What's the fair thing to do?

akptc

akptc

Shoot first, think later
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I am seeking your advice on how to handle a return of an M7 I sold here. The overseas buyer received the camera on Nov 24. On Nov 25, upon my PM inquiry, the buyer replied sounding happy with the camera, promised a "full report" next day. No PM until today, two weeks later, the buyer wants to return the camera claiming the rangefinder is not aligned and it does not have the MP finder.

Now, I never claimed it was the MP one (I would not know); however, I know for a fact, because I tested it exhaustively, the M7 did not have a misaligned rangefinder when it was shipped. So the safe assumption is, it got bumped during shipping, as I must presume the buyer did not bump it himself.

I don't mind taking the M7 back, but kind of mind having to pay for the RF fix if indeed it is off. I made no warranties to the seller, and obviously how the camera was treated during shipping was beyond my control. The shipment (via FedEx) was insured and I did call the mail center just now, was told they would file a claim but cannot promise anything since they only have 15 days since shipment to do it so this may or may not go through.

Btw, what does it cost to fix an M7 RF alignment?

So the question is, what's the right thing to do? I imagine I have the following options:

a) take the M7 back and eat the cost of any repairs
b) take the M7 back only if the buyer gets the RF fixed or pays for the adjustment. If (a big if) the insurance claim is honored, I would reimburse the buyer for the RF alignment.
c) do not take the M7 back

The main reason I am hesitating to spend time and effort on this is because it sounds to me like the buyer’s main issue is that he wanted an MP finder, which was not promised to him in the sale, but now he wants it, so here we go.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on what's the right course of action here.
 
The fair thing to do is to pay the buyer for half the cost of a RF alignment, but sometimes you just have to take it back, refunding the purchase price minus shipping.
 
Alternative resolution

Alternative resolution

May I propose an alternative? You did not say where the camera was sent. Is there a reputable repairman in the vicinty that could realign the r/f for a nominal fee, saves the return shipping and propose a sharing of the cost of the repair. I know nothing about the v/f differences. I thought most M7s had M7 v/fs and the mps had mps. Does this make sense? Just an idea. Heck of a situation.
 
You can't really know whether the RF is misaligned or not until you have the camera back. Maybe it really is misaligned; maybe he's full of it; maybe he made up the misaligned-RF claim to get you to take it back so he can get one with the MP finder. (I assume that means a later one that incorporates the MP's fix for RF-patch flare.)

So, what I would do: Offer him a full refund once he has shipped the camera back to you via insured carrier. If it were me, I'd offer to split the shipping charge with him, but that's up to you. Don't refund the money until you have the camera back.

Once you have it back, evaluate the RF situation. If it really is off, and you can get the insurance claim to pay up, get it adjusted by someone such as DAG -- it shouldn't be too expensive if it's just a minor adjustment. If the RF is OK, leave it alone.

Then sell the camera to someone who really wants it.
 
****ty situation, I would say that the buyer should have contacted you within the 1st week to report a problem. After the 1st week I would say the buyer is on his own unless you had some sort of other return policy.

For the expensive cameras I have purchased it has always been 7 days, meaning that as soon as you get the camera you shoot a couple test rolls and make sure everything is kosher...

Best of luck
 
Andy,

This is one of those tough situations that has very few perfect resolutions. You are positive you sent it out in good health. He asserts he didn't receive it in same condition. No one can disprove the other, and permitted to fester, it becomes a source of ill will. Life is too short for that.

I'd recommend you take it back, minus round trip shipping, and minus Paypal fees if any. Refund upon receipt of the camera back in your care, and be done with it. Like jlw suggests, get it looked at by DAG, then sell to someone who wants it.

Good luck
 
I read the ad and all the comments. It was clear that you did not know whether it had the upgraded viewfinder. The buyer took it with the hope that it did. For it to take two weeks to realize that the rangefinder was out of alignment seems a tad disingenuous. All that being stated, I would take it back, refund minus your shipping costs and have it realigned or upgraded and find a serious buyer.
 
If this is who I think it it is he's posted photos here that are pretty well focussed. I don't think RF alignment is something you can guarantee when you ship a camera half way across the world. If you buy a second hand camera privately then I think you have to build the possibility of a service into the price, if you buy from a dealer you expect the camera to be in perfect working order and pay a premium. If you buy privately you save money and take your chances. I would not even consider a refund in these circumstances th VF is as it left the factory and was never subject of a warranty recall. A misaligned RF can happen one day after purchase with the slighted knock. As such you cannot guarantee it. The fact that your sellee has managed to misalign his ZI quickly too implies the care of his cameras could be an issue. Customer service is one thing but don't be a mug. If you have not charged dealer prices you are under no obligation to provide dealer service. I know this sounds harsh but people can't have it both ways.
 
I wouldn't refund. Then again this is almost the same situation (the same words from both parties, different product) that got me locked out of paypr*ck for not playing by the rules of the buyer.

Be careful. Best you can do is offer to pay half the rf cost as already mentioned. Unless you specifically offered more than a week's grace on receipt of the camera, tough titty I'm afraid
 
I read the other thread. I think you have been more than reasonable. After 2 weeks I'd call it a done deal-though I see you offered a refund yesterday.
 
I don't know who has to talk to FedEx (my guess is it is you because you initiated the shipment) for refunding the repair of a possible damage to the camera, but if they are going to pay for the repair/realignment, then I would offer (as good will) to pay for the service. If not, the buyer has to take the risk and pay for the upgrade/repair to get it to the condition he imagined it to be in. If they don't pay I just wouldn't take it back because it was way more time than needed to find out about that sort of "failure".
 
Thank you very, very much for everyone's feedback, it has helped me tremendously. Here is what I just told the buyer:

===========
Hi _____, given that:

1. It has been 2 weeks and lots of things can happen to a camera in 2 weeks
2. You cannot seriously hold me responsible for what type of a viewfinder Leica installed on this M7 (read the for sale ad, I clearly stated didn't know)
3. I've already spend way too much time dealing with this sale

- here is the best I can do:

Option A

Get a quote to get the RF alignment fixed. It should be under $100US, per DAG prices. Then get the alignment fixed and send me a copy of the bill - I will refund 50% of that bill OR, if the FedEx insurance pays for 100% of the bill, I will refund you whatever they pay.

Option B

Get the alignment fixed.
Get a clean bill of health from the Leica repair person who fixed the alignment, noting any problems.
Ship the camera back to me with a copy of the bill of health.
Upon receipt, I will have the camera checked locally, repair any problems that were not there on the day I shipped it to you, and refund you what you paid me for the camera minus my shipping cost and minus my repair cost.

Let me know which option sounds better to you.

- Andy
------------------------
 
So many posts about rf adjustments.. is turning a small flat blade screwdriver a few degrees really all that difficult? Are we not MEN!
 
clintock said:
So many posts about rf adjustments.. is turning a small flat blade screwdriver a few degrees really all that difficult? Are we not MEN!
Click to expand...
Is it that easy, really? (I have no idea, want to know).
 
the screwdriver method only works for early models up to some models of M4-P ... thereafter, you need a specialized Leica tool to do it properly
 
Flyfisher Tom said:
the screwdriver method only works for early models up to some models of M4-P ... thereafter, you need a specialized Leica tool to do it properly
Click to expand...

Leica devised a way to require a special, no doubt expensive and rare tool to replace a standard flat blade screwdriver:eek:. Perhaps the M8 woes were devine retribution.
 
Gentlemen, thank you again, I am glad I asked for help here. I only hope that the buyer finds my offer fair and we can both move on to deal with new GAS attacks quickly :)
 
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