Voigtlander R2M R3M 250th Set Info

[CameraQuest]

it's nice to be able to talk about these. Tom Abrahamsson and I discussed the 250th Anniversary sets with Mr. K last March at the factory. We suggested a black paint finish, 39mm filter size, and a faster than 50/3.5 Heliar lens. Mr. K was not sure at the time if a 50/2 Heliar could be produced. It seems Mr. K kept the Cosina lens designers burning the midnight oil.

At this point in time, the R3M and R2M are available only in the special edition Voigtlander 250th Anniversary sets.

These are mechanical shutter versions of the R3A and R2A. Finish either black paint or silver paint. Total production 2500 cameras world wide. 300 Silver R2M, 700 Black R2M, 500 Silver R3M and 1000 Black R3M.

The Voigtlander 250th sets will be sold only with the collapsible 50/2 M mount Heliar. Two versions of the lens, black paint or chrome, 39mm filter size.

Estimated June deliveries. No price yet set. So far the R2M, R3M cameras and 50/2 Heliar lenses have only been announced as being available in the 250th Anniversary sets. Not sure how many I will be able to get, but taking deposits.

Stephen Gandy

 

[wlewisiii]

Thank you for the information, I certainly appreciate it.

Do you believe there is any chance of the lens being made for general purchase? I really don't have a need for a collectable camera, but I would really love to use that lens on my CL.

Thanks,

William

 

[Peter]

I concur with William! I want the lens! If this faster version of the magnificent Heliar 50mm performs as well well as its slower bretheren, I want it!

 

[Palaeoboy]

Mr K often listens to camera users to evolve his cameras but he didnt listen to the last major complaint about the last 50mm Heliar its seems. He is only offering that lens in limited edition kits again. I know quite a few people that want a modern collapsable 50 and were a bit miffed the last 50mm Heliar not being offered seperately. If this turns out to be the same deal he is repeating that mistake.

 

[Peter]

I could not agree more with Palaeboy! Mr. K please offer the coming Heliar 50mm/2 as a standard production lens!

 

[hth]

I have the previous collapsible Heliar 50/3.5 and it is fantastic.

This new Heliar is also very interesting to me as I have been thinking 50/2 or 75/2 for some time now, and recently decided to wait another year or so.

It is a pity that the lens is sold with a camera body, as I would rather sell one of my four M bodies than getting a fifth one.. 🙁

In the end, I think I will pass this one and get another 50/2 instead, an old Summicron or a ZI Planar, and they will also be available separately a year from now.

/Håkan

 

[celluloidprop]

Depending on the total price, it still might be cheaper to buy the set and sell the R2M/3M body afterward and just keep the new 50/2 for yourself.

 

[Doug]

I expect Cosina has carefully thought out the marketing issues for this offering. Limited editions tend to enhance the brand, I think, and induce GAS attacks among the faithful... 😀 I would prefer the AE feature of the regular models (battery dependency is ok), and my 50mm Skopar is probably as small as the collapsed Heliar. There are plenty of other fine 50mm lenses from which to choose that don't have the collapsible feature, undesirable in my view. I won't be the buyer of a 250th Anniversary set, but that's ok too; it's a limited edition and will surely sell out profitably! 🙂

 

[Palaeoboy]

"Depending on the total price, it still might be cheaper to buy the set and sell the R2M/3M body afterward and just keep the new 50/2 for yourself"

Yes you could do that but you really shouldnt have to. The Voigtlander concept is to offer affordable rangefinder equipment so you shouldnt have to outlay extra cash to get a lens you wanted and then go through the hassle to sell the body afterwards.

 

[Stephanie Brim]

Guys, there's nothing said about him NOT doing that...these are just special editions. I'd love to see this camera offered in the same black and grey as the others.

 

[dcsang]

hmm.. if Mr K wasn't sure whether the 50/2 could be produced; is that because of design limitations or factory limitations or both?

The first thing that ran through my head was "but Leica's been doing it for years and Canon did it long ago" etc. etc.

I'm just curious really because I know the quality of the Voigtlander lenses is superb, even if it's got detractors due to subjective bokeh interpretation 🙂

Dave

 

[George S.]

Yes you could do that but you really shouldnt have to. The Voigtlander concept is to offer affordable rangefinder equipment so you shouldnt have to outlay extra cash to get a lens you wanted and then go through the hassle to sell the body afterwards.

Who's to say just what the Voigtlander concept is? Just because C-V under Mr. K. has (mostly) listened to what RF users actually want and then made those products available at affordable prices is hugely commendable, but the first order of business for any company is to make a profit. He's watched Leica basically survive on limited edition offerings for 10 or more years, who's to blame him for trying something similar on a smaller, less expensive scale? I too, wish the lens was available alone, but if I wanted the darn lens so bad enough, I'd buy the set and sell the body off.

 

[George S.]

hmm.. if Mr K wasn't sure whether the 50/2 could be produced; is that because of design limitations or factory limitations or both? Dave

My guess is it's due to factory limitations. Didn't they drop a lens or two in the past just before offering new, different lenses?

 

[CameraQuest]

50/2 HELIAR Design

50/2 HELIAR Design

the challenge had nothing to do with producing a 50/2 lens. It has to do with producing a 50/2 of HELIAR optical design. THAT has never been done before in 35mm photography, and Mr. K was not sure it could be done.

if you add up the various lenses, bodies, and accessories in the Voigtlander, Zeiss and Epson RD lineups, it soon becomes obvious that Cosina is producing far more products than its nearest rangefinder competitor, Leica. Don't lose any sleep about Cosina not be able to produce something from a standpoint of capacity. It is admitedly a small niche market, but Mr. K has it nailed. The Zeiss site talks about producing 1000 Zeiss Ikon bodies a month.

Stephen

 

[wlewisiii]

I still want the lens without the body 😀 I realize it probably wouldn't be very cheap, perhaps even on a par with the 35/1.2, but I think that would make an excellent flagship 50 for the line.

Ah, well, we'll all know someday. 🙂

William

 

[sychan]

I'm kind of curious what the Heliar design has over a planar design? Heliars are basically a complex a tessar design with with an extra element, right? Would it have the smooth bokeh of tessar designs, but with a larger central area of sharpness?
Are we talking about something as sharp and fast as an asph summicron, but without the tendency towards ring bokeh that really sharp planars seem to exhibit?

 

[anselwannab]

I wonder if this means that a Manual verison of the Ikon is due out. Kind of an Ikon MP. Might help keep things fresh if a digital version is longer in the offing.

 

[monaho]

Manual version of the IKON coming soon and soon meaning not a few years? Maybe it will have all the bugs worked out but at a higher cost. This is good news.

 

[Will]

I would love to get my hands on a brand new Heliar, but not with a body, period.

A lot of people will want to buy a brandnew collapsible lense in a reasonable price (Hello, Mr. K).

A Heliar would be great, no matter if it is f/2, f/2.8, f/3.5...

Then, Tessar or even a Sonnar Type Collapsible would also be a good products with real demands!

People interested in classic camera also want classic optics, with both their positives and negatives...

 

[Huck Finn]

I'm kind of curious what the Heliar design has over a planar design? Heliars are basically a complex a tessar design with with an extra element, right? Would it have the smooth bokeh of tessar designs, but with a larger central area of sharpness?
Are we talking about something as sharp and fast as an asph summicron, but without the tendency towards ring bokeh that really sharp planars seem to exhibit?

Not a Tessar, Sychan. Rather, an evolution of the Triplet. Harting, who developed the Heliar, may have been influenced by the Tessar in developing the Dynar from the Heliar, but it is still a variation on the Triplet. After WWI, Voigtlander used the name Heliar for the Dynar for marketing purposes. This new Heliar is a modern version of the Dyanr.

Huck