RF Camera Advice?

[Dale D]

Hi guys (& gals),

I'm new here, am interested in trying RF photography, and am seeking some advice on cameras. I'd use the RF mainly for street scenes, and inside cafe's etc. I'm still thinking through my criteria, but here's a rough list:

Preferably interchangeable lenses (for the flexibility)
Must have a built in meter
$500US or less would be nice (body & lens), but not a rigid requirement
(not going to drop big $ in the unlikely event that I don't take well to RF's!)
Does not need to be new
Not bulky, but not too tiny either (have big hands)

Guess that's the list for now. I've been using a Nikon FE w/50 and 35mm lenses for this type of stuff, and am actually quite happy with it, but for some irrational reason it's entered my head that I should try an RF...

Thanks!
Dale

 

[kmack]

The Bessa R comes to mind

 

[Trius]

That's a pretty decent budget, especially for used. How far that goes will depend on what range of lenses you want. Decide on desired focal lengths, and that will help narrow the choices of bodies.

Earl

 

[Nick]

Bessa R sounds like the best option.

 

[sf]

Funny. Something about the thing for RFs IS irrational, among other rational reasons. The most affecting thing is, of course, the irrational one. It is what drives us into . . . .well, you'll see.

Buy a Bessa. R3A and a Nokton 1.4 would be a good choice if you do lots of stuff inside cafes. Low light capable lens for little $$$. Of course, that will set you back more than your limit of $500 for body AND lens. Could just find a used Bessa body and a user 40mm.

Of course, if you are unsure of whether you will take well to RF photography, you might benefit from renting one for a day. If possible.

 

[Dale D]

Thanks for the replies. I've been reading a bit about the Bessa R, and it sounds like a good candidate. One of the problems I'm having is in buying a camera without being able to hold and handle it first. I don't know of any local outlet for the Bessa cameras, so am not able to get a "feel" for one before buying. Not sure how to overcome this.

I thought of some more questions:

What viewfinders are good if you wear glasses? I've read about the 1:1 finder on the R3A, but is it hard to see the full frame with specs on? How's the viewfinder on the R in this regard?

Are there any advantages/disadvantages between going with the screw mount versus M mount? I assume the selection and quality of lenses is great either way, but any thoughts on this?

Thanks again!
Dale

 

[kmack]

Funny. Something about the thing for RFs IS irrational, among other rational reasons. The most affecting thing is, of course, the irrational one. It is what drives us into . . . .well, you'll see..

Of course it's irrational, that's part of the fun.

Another option, forget about the built in meter.
Head over to Fedka pick up one of the Kiev 2's and grab a Jupiter 3, and a Jupiter 12 add a Gossen Digisix. You will have a whole kit, a conversation starter, a new obsession and it would still be under $500.

 

[Dale D]

Of course it's irrational, that's part of the fun.

Another option, forget about the built in meter.
Head over to Fedka pick up one of the Kiev 2's and grab a Jupiter 3, and a Jupiter 12 add a Gossen Digisix. You will have a whole kit, a conversation starter, a new obsession and it would still be under $500.

Man, I can tell I'm going to need subtitles for some of these conversations! Am trying to keep an open mind, but I'm really stuck on having a built in meter. I'm not experienced enough to judge exposure, and I think working with a handheld meter in the streets would be a handicap for me.

Dale

 

[wlewisiii]

Welcome to our madhouse 🙂 I'll be in the chorus suggesting the R.

For your situation, I'd think that the R+35/2.5 Skopar combination would be just about perfect. While I haven't used the R, everything I've read and been told about it is fine by me; but I can vouch for the optics of that lens. More than any other lens, the SC Skopar (same lens, different mount) taught me how to "see" the 35mm FOV. The price is reasonable, you get a decent currently made body and you get compatability with a very large range of lenses. If you take to RF's (you may, you may not. It's a very individual thing. I love them, but I also shoot 4x5 handheld 😀 ) then you might think about going to an M mount camera for an even larger selection of lenses or you might find yourself enchanted by one of the various LTM systems out there... around here you'll find that many of us love the Canon LTM cameras beyond all sense of reason...

I don't remember, but there may well be a store in Chicago that would allow you to get a hands on taste of the R before spending the $$$. Perhaps you can make an excuse to bop up there for a day or weekend and just "happen" to see a store to stop by? 😀 But once you do, I'd really recomend buying the combo from one of our sponsors. I've had excellent service from Cameraquest.

Hope these comments are helpful. No matter what, enjoy photography: life is too short for hobbies you don't love.

William

 

[Kyle]

Man, I can tell I'm going to need subtitles for some of these conversations! Am trying to keep an open mind, but I'm really stuck on having a built in meter. I'm not experienced enough to judge exposure, and I think working with a handheld meter in the streets would be a handicap for me.

Dale

Honestly, working with a handheld meter isn't that difficult. I had the same ideas at first, I was reluctant to work with a meterless body because I thought it would be a handicap. However, usually you only need to meter once, set your exposure, then go shoot. Unless the light changes significantly, your exposure settings will basically be the same. Its actually more liberating to just expose once, then walk around and shoot, rather than constantly trying to make the meter in your camera happy. I've been shooting only with meterless bodies lately (M3, Zorki 4K, Canonet GIII-QL17 with meter off) and its been a much more enjoyable experience.

That said, I own a Bessa R. It was my first rangefinder and I really love it. You will not regret purchasing it if you do get it.

 

[Dale D]

Still curious about the best viewfinder among the Bessas for someone who wears glasses.... R vs R2a vs R3a?

(by "best" here I mean being able to see most or all of the frame with glasses on).

Dale

 

[RML]

Honestly, working with a handheld meter isn't that difficult. I had the same ideas at first, I was reluctant to work with a meterless body because I thought it would be a handicap. However, usually you only need to meter once, set your exposure, then go shoot. Unless the light changes significantly, your exposure settings will basically be the same. Its actually more liberating to just expose once, then walk around and shoot, rather than constantly trying to make the meter in your camera happy. I've been shooting only with meterless bodies lately (M3, Zorki 4K, Canonet GIII-QL17 with meter off) and its been a much more enjoyable experience.

It's indeed not that difficult to learn to use a handheld meter but... though I did lear, I still find it troublesome not having one on my M2. I definitely enjoy having an internal meter on the Bessas and the R-D1. The lack of a meter is one of the main reasons I haven't used the M2 as much as the Bessas. In fact, when choosing between the M2 or the Bessa R, the R always won and ended up being taken out for the ride. And no, that had nothing to do with the M2's golden jacket ( http://shardsofphotography.blogspot.com/2005/12/leica-challenge-2005.html ). 🙂

 

[RML]

Still curious about the best viewfinder among the Bessas for someone who wears glasses.... R vs R2a vs R3a?

(by "best" here I mean being able to see most or all of the frame with glasses on).

Dale

IRC, the R and R2A both have the same magnification. I wear glasses and prefer the mag of the R over the 1:1 mag of the R-D1.

 

[Kyle]

... And no, that had nothing to do with the M2's golden jacket ( http://shardsofphotography.blogspot.com/2005/12/leica-challenge-2005.html ). 🙂

Thats your camera?! I ran across that site a couple weeks back and thought "this guy is nuts in a good way!" I really like the Japanesque Gold from Aki. In fact, I just ordered the same covering for my Zorki 4K. I don't have the balls to do that to my M3, though! 😀

 

[RML]

Thats your camera?! I ran across that site a couple weeks back and thought "this guy is nuts in a good way!" I really like the Japanesque Gold from Aki. In fact, I just ordered the same covering for my Zorki 4K. I don't have the balls to do that to my M3, though! 😀

A covert! I made a convert! 😛

 

[Gerry M]

Hi Dale, I wear glasses and my R2a viewfinder is extremely bright and easy to see all the frame lines. Good luck, Gerry

 

[traveller]

I'm also new with rangefinders and have been thinking along the same lines (my hands ain't so small either and I also wear spectacles). I did buy a used Bessa R and she's great. Just the right size to hold her in my hands and to take her along every day, that's what I missed with my SLR's, metered and a great VF.
But be warned, once you get infected it will not be your last one. I'm allready seriously thinking about a FED with a snap on meter from Voigtländer :bang:

John

 

[cbass]

What viewfinders are good if you wear glasses? I've read about the 1:1 finder on the R3A, but is it hard to see the full frame with specs on? How's the viewfinder on the R in this regard?

Are there any advantages/disadvantages between going with the screw mount versus M mount? I assume the selection and quality of lenses is great either way, but any thoughts on this?

Hi Dale,

I also wear glasses and I must admit to having a minor amount of trouble seeing all of the 35mm framelines on my Bessa R. However, it's not a deal-breaking problem and it really only affects the very edges of the frame.

The screw mount lenses obviously take longer to change so if you're the type who likes to switch lenses a lot then look into the M mount Bessas.

The Bessa R is a fine camera. I've really grown to love mine after buying it sight-unseen from CameraQuest. The 35/2.5 lens is also a favorite.

 

[Dale D]

Thanks for all the replies. The Bessa R sounds like it might be the right one. I wish I could compare the viewfinders on the R and R3a in person, but that's hard to do when they're not sold locally. From the responses, it sounds like you can see most or all of the frame on the R when wearing glasses. Is it harder to see the full frame on the R3a than on the R with glasses on?

The R sounds good, but one reason I'm still wondering about the R3a is that the 40mm focal length is appealing... but it's not a must.

Thanks,
Dale

 

[RML]

The R sounds good, but one reason I'm still wondering about the R3a is that the 40mm focal length is appealing... but it's not a must.

I use my Rokkor-M 40/2 regularly on my R-D1 and the R-D1's 35mm framelines are a perfect match for the 40/2, and I mean perfect in that what I see in the framelines is exactly what I get on "film". I can't try the 40/2 on the R, of course, beacuse the R is LTM mount, not M mount, but if the framelines are the same as those on the R-D1 then you should really have no trouble.