you like them, use them. 🙂 And you can't know if you will like, until you try...

 

[splitimageview]

Never noticed any shutter lag. Saw a lot of flaky R3s and R4s, though.

Many dealers stopped taking them in trade, as the owners *knew* they were flaky but intermittently so. Owners would take them in to dealers and the gear would work long enough to get a decent trade in value, and then would fail after being resold by the dealer.

R5, R6, R7 are my favorites, but the lens weight is what got me. So I switched to Contax...superb glass, excellent feel, but not made of pig iron. 🙂

 

[nobbylon]

I never liked the apparent lag on the R4's I had, seemed odd but it never affected the pictures. Yes lenses are heavy but they are worth it. Lighter in fact than my Nikon set ups!

 

[sparrow6224]

The glass is on another level all together from Canon, Nikon, etc. Only the Zeiss C/Y lenses compare. If you took a beautiful Canon 50mm shot, or a Nikon 180mm, and sharpened it really subtly and well in PS, and deepened the colors slightly, you'd have what the Leica R glass typically looks like.

Bodies, amother story. Oh well. I too always think of Doug Herr (look him up, stunning work) when I think of the R8. He works miracles with his and the famed APO 280mm f/4. But the one that most Leica R users swear by is the R6.2.

I have an R4s Mod P which has proved to be totally reliable, so far. Slight shutter lag but not bad. Just like the Minolta XD 11 shutter lag... hmm, wonder why. I bought an R8 with its mirror locked up for $200 and am about to send it off to Leica NJ to see if it's salvageable. Mint cosmetics, all electronics seemingly working.

 

[David Hughes]

Hi,

I haven't owned and used the R8 but used to have one of the earlier Leica SLR's, ie the R5. When it failed and I'd recovered from the shock of the estimate from Leica for getting it going again I looked at the R8 because I would then have a much younger camera, as they were made from 1996 onwards. FWIW, Leica asked about UKP 960 ish (or US $1,500+ or about 1,100 euros) for the body and some attention to the 35mm lens that was on it when they received it.

My opinion of the R8 based on the catalogue, handling one and talking to people using them was that it was an admirable replacement for the R5 with all its advantages and a little more. It felt nicer in the hands and felt as heavy as the R5. Both are large cameras and the R8 weighs a little under two pounds (or 890g). The lenses are not lightweight either. I don't see this as a disadvantage but other might. For comparison the Olympus OM-1 body weighs a little over a pound (or 490g).

What decided me against the R8 was the fact that the cost of a decent outfit was very, very high. Alas, you have to look at the price of say three or four lenses as well and, in Leica's case, they should be primes; I'm assuming the lenses are the main reason for buying it. It will also pay to look at the prices charged for things like lens caps, filters, lens hoods and Leica's own flash. I do realise that at today's prices the R8 body is a bargain for what it is but there's a lot more to a camera outfit than the body.

At my level I'll add that for nothing more than (say) 10" by 8" photo's I can't see the point of buying into the Leica system. Experience tells me that you can get the usual companion to the M series, meaning the Olympus OM-System, with their top of the range lenses for a lot less than the price of a Leica SLR body. And if anything goes wrong then the OM-1 (for example) is a lot cheaper and easier to get repaired. I have one of the earlier OM-1's and getting it completely overhauled, the battery conversion (for SR44's) and the prism replaced last year was about UKP15 more than the cost of Leica's estimate...

EDIT: Leica's estimate cost me forty five pounds and included the cost of sending it to Germany and return etc. The OM-1's work cost fifteen pounds more. (Added on 5.5.13 as I wondered if it was a little ambiguous.)


Anyway,there's my 2d worth to mull over. I'll wish you luck with your decision.

Regards, David

 

[taskoni]

I am R7 user and this what I would recommend 🙂 But seriously, the R7 and R8 price is close to get the newer model, although I would go if I had to for a 6.2 - the smallest and the best of the series (imo) if you don't want to play with the digital backs. The R glass is affordable and I love it, it gives me the same look as my M lenses - this is why I use it after all. 50 summicron is great lens, the 35 is fantastic, and the 80mm Summilux is just what I really expect from this system.