Dralowid
Michael
The black IIIa
When I used to collect Leicas I spent a lot of time over quite a few years trying to get to the bottom of this riddle.
I made contact with a number of 'those who know' and put together a picture. The files for this lie in an old computer in the attic and there they will stay for now so herewith no details.
What follows is from memory.
(For the record I used to collect black ltm cameras only, this I narrowed down to black factory conversions only, before giving up when the money got silly.)
It is said by more than one person that Leitz put a batch of serial numbers to one side for black IIIa bodies.
I don't remember the numbers but do remember that some chrome cameras had been found within that range.
Sartorious mentions this rumour about 800 being made but goes on to say that there is no evidence to support it.
The suggestion was also put forward that by 1935 chrome was so popular that it was decided that it wasn't worth offering black as part of the stock range. This doesn't make much sense either. Late IIIs carried on being supplied until 1939 and can be found black with chrome knobs (very nice).
Although the II was made for around 16 years one must assume that they gave up with black versions at some point. I had a black II with chrome knobs that was late 1930s (very nice indeed).
The 250 is also nearly always black but one can assume it was a special order and not a stock item.
So...I assume
Leitz did think about making a black IIIa and decided not to proceed.
Some of the numbers in the range they put to one side have appeared on chrome cameras. This implies that they decided not to proceed.
None of the experts have ever actually seen one.
I have never seen one (which admittedly doesn't mean much but I did hunt for a few years).
I do not believe that an original new black IIIa ever left the factory. There are certainly repaints around, some better than others.
My black IIIa is a pre war conversion...
(I would be more than happy to be proved wrong!!!)
When I used to collect Leicas I spent a lot of time over quite a few years trying to get to the bottom of this riddle.
I made contact with a number of 'those who know' and put together a picture. The files for this lie in an old computer in the attic and there they will stay for now so herewith no details.
What follows is from memory.
(For the record I used to collect black ltm cameras only, this I narrowed down to black factory conversions only, before giving up when the money got silly.)
It is said by more than one person that Leitz put a batch of serial numbers to one side for black IIIa bodies.
I don't remember the numbers but do remember that some chrome cameras had been found within that range.
Sartorious mentions this rumour about 800 being made but goes on to say that there is no evidence to support it.
The suggestion was also put forward that by 1935 chrome was so popular that it was decided that it wasn't worth offering black as part of the stock range. This doesn't make much sense either. Late IIIs carried on being supplied until 1939 and can be found black with chrome knobs (very nice).
Although the II was made for around 16 years one must assume that they gave up with black versions at some point. I had a black II with chrome knobs that was late 1930s (very nice indeed).
The 250 is also nearly always black but one can assume it was a special order and not a stock item.
So...I assume
Leitz did think about making a black IIIa and decided not to proceed.
Some of the numbers in the range they put to one side have appeared on chrome cameras. This implies that they decided not to proceed.
None of the experts have ever actually seen one.
I have never seen one (which admittedly doesn't mean much but I did hunt for a few years).
I do not believe that an original new black IIIa ever left the factory. There are certainly repaints around, some better than others.
My black IIIa is a pre war conversion...
(I would be more than happy to be proved wrong!!!)
Erik van Straten
Veteran
Michael, a very nice contribution to the discussion about the black IIIa. Thank you very much.
Personally I've never seen one, except yours here on RFf. Can you add a picture of that one to this discussion? Thanks!
"Late IIIs carried on being supplied until 1939 and can be found black with chrome knobs (very nice)." I remember reading somewhere that these cameras were made for exportation. This batch was made in 1939. They're very nice cameras indeed.
Erik.
Personally I've never seen one, except yours here on RFf. Can you add a picture of that one to this discussion? Thanks!
"Late IIIs carried on being supplied until 1939 and can be found black with chrome knobs (very nice)." I remember reading somewhere that these cameras were made for exportation. This batch was made in 1939. They're very nice cameras indeed.
Erik.
Dralowid
Michael
Yes, I had both the chrome knob cameras. They had baseplates in English. Sold some while ago. I will look for some pictures.
Just a little extra point of confusion. My black IIIa conversion has a nickel speed dial (I think Erik you have or have a picture of something similar?). One has to ask why such a thing would be in the Wetzlar parts box...
Just a little extra point of confusion. My black IIIa conversion has a nickel speed dial (I think Erik you have or have a picture of something similar?). One has to ask why such a thing would be in the Wetzlar parts box...
Erik van Straten
Veteran
This one has a 1/1000, a postwar conversion.
Erik.
Erik.
Hans Berkhout
Well-known
analoged
Well-known
I've had black IIIa pre war conversion, and now have a black IIIa post war conversion in shark skin.