Leica M5 Lens Compatibility

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Vincenzo Maielli

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Hi to all the Rangefinder forumists. This is my first post. I love very mutch the rangefinder photography, in all the way. I need a little help from you.
I want know if the Summicron 50 mm f/ 2 Dual Range (mounted without the proper goggles) is fully compatible with the particular metering system of the Leica M5 or if request a bayonet clutch modification.
Sorry for my bad english.
Thanks to all.
Ciao.
Vincenzo Maielli
 
Welcom

The M5 use a PX 625 battery, here in The Netherland it's no for sale anymore.

No = without the spectacles ( Objecktivebajonett must be modified in Solms)
No = With spectacles (spectacles must be modified in Solms)

Leica Handbuch 2002/2005 page 9.14


Eelco
 
Thank you very mutch, dear friends.
For Eelco: i solve the battery problem with an MR-9 adapter, sold by www.the smallbatterycompany.com (a London company). This adapter have a built in micro electronical circuit that change the 1,55 voltage of the common silver oxide 386 battery to the classic 1,35 voltage of the outlawed PX625 mercury oxide battery. Work very fine. The Leica M5 is a very great camera!
Ciao.
Vincenzo
 
Dear JNewell. The answer that i received in Photo.Net don't persuade me. Now, i mount the Leitz M Summaron 35 mm f/ 2,8 (with goggles) on Leica M5, the Leitz Summicron 50 mm f/ 2 Dual Range of the Leica MP and the Voigtlaender Apo Lanthar 90 mm f/ 3,5 on the Leica M2.
Ciao.
Vincenzo
 
Eelco is right, the 50 DR has to be modified for use with the M5, no matter if you try to mount it with or without gogggles.
please see the last number of Leicapassion (in italian) about exactly this topic.
Ciao.
 
Huh??????????????

Huh??????????????

I specifically bought a 50mm DR Summicron for my M5. The camera's previous owner also used a 50mm DR Summicron on the same body. The only "modification" was to remove the small black post on the goggles which interfered with the top cover of the body. The M5+50 DR Summicron is a great pair.

Two samples, with & without goggles.
 

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My experience is this: i used for about two months my DR Summicron on my Leica M5, without any problem. Last Friday, 3 August 2007, i shooted all the morning with the M5 and Summicron DR. In the afternoon, the meter of my M5, suddenly, was locked. I was in panic, because the meter don't flowed. I removed the Summicron DR and mounted a VC 90 mm Apo Lanthar. The meter was newly operating. Subsequently, i read many reviews (Photo.net, Cameraquest, Summilux.net in french, Leicapassion in italian) and all of them speak about the modification for the bayonet mount and the goggles attachment, for use the Summicron DR on the Leica M5, but i find these reviews not too clear about the matter, and i post this question.
Ciao.
Vincenzo
 
the modification of the bayonet is not required for the 50 DR (it is not even suitable, as it blocks the meter arm). You need this modification only for old 28 Elmarits (up to 1969) and Super-Angulons (up to 1971). You can find all informations about M5 compatibility in the reprint of the Leica Manual for M5/CL/Leicaflex by Hove Books.
Ciao.
 
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Eelco is right, although i don't read the dutch language. This pubblication agree the same that i read in english, french or italian (particularly in the Summilux.net or Leicapassion web sites). According these pubblications, the Summaron M 35 mm f/ 3,5 (not the f/ 2,8) and the Summicron M 50 mm f/ 2 D.R. both request the bayonet and goggles modification for use on the Leica M5.
Ciao.
 
Incorrect

Incorrect

Vincenzo Maielli said:
Eelco is right, although i don't read the dutch language. This pubblication agree the same that i read in english, french or italian (particularly in the Summilux.net or Leicapassion web sites). According these pubblications, the Summaron M 35 mm f/ 3,5 (not the f/ 2,8) and the Summicron M 50 mm f/ 2 D.R. both request the bayonet and goggles modification for use on the Leica M5.
Ciao.
Click to expand...

Wrong. Too many DR Summicrons have been used on too many M5 bodies without harm to either. I used my 50 DR Summicron on BOTH of my M5 bodies last Saturday, Sunday & Monday in New Orleans. The lens is a pleasure and the M5 is a joy. A match made in heaven!

Could someone please post a link, in English, to these reports of modifications? I own the original M5 instruction manual. There is no mention of the 50 DR Summicron requiring any modification. I repeat: the only thing you need to do is remove the black post from the goggles. It takes less than 30 seconds.

Enjoy your lens!
 
Here you go...

Here you go...

This confirms what I have been saying. The googles need a minor modification. That's all folks.

The Leica M5: Leitz's big ugly failure, or not...
by Craig Hoehne; created 2006

...
Lens compatibility issues
The major drawback to the intricate pivoting photocell setup is that the exposed meter arm is very delicate and can easily be damaged. As a precaution against accidental damage the vulnerable metering arm automatically drops out harms way when the lens is removed from the camera. A damaged meter arm necessitates a rather costly repair.

Certain deep-seated wide angle lenses, such as the 28mm Elmarit (below the sn 2 314 920), and pre-M5 production Super-Angulon 21mm lenses, have rear elements that protrude well into the lens mount body cavity, to the extent that they interfering with the meter carrier arm. These cannot be used with the M5 without factory modification and are unable to take advantage of TTL metering. All later lenses within the Leica M range are fully compatible with the M5.

Another obvious danger to the M5s pivoting meter are collapsible lenses which if retracted will injure the carrier arm. Other problem lenses for the M5 include those with removable viewfinder attachments, ie the 35mm f1:3.5 Summaron and the 50mm Dual Range Summicron. The auxiliary optical attachments of these lenses butt up against the front plate of the Leica M5 and cannot be fitted without modification.

The M5 is also supplied with its own body cap and it is recommended that only this type be used.

References; Ernst Leitz GMBH Wetzlar, Older interchangeable lenses on the Leica M5, pub. 120-47/Engl. Germany, (1971)
Ernst Leitz GMBH Wetzlar, Instructions: Leica M5, pub. 110-88/Engl. Germany, (1971)
...
Click to expand...

Link to full review
 
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OK, I have been using an M3 since approximately the date of the M5's introduction. I have read and currently own probably ever leaflet, booklet, instruction book, manual and third-party book ever published on the Leica M, and I've read most of LFI for decades.

The only warning I see that relates to the "mount" of the 35/3.5 and the DRS is in Osterloh's book on the M (I have both editions). I am not sure what the reference is being made there, nor whether it has been faithfully translated from the German original.

I can tell you that other than the reference in Osterloh's (translated) book, I have never seen any caution in an official printed Leica materials referring to anything more than modification of the goggles to remove the post on the rear of the goggles. I have used the DRS on an M5 I owned with no problems whatsoever.
 
Sorry for the language mistake, dear Eelco.
The confused situation of the Leica M5 lenses compatibility it's normal, partially created from the same Leitz factory, at moment of the M5 presentation.
I have read many reviews on this issue and, in the real life, my Leica M5 with the Summicron D.R. was recently flocked in the metering system. Now, to avoid any risk to damage my M5, i have decided to mount my Summaron 35 mm f/ 2,8 with goggles on my M5. Moreover, the Summaron 35 mm f/ 2,8 with goggles is very beautiful on the M5, more than other Leica M cameras, due to the very blamed bigger dimensions of the M5, in respect of the Leica M3, M2 and M4.
Ciao.
 
About LEITZ's official communications on M5

About LEITZ's official communications on M5

Hi everibody,

The original instruction manual for the M5 issued in many languages (reference 110-88) forward to a supplement sheet for complete informations on lens compatibility. This is the sheet with Leitz reference 120-47.

Now, if you lack one or both, they are available also in a booklet, issued by Leica in about 1975, and containing the reprint of the instruction manuals for M5/CL/Leicaflex/SL/SL2/Bellows. The English version of this booklet is actually reprinted by Hove Books (you can order it at their website), and there you can find both the M5 manual and its supplement sheet number 120-47 reprinted.

This sheet states that 3 kinds of modifications are needed:

1) you have to add a 9,5mm Dymo tape on all collapsible lens, except for the Hektor 2.5/50, that need a 12,7mm Dymo tape (NOTE: this is actually not true for the Summicron, that you can safely collapse in a M5, because it doesn't go inside deeply enough to catch the meter arm)

2) you have to modify the bayonet of the 4/21 Super Angulons (or the adapter for the screw mount version); the bayonet of the 3,4/21 below number 2473251; the abyonet of the 2,8/28 Elmarits below number 2314921

3) finally: modifications are requested for the 3,5/35 Summarons with spectacles (the version without is ok) and for the 2/50 Dual Range.

For cases 1 and 2 you risk the contact of the rear protruding element of the lens with the meter arm. For case 3 the problem is the M5 cover plate shape, that fouls these lenses. I guess that, if you have had these lenses machined by Leitz, you can use them safely with their respective "eyes" (that's the point!)

Best regards
 
Sorry about the metering problem

Sorry about the metering problem

Vincenzo Maielli said:
... in the real life, my Leica M5 with the Summicron D.R. was recently flocked in the metering system. ...
Ciao.
Click to expand...

I am sorry to hear that your M5 and D.R. Summicron are experiencing problems. I would hope that this is an isolated fault with your body and lens. This is the first I have heard about this problem.

For anyone searching this Forum in the future, I want to state once more that neither I nor the previous owners of both of my M5 bodies had any trouble with the lens and metering arm. That is a total of 3 different 50mm D.R. Summicrons on two different bodies and no reported problems of the lens not working with the M5 body.

If you still have doubts, contact Sherry Krauter:

http://www.sherrykrauter.com/

Sherry knows more about the M5 than anyone I know.

I bought a 28mm Konica M-Hexanon lens last year. When I first saw the lens, I was concerned that it might protrude too far into the M5 body and cause a problem with the meter arm. The lens protrudes 12mm inside the body. I mounted the lens and very slowly cocked the shutter. The arm did not hit the lens. The 50mm D.R. Summicron is much shrter than the 28mm M-Hexanon lens.

I enjoy my D.R. Summicron and M5s. Case closed as far as I am concerned.

ps: The camera and lens I am holding in my avatar are the M5 with 50mm D.R. Summicron.
 
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