Ljós
Well-known
Folks,
so I am back to using Ilford HP5 after a (lovely) stint with TMY2, and am now looking at rolling my own in the future. I am using two M2 and have already done my homework (need IXMOO, not Filca, and their difference and how to identify them: got that sorted).
There is Tom's tutorial on how to load them, and plenty other information... the one thing that never comes up is how you actually load them in the camera. My guess: when loading the bulk film you leave out a bit of leader, the leader will be "pinched" by the revolving door of the IXMOO, but the IXMOO will still be lighttight. Then when you load the film in the camera, you can still pull more leader out so as to fit across the film gate, with IXMOO closed? Gotta be that way. So you scratch that part of the film real good, but it won't matter since it is exposed to light anyway.
You mount the bottom plate, and that opens the IXMOO.
Am I correct? I told you in the header, it is the most basic IXMOO-question ever! ;-)
All the best,
Ljós
so I am back to using Ilford HP5 after a (lovely) stint with TMY2, and am now looking at rolling my own in the future. I am using two M2 and have already done my homework (need IXMOO, not Filca, and their difference and how to identify them: got that sorted).
There is Tom's tutorial on how to load them, and plenty other information... the one thing that never comes up is how you actually load them in the camera. My guess: when loading the bulk film you leave out a bit of leader, the leader will be "pinched" by the revolving door of the IXMOO, but the IXMOO will still be lighttight. Then when you load the film in the camera, you can still pull more leader out so as to fit across the film gate, with IXMOO closed? Gotta be that way. So you scratch that part of the film real good, but it won't matter since it is exposed to light anyway.
You mount the bottom plate, and that opens the IXMOO.
Am I correct? I told you in the header, it is the most basic IXMOO-question ever! ;-)
All the best,
Ljós
ChrisN
Striving
Yep - exactly right. Congratulations, and good light! I love using IXMOO in my M4 as I never get scratches on my negs. Cheers!
Ljós
Well-known
Chris,
thanks, that was fast! And from "down under"
Never ceases to amaze me how people from all continents can pool their knowledge about our beloved Rangefinders and arcane paraphernalia.
Greetings, Ljós
thanks, that was fast! And from "down under"
Never ceases to amaze me how people from all continents can pool their knowledge about our beloved Rangefinders and arcane paraphernalia.Greetings, Ljós
haempe
Well-known
Another good thing, you don't need worry about "light-piping" with PE based films. I load alot of Efke in Filca/Ixmoo, never a problem!
Good light... also from me...
Good light... also from me...
Ljós
Well-known
So my first IXMOO loading (in total darkness and with a selfmade improvised ABLON-substitute) was a success. The developed film came out without any scratches or marks. I did get some very noticable white flecks on a few negs, which look like small fibres/dust, suggesting that I may have got dust onto the film/into the IXMOO during my first fumble-in-the-dark attempt. However, since I only developed for a first overall test of my loading procedure, and to see if the expired film stock I bought was fine/usable/horrible, I cut some corners during developing and drying. I am satisfied it is scratch-free, the dust issue I am sure I can solve.
One more question: I wondered whether it was mandatory to cut a small tongue into the film leader for use in Leica M (not talking about the 12cm tongue for LTM). Turns out that, for loading, no, you do not need it. I think a M Leica could care less about this. However, upon rewinding the film, without a "tongue" there is so much film grasped by the M-spool that you would need a lot of torque to release the film off the spool.
The reason why I think it would be nice not to have to cut a tongue into the film is not so much saving this procedure, or saving film, but this: for developing the film the film needs to be "straight" without a tongue in order not to jam the developing reels. Without an IXMOO, I used to not rewind the film fully into the cassettes, leave the leader out and to cut the film straight before then winding it all in, saving me fumbling in the changing bag with scissors.
Now, by not cutting a leader-tongue, having the M-spool grasp only so much of the film that it can come off again without too much force when rewinding, the advantage would be to rewind the film completely into the IXMOO and be done with everything. Also, in the field there would be no way to confuse an already exposed IXMOO with a fresh load. (So far I used to write on my cassettes with markers, but with IXMOO it seems to make more sense to write on the canisters, especially the ones with an erasable and rewritable field on the cap.)
Has any of you some longterm experience with feeding a M Leica with leaderless film?
Greetings,
Ljós
One more question: I wondered whether it was mandatory to cut a small tongue into the film leader for use in Leica M (not talking about the 12cm tongue for LTM). Turns out that, for loading, no, you do not need it. I think a M Leica could care less about this. However, upon rewinding the film, without a "tongue" there is so much film grasped by the M-spool that you would need a lot of torque to release the film off the spool.
The reason why I think it would be nice not to have to cut a tongue into the film is not so much saving this procedure, or saving film, but this: for developing the film the film needs to be "straight" without a tongue in order not to jam the developing reels. Without an IXMOO, I used to not rewind the film fully into the cassettes, leave the leader out and to cut the film straight before then winding it all in, saving me fumbling in the changing bag with scissors.
Now, by not cutting a leader-tongue, having the M-spool grasp only so much of the film that it can come off again without too much force when rewinding, the advantage would be to rewind the film completely into the IXMOO and be done with everything. Also, in the field there would be no way to confuse an already exposed IXMOO with a fresh load. (So far I used to write on my cassettes with markers, but with IXMOO it seems to make more sense to write on the canisters, especially the ones with an erasable and rewritable field on the cap.)
Has any of you some longterm experience with feeding a M Leica with leaderless film?
Greetings,
Ljós
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
I do cut a bit of a leader - 3-4 cm just because the M-take up spool can grab the film very tight and you put un-necessary stress on the rewind.
I have a rule that any IXMOO with exposed film goes in my right hand pocket - "fresh" IXMOO in the left hand pocket!!! Always rewind fully too - this allows you to differentiate between exposed and unexposed film!
Also, keep empty IXMOO's in one spot and the ones with exposed film in another! They look exactly the same! There has been times when I scrambled them and spent some extended time trying to figure out which one was loaded - all done in total darkness with foul language as I was opening IXMOO after IXMOO trying to find which one had film in it!!!!!
I am soon faced with another massive loading effort - 1200 ft of XX (200+ IXMOO's) as I am down to a mere 20 loaded right now. A Day in the Dark!
I have a rule that any IXMOO with exposed film goes in my right hand pocket - "fresh" IXMOO in the left hand pocket!!! Always rewind fully too - this allows you to differentiate between exposed and unexposed film!
Also, keep empty IXMOO's in one spot and the ones with exposed film in another! They look exactly the same! There has been times when I scrambled them and spent some extended time trying to figure out which one was loaded - all done in total darkness with foul language as I was opening IXMOO after IXMOO trying to find which one had film in it!!!!!
I am soon faced with another massive loading effort - 1200 ft of XX (200+ IXMOO's) as I am down to a mere 20 loaded right now. A Day in the Dark!
Ljós
Well-known
Tom, thanks for chiming in!
Oh yes, I found this out, too... So, since you rewind the film into the IXMOO completely: do you cut the leader in darkness before loading on developing reels? I have done this some times when I did not leave the leader out by mistake, but making a clean cut in the dark without hitting a sprocket hole is a minor nuisance. Or have you made a template for this as well?
Greetings, Ljós
And: ah, "down to a mere 20 loaded ones"... a luxury problem ;-), I am in the process of accumulating "enough" IXMOOs
Oh yes, I found this out, too... So, since you rewind the film into the IXMOO completely: do you cut the leader in darkness before loading on developing reels? I have done this some times when I did not leave the leader out by mistake, but making a clean cut in the dark without hitting a sprocket hole is a minor nuisance. Or have you made a template for this as well?
Greetings, Ljós
And: ah, "down to a mere 20 loaded ones"... a luxury problem ;-), I am in the process of accumulating "enough" IXMOOs
haempe
Well-known
I pull all leaders out in darkness or changing bag, close the cassettes again, lights on, then cut for loading into the reel.
I store all empty cassettes open, helps to hold the overview.
I store all empty cassettes open, helps to hold the overview.
Ljós
Well-known
Gee, you are right, it did not occur to me so far that the IXMOO, other than a usual canister, can be opened easily for this purpose, too
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
I cut the leader in the dark (and have the scars to prove it!). I just do a semi-circular cut (makes it easy to pull the film into the Patterson reels.
As for leaving them open when stored - they tend to attract dust this way. I have occasional fits of cleanliness and dust them out with a toothbrush. I store empties in a couple of 8x10" paper boxes - line them up and then put the top on it. Keeps it reasonably dustfree.
Loaded cassettes are stored in the plastic containers (black bakelite) with that stupid foam rubber in the bottom removed. It disintegrates and creates its own dust particles.
As for leaving them open when stored - they tend to attract dust this way. I have occasional fits of cleanliness and dust them out with a toothbrush. I store empties in a couple of 8x10" paper boxes - line them up and then put the top on it. Keeps it reasonably dustfree.
Loaded cassettes are stored in the plastic containers (black bakelite) with that stupid foam rubber in the bottom removed. It disintegrates and creates its own dust particles.
haempe
Well-known
I store them open in a covered box, no serious problems with dust until now.
But I blow they always out with canned air before loading the film...
johannielscom
Snorting silver salts
No leader here, no trouble with too much force on the rewind either. Those modern acetate films are tough!
No full rewind, I fold them film four, five times (like 'mouse steps', all crinkled) to distinguish them from empties (no leader) and readies (smooth leader).
All are stored in either the black Leitz canisters or in transparent Foma canisters with the blue cap, these are just a wee bit taller than regular canisters and are sufficiently flexible to let the spring go between canister and cap.
No full rewind, I fold them film four, five times (like 'mouse steps', all crinkled) to distinguish them from empties (no leader) and readies (smooth leader).
All are stored in either the black Leitz canisters or in transparent Foma canisters with the blue cap, these are just a wee bit taller than regular canisters and are sufficiently flexible to let the spring go between canister and cap.
zerobuttons
Well-known
I´m budging in here, since I am as noobyish as the OP regarding IXMOOs.
Have I got this right: the M6 (no TTL) can use the IXMOO, and mr. Abrahamssons Rapidwinder can be ordered to be usable with IXMOO?
Have I got this right: the M6 (no TTL) can use the IXMOO, and mr. Abrahamssons Rapidwinder can be ordered to be usable with IXMOO?
Livesteamer
Well-known
Early M6 only. Later M6 does not have the right fitting to open the ixmoo. My 1985 M6 will work ixmoo but not my 1999. I don't know when they made the change. Joe
Ljós
Well-known
But, fitted with a baseplate from an early M6, it will work. Not working, no matter which baseplate: M7 and MP.
Greetings, Ljós
Tom A
RFF Sponsor
I dont make a M4P/M6 rapidwinder that handles IXMOO's. To much of a chance that people start trying them on M7 etc and the IXMOO's will tear out some of the springs and contacts for film-coding. The only production Rapidwinder for IXMOO's is a limited series of M2 winders. All in all 100 of them - mainly put them in production to satisfy my own need.
The M6 winder can be made to work with the IXMOO - but it is not a simple job. A new interior top plate would have to be machined and a new locking disc made up. Too small a market for that kind of redesign. I have one that I made as a prototype and use mainly on a M4P - but no plans for production.
The M6 winder can be made to work with the IXMOO - but it is not a simple job. A new interior top plate would have to be machined and a new locking disc made up. Too small a market for that kind of redesign. I have one that I made as a prototype and use mainly on a M4P - but no plans for production.
zerobuttons
Well-known
Thank you for helping me in getting these facts right.
zerobuttons
Well-known
Oh, just one more thing:
Could I persuade any of you with an IXMOO compatible baseplate, to show a picture of the detail making it IXMOO compatible? I would like to know exactly what to look for when trying to hunt down an M6 that can use IXMOOs.
I hope you can help. Thank you in advance.
Could I persuade any of you with an IXMOO compatible baseplate, to show a picture of the detail making it IXMOO compatible? I would like to know exactly what to look for when trying to hunt down an M6 that can use IXMOOs.
I hope you can help. Thank you in advance.
Livesteamer
Well-known
Look at e bay #220551728897 I think this is the plate that opens the ixmoo. Looks just like my early M6 part and I've been wondering if it would fit my M6 .85 and replace the flat disc it has. Joe
zerobuttons
Well-known
Thank you, Joe. Can anyone else confirm this?