Canon LTM QL GIII help and advice needed, maybe ...

[dmr]

Ok, to make a long story long ...

I've been bidding off an on on these and finally was not outbid. Well, the mailroom phoned me about 1/2 hour ago and said I had a package.

It's here. I unpacked it and at first glance it looked too good to be true. Very clean, clear glass with no grunge. The light seals are going, but I expected it. Focus, shutter, aperture rings all smooth, and surprise-surprise, I pressed the battery check button and >>BLINK<< light up!

So I advance the film lever, seems smooth and locks, then I take aim for an air-shot, press the shutter release and ... and ...

and ...

NOTHING!

Ok, so I try again. Nope. Try some other speeds, nope.

The advance lever unlocks when the shutter release is pressed, so I know it thinks the shot is taken.

So then I look around here on this board and find an almost identical problem about a stuck self timer. I look on the camera and sure enough, the self timer is in the up (on) position. I press the lever, gently coaxing it back to the off position and try again.

Nope. Still nothing.

So, I play around some more, check to maybe see if bulb will work. No. Press the bulb release and move the shutter back to something more realiistic ... oops, something doesn't feel right.

Shutter speed ring is jammed. Will not move, and I don't want to force it.

So, here it is, shutter will not fire and shutter speed ring will not move.

Other than sending it in for service, does anybody have any tricks or things to try?

I'm really not afraid to try anything. I figure I'm not in a hurry, and if I need to learn to play "fix the camera" then I learn.

But, I'm hoping there's something simple that can be done, or some trick I'm overlooking.

{crossed fingers}

Thanks in advance, gang.

 

[rover]

My only thought is if the Apeture ring is on A and the ISO is low, it will not fire if there is a sever overexposure. I think? It has been a long time. Turn the apeture ring to a stop, any stop, just get if off A and try again.

 

[Pherdinand]

True, rover, but then, the advance lever would stay locked.

Do the aperture blades move just a little bit when you press the shutter button, or not at all? If they do, it's probably something with the selftimer - or the blades are stuck by some dirt.
On a good working canonet, when you engage the self-timer and release shutter, the blades move a bit, and then wait for the self-timer to finish buzzing around.

 

[Rob]

So at this point the shutter speed ring is jammed and the shutter never opened or closed. Did the meter work at all? Does not sound too good. Did the seller describe it as working? if so send it back...If not maybe someone else had this problem and overcame it...When it comes to working on the Canonet shutter even I give up....
Rob

 

[Sonnar Brian]

Okay:

If it is set to "B", you had to press the little lever to get it there. The unmarked one that has no obvious use, on the lens barrel. You should NOT have to press it to move off of "B", but try anyway.

1) Make sure the film counter is at least "1" or higher before deciding if it is advancing. It will advance the first ~3 times even if the shutter is jammed.

2) Set the camera to manual. Any manual F-Stop, and a shutter speed of 1/60th. Faster than slow, but fast enough to see it open.

3) Fire the camera. Listen for a faint click.

4) try to advance it.

On my Canonets with a jammed self-timer, nothing worked AT ALL until I freed it up. On ones with a working self timer but jammed shutter, the advance would not operate as the shutter did not fire.

 

[dmr]

First of all, thanks to everybody for the quick responses and answers. I'll just go down the questions and answer as best I can.

Do the aperture blades move just a little bit when you press the shutter button, or not at all?

Yes, all of the auto-exposure things seem to work. I can point it right at the office lights, press the shutter and they seem to stop down to f16 or so, if I hold it toward me, they go down to f8 or so. If I cap the lens, the shutter release button refuses to press. The meter stuff seems to be fine.

 

[dmr]

So at this point the shutter speed ring is jammed and the shutter never opened or closed.

Yes, it jammed between 15 and 30. At this point in time I don't want to try forcing it, until I know more about what's going on. The bulb release thing did work and let me move it to bulb, it jammed when I took it out of bulb back into instantaneous. It didn't have a good "feel" around 8 and jammed between 15 and 30.

Did the meter work at all?

Yes, meter and auto-exposure seems to work just as expected.

Does not sound too good.

I know

Did the seller describe it as working?

No, as is, I knew it, I took my chances and have to accept the consequences.

 

[dmr]

One item at a time.

Okay, one step at a time it is. I appreciate the help.

1) Do the aperature blades open to max when you cock the shutter?

On A, they are open to the max both before cocking and after cocking. They stop down to what appears to be the correct exposure when I press the shutter release.

2) Are you sure the selftimer is all the way off? (push with the earser of a pencil)

I think. Sanity check here. I'm assuming the self-timer is off when the lever is down toward the bottom of the camera. Is this correct?

3) Do you hear a faint click when you push the release button?

VERY faint. I don't think it's the shutter trying to fire. Intuition says it's just the film advance lock resetting.

Without handling it, I believe it's going to need a lens disassembly for cleaning.

And ... you may not believe this, but I am fairly "handy" with very small stuff, so I'm willing to try. I did download all of the exploded diagrams and such, and I honestly think I would feel comfortable trying to at least take the front lens thing off, assuming I can find the right tool to do it. I do have jewelers screwdrivers at home.

Hey, ain't got nothin, ain't got nothin to lose.

Also, the selftimer may not have released, even though you've pushed it back.

Again, I just get this intuitive hunch that the self timer is at the root of the problem here.

Again, thanks, everybody.

 

[Sonnar Brian]

I use some very fine needle nosed pliers to get the front chrome retaining ring off. But I use an optical spanner to get the front lens assembly off. Once that is off, evry one of my Canonets has sprung to life with Ronsonol and/or isopropyl alchohol.

Good Luck.

 

[dmr]

If it is set to "B", you had to press the little lever to get it there. The unmarked one that has no obvious use, on the lens barrel. You should NOT have to press it to move off of "B", but try anyway.

Yes, the manual calls it the bulb release lever or something like that. I had to press it to get it into B mode. I don't remember pressing it to get it back to instantaneous, but that's when it jammed.

1) Make sure the film counter is at least "1" or higher before deciding if it is advancing. It will advance the first ~3 times even if the shutter is jammed.

It's now sitting on 7.

2) Set the camera to manual. Any manual F-Stop, and a shutter speed of 1/60th. Faster than slow, but fast enough to see it open.

3) Fire the camera. Listen for a faint click.

It's now stuck between 15 and 30. I do hear a VERY VERY faint click, but I don't see any movement at all in the shutter blades and I don't feel any point of resistance when I press the release, like you get right as you are actuating the shutter.

4) try to advance it.

On my Canonets with a jammed self-timer, nothing worked AT ALL until I freed it up. On ones with a working self timer but jammed shutter, the advance would not operate as the shutter did not fire.

It advances fine. It then locks and will not advance again until I press the shutter release.

Thanks again, gang.

 

[dmr]

When you flush the shutter with Ronsonal, hold camera lens down, to keep fluid away from rear element. Leave it to dry this way also.

A couple kinda stupid questions here:

Is it OK to use acetone instead of Ronsonol? Reason is that I have acetone, both plain acetone and NPR.

Where can you get an inexpensive spanner wrench? I'm kinda getting intrigued here at the idea of really doing some surgery, and if they aren't too expensive it might save some headaches.

Thanks again, everybody.

 

[Kim Coxon]

Where can you get an inexpensive spanner wrench? I'm kinda getting intrigued here at the idea of really doing some surgery, and if they aren't too expensive it might save some headaches.

Thanks again, everybody.

Hi, Try these links to eBay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=30038&item=7500919216

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=43479&item=3863201480

Regards
Kim

 

[Sonnar Brian]

This one is similar to what I use. It should work. You have a 50/50 chance of the front lens group coming out from in front of the shutter. The other possibility is that the front element retaining ring comes off, and then you have to get the rest of the group out. IF THAT happens, you may be doing some drilling. I was able to get some very fine needle-nose pliers into the "real" slots. When putting the elements back on, be very careful as too much force will break the front element. It is thin. After breaking one, I started using rubber corks to get the final torque.

http://www.micro-tools.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=MT&Product_Code=SPW

 

[Kim Coxon]

A few tips.
3) The front element will have to be removed. Jon Goodman posted a good way of doing this here on the board.

Hi Greyhoundman,
Can you point to this, I have had a look but can't find it.

Many thanks
Kim

 

[Kim Coxon]

Hi,
Thanks for the quick response but one small problem. The link you gave is to remove the middle group.
Is there one for the front group?

Kim

 

[dmr]

Follow-up and thanks

Follow-up and thanks

Wow, this is becoming quite the project.

First of all, thanks to all who helped out. I really appreciate it.

I may be asking some more questions as we proceed.

It turns out that a guy I work with already has a spanner wrench kit and he's gonna bring it in tomorrow, so we will be playing "fix the camera" here. I just hope it's something that can be fixed without too much of a problem.

Thanks again, gang!