Over Exposing.

gilgsn

gilgsn

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Hello,

I could use some advise on correcting exposure and development time.. Here is an image that I wish had been correctly exposed:

Chalk_21_s.jpg


Low contrast and blown highlights. FP-4+ shouldn't be that grainy either! Some of my shots are worse than that.. Lens is a Summitar 2/50mm. I use an old hand-held meter and I suspect it is quite a bit off, though comparing it with readings from an iPod light-meter app it seems all right.. Once in a while I get a well exposed shot which would normally have been underexposed. It isn't my M4-P because I noticed the same problem with my IIIc (same lens). the lens does all right when a shot is "accidentally" correctly exposed.

On top of that, I over-developed the film. It was my first experiment with FP4+ at 100ISOand I used HC-110/H at 20°C for 17:30mins. I tried 15mins on my second film and it was much better. BTW for Tri-X at 400ISO I use 10mins.

I am just starting with Lightroom 5 and here is what I got:

10921012926_5e5f75c042_c.jpg


Not much better... Actually it might even be a bit worse :rolleyes: So, do I double the ISO on the meter and try that, or is there anything else I should be trying?

I used to develop film every day when I worked for a newspaper in the 80s and I don't remember ever having such an issue... Information is also scarce on HC-110/H... BTW I fix for 6mins with Kodak fixer powder. All chemicals are mixed in distilled water. Final rinse with Photo Flo.

Thanks :)

Gil.
 
gilgsn said:
I use an old hand-held meter and I suspect it is quite a bit off, though comparing it with readings from an iPod light-meter app it seems all right..
Click to expand...

Given that the ipod app will be metering reflected light, your meter will probably do so as well - and both will be right, while your methods are wrong. Successful reflected light metering is not simply pointing the meter at the scenery from a distance. It requires you to know what exactly to meter, and how to compensate the subject reflectivity, if it should be off "neutral grey". With subjects like your mural, that usually implies that you will have to walk up to it for a close-up reading, or find a suitable substitute at hand.
 
Roger Hicks has something to say about hand metering on his site you might read that just to see if you are doing something really wrong. The shot you presented would be underexposed if you metered it without some compensation. Most of the reflected surface is zone 6 or 7.

But to fix your problem meter a scene and then bracket on either side of that. When you develop then you will know if your development time is off. If the negatives still show dark highlights then cut the development time down.

Most important is to change only one factor; metering technique, development time, film speed, agitation, at a time.

As sevo implied, a grey card is a great help with these problems. As in your posted image have the grey card in the sun; meter the card and bracket either side of the reading and then adjust only your development time.
 
Thanks guys. For that shot I walked to the wall, flipped the white plastic bulb on the sensor and measured direct light. Most shots show overexposure whether I use reflected or direct light measurements. Reducing development time both with Tri-X and FP4+ marginally helped..

I found Roger Hicks' article and am reading it right now!

I will make more comparisons with the meter app on different subjects..

Gil.
 
Is your older meter battery operated? Are you running it with an alkailne battery by chance that has possibly still a charge but has lost some voltage.
If the cel is less sensitive due to a lower voltage it would cause you to give more exposure (it will read a lower ev).
As well if it is an older selenium cel that has lost sensitivity the same result would occur.
Test against a modern meter or one in a newer camera.
The iPhone apps work well enough at times but, only give a reflective reading through a wide FL lens.
Just as a wide angle lens on a TTL metered camera can fool the meter I think the iPhone camera lens can do the same.
It's not a terribly accurate meter for brighter or darker scenes from my experience with it.
I usually try and point it at some blue sky to acquire an ev for normal contrast scenes or, meter an object close to middle grey within the image I'm trying to capture (sometimes pavement for example).
 
Hello Andy. The meter is a Gossen Sixtar, battery powered. I did get a new battery for it, but did not check the voltage, which I will do. Sometimes batteries will lose voltage when stored for too long and I bought them on Ebay, so who knows... I realize I might also be metering too low, pointing my meter down a bit... Tought I had the same overexposing issue with incident light, so.. I plan on getting a new Sekonic Twin Mate.. I might expose my next roll one stop down just to see if it is the meter...

Gil.
 
The scene looked quite sunny. Maybe you could have sunny f/16 the exposure. Florida is usually bright enough outdoors to do that.
 
samtr87 said:
The scene looked quite sunny. Maybe you could have sunny f/16 the exposure. Florida is usually bright enough outdoors to do that.
Click to expand...

I would put it more than Sunny Sixteen (but your point is exactly right, you should know almost what the exposure should be with that rule), I lived in Panama' for 3.5 years and in scenes like that I used f22 and (shutter) 1 over MY EV. But the point is still leave everything the same (if you are going to continue using your old meter) and change your development time to improve tonal range.
 
Moto-Uno said:
And there's always the possibility of a lazy shutter . Peter
Click to expand...

Good point, maybe use another camera, along with getting your development times down. But two Leicas with lazy shutters???? My experience with Leica shutters is they give right to left or left to right exposure inconsistency.
 
Gil, keep in touch, I used to develop all my B&W all through the 60s and early 70s. Then kids and work plus having a good lab in town made me stop. When I came back to it, I had a heck of a time getting times, EV, agitation, etc down. And I was using some of the same developers, films, plus some of the same cameras.

Good luck, you will get the look that you want.

EDIT: by the way, I found out how to adjust for an inconsistent shutter of a Barnack Leica. If you are interested here is the manual, it is section L3. PM me if you want to know more. http://www.pentax-manuals.com/manuals/service/screw_mount_leicas.pdf
 
Thanks John. That manual goes into my list of keepers! Yes, I remember things working much better 25yrs ago.. I used to be able to dial in my shutter speed and aperture just by looking.. Same for estimating water temperature from the tap. I would run the water on my fingertips, then the back of my hand, and adjust it within 0.2C, without a thermometer! Of course I was doing it all the time. I lost a couple good shots this week-end overexposing, and saved the others in LR5. Frustrating.
Since I can't see too well up close anymore, I might be holding my meter too low and pointed slightly down, and that could be one stop overexposed.. I'll be more careful exposing my next roll.. I have Tri-X 400 in the M4-P right now. My IIIc is at YY's for a CLA..

Gil.
 
charjohncarter said:
But to fix your problem meter a scene and then bracket on either side of that. When you develop then you will know if your development time is off. If the negatives still show dark highlights then cut the development time down.

Most important is to change only one factor; metering technique, development time, film speed, agitation, at a time.
Click to expand...

+1
John's second sentence is very important and I'd start from step 1, box speed & normal development.

Enlarged grain is usually caused by over/exposure & over development.
Do a film test to determine your own EI rating for the combination.

Metering either grass or asphalt will give a pretty good value for a mid tone.
 
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