ferider
Veteran
Hi Raid,
I'll bail out on the two lenses that I promised, sorry; please do not wait for them and discard them from the list.
I will help with the post-processing though, if you still want, send me email when you have the first scans.
Thanks,
Roland.
I'll bail out on the two lenses that I promised, sorry; please do not wait for them and discard them from the list.
I will help with the post-processing though, if you still want, send me email when you have the first scans.
Thanks,
Roland.
raid
Dad Photographer
Hi Roland,
No problem at all.
I will then start the photography marathon sessions as soon as possible.
I will certainly take you on your offer to help with the post processing. Your work last project made my work much more useful.
No problem at all.
I will then start the photography marathon sessions as soon as possible.
I will certainly take you on your offer to help with the post processing. Your work last project made my work much more useful.
Sam N
Well-known
Do we need mid distances? Maybe just 1.5m and infinity.
That would give you 23x3x2 = 138 shots, which is just 4 rolls of 36exp.
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raid
Dad Photographer
Hi Sam,
I will start with the 1.5m distance, as I usually do.
I need to work out a design plan for the different mounts.
I hesitate to use the adapters except maybe the Nokton Prominent - Contax adapter since the Prominent [camera] is a pain to use.
I still will have several lenses in LTM/M/Contax/Nikon mounts. There are 22 lenses involved. I need to use three different cameras simultaneously for any given choice of distance and aperture.
How many lenses are LTM or M? ==> Bessa T
How many are in Contax mount? ==> Contax IIIa
How many are in Nikon S mount? ==> Nikon S
If I separate LTM and M lenses, I would need four cameras then.
This would not be a bad idea at all. The fewer adapters are used, the fewer factors of noise will be added to the experiment.
For one 36 exposure roll for a given mount with 8 lenses:
wide open + 2.8 + 4.0 + 8.0 at 1.5 m ==> 4x8=32
With LTM and M lenses on one camera, the number of rolls gets reduced.
I need this set-up for the flare test plus the indoors portrait test plus the outdoors portrait test. Almost all clear lenses do well at infinity.
This means that I will need either nine or twelve rolls of film, depending whether I keep the LTM and M lenses separated or together. This is also assuming that I will not replicate the testing, which I usually do. Let's say, I need nine rolls.
With an additional replicate, I need another nine rolls,for a total of eighteen rolls.
This suggests that I better reduce the number of aperture settings from 4 settings to two.
wide open + 4.0.
I will need nine rolls.
What do you think ? Am I on the right track?
ampguy
Veteran
Hi Raid, I'd skip wide open, and just shoot them at f4, and f5.6 and maybe 8.
Sam N
Well-known
I think you should use the same camera for M and LTM lenses. All you need is one guaranteed good adapter and you don't have to worry about it.
If you're shooting on a tripod with a cable release, I don't think you'll need to duplicate each shot.
How about this:
For each lens:
One flare / sharpness test wide open at 1.5m
One flare / sharpness test at f2.0 and 1.5m
One outdoor test at f2.8
One outdoor test at f8
Most people don't use ND filters to shoot wide open in daylight anyway.
The flare test should include some sort of detailed flat surface near the corners and the center, but also have enough OOF background to be a test of bokeh. It should also include some objects just behind and just in front of the intended focus point, to allow differentiation between focus problems and sharpness.
That gives 23x4 shots.
If you want to cut down more: is it really necessary to test FIVE J-3s? All we'd be learning is about the sample variation between those particular lenses. Maybe you could just test the nicest looking J-3 against the beat-up one.
This whole thing would be much easier with a full-frame digital RF with live-view.
If you're shooting on a tripod with a cable release, I don't think you'll need to duplicate each shot.
How about this:
For each lens:
One flare / sharpness test wide open at 1.5m
One flare / sharpness test at f2.0 and 1.5m
One outdoor test at f2.8
One outdoor test at f8
Most people don't use ND filters to shoot wide open in daylight anyway.
The flare test should include some sort of detailed flat surface near the corners and the center, but also have enough OOF background to be a test of bokeh. It should also include some objects just behind and just in front of the intended focus point, to allow differentiation between focus problems and sharpness.
That gives 23x4 shots.
If you want to cut down more: is it really necessary to test FIVE J-3s? All we'd be learning is about the sample variation between those particular lenses. Maybe you could just test the nicest looking J-3 against the beat-up one.
This whole thing would be much easier with a full-frame digital RF with live-view.
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raid
Dad Photographer
Many people here insist on the wide open shots for fast lenses. This is how they want to use such lenses.
At 5.6 or8.0, if the lens has no internal flaws, the results should be sharp for any lens.
raid
Dad Photographer
I think you should use the same camera for M and LTM lenses. All you need is one guaranteed good adapter and you don't have to worry about it.
If you're shooting on a tripod with a cable release, I don't think you'll need to duplicate each shot.
How about this:
For each lens:
One flare / sharpness test wide open at 1.5m
One flare / sharpness test at f2.0 and 1.5m
One outdoor test at f2.8
One outdoor test at f8
Most people don't use ND filters to shoot wide open in daylight anyway.
The flare test should include some sort of detailed flat surface near the corners and the center, but also have enough OOF background to be a test of bokeh. It should also include some objects just behind and just in front of the intended focus point, to allow differentiation between focus problems and sharpness.
That gives 23x4 shots.
If you want to cut down more: is it really necessary to test FIVE J-3s? All we'd be learning is about the sample variation between those particular lenses. Maybe you could just test the nicest looking J-3 against the beat-up one.
This whole thing would be much easier with a full-frame digital RF with live-view.
These are good suggestions, Sam.
I will skip shooting replicates, and so the number of negatives are cut to half. The proposed settings are very practical.
I hardly ever will have five J-3 lenses with me, so maybe a test is warranted here for this purpose.
I am getting mentally prepared to do the testing.
I just did some counting. There are seventeen LTM/M lenses, two Nikkor S lenses, and five Contax Lenses.
Roll 1: LTM/M lenses flare/sharpness @ 1.4/1.5 and 2.8
Roll 2: LTM/M lenses outdoor portraits @ 2.8 and 8
Roll 3: Nikkor S lenses
Roll 4: Contax lenses
This is not bad at all.
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Cutly
Established
I'm really interested in this test ! Specially for the J-3 part..
raid
Dad Photographer
I will keep the five or six J-3 lenses in the test. They are copies of the CZJ Sonnar, so a comparison with the genuine CZJ lenses will be also interesting.
raid
Dad Photographer
I am waiting for the girls to go to bed by 8:30-9:00pm. Then I have to "work" with the lens testing part 1.
raid
Dad Photographer
I have started the testing 30 minutes ago.
1. LTM lenses
I used a Bessa T with a Leitz adapter on a heavy Gitzo tripod.
I have a bare bulb for flare test.
I have video cases all across the focus line to see if sharpness is same center to edges.
My focus point: a Rolleiflex 3.5C with a set of lines used as a cross target.
Film: Portra 160NC
Settings: 1/60 at wide open 1.4 or 1.5
1/15 at 2.8
Wish me luck.
I will now do the M mount lenses.
1. LTM lenses
I used a Bessa T with a Leitz adapter on a heavy Gitzo tripod.
I have a bare bulb for flare test.
I have video cases all across the focus line to see if sharpness is same center to edges.
My focus point: a Rolleiflex 3.5C with a set of lines used as a cross target.
Film: Portra 160NC
Settings: 1/60 at wide open 1.4 or 1.5
1/15 at 2.8
Wish me luck.
I will now do the M mount lenses.
raid
Dad Photographer
I will next take portraits with all lenses. Maybe this Saturday is the day during which a lot will be accomplished.
I find it much easier for me to use the Bessa T for focusing than using the Nikon S or the Contax IIIa. The 1.5X magnification in the T's focusing aid is really useful for lens tests. The second point was shooting into bare bulb light caused flare to show up in the two other lenses' viewfinder.
I usually go back eventually and take additional rolls of film for specific lenses.
I find it much easier for me to use the Bessa T for focusing than using the Nikon S or the Contax IIIa. The 1.5X magnification in the T's focusing aid is really useful for lens tests. The second point was shooting into bare bulb light caused flare to show up in the two other lenses' viewfinder.
I usually go back eventually and take additional rolls of film for specific lenses.
raid
Dad Photographer
My wife has agreed to be my patient model this afternoon for testing the 24 lenses for portraits at window light. I know that Dana will be then upset and will ask me to also use her as a model, so I will on Sunday try some additional testing of lenses with Dana. I am also toying with the idea of taking one Summilux and one Canon 50/1.4 and one J-3with me outside the home and shoot with three cameras. Will we be able to see finer differences between the expensive-OK priced-inexpensive lenses when looking at photos taken hand held and at apertures smaller than 5.6?
Enjoy the weekend.
Enjoy the weekend.
raid
Dad Photographer
This is the latest family photo of the lenses in the test. I also use a Pentax digital spotmeter to better arrive at the best exposure for the testing. No lens hoods are being used so that any flaws will show. I use glasses to get better focusing. A pen is used to write down the lens names and settings.
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ampguy
Veteran
Raid, what brand and model of pen? I like Pilots and the Yoropen!
raid
Dad Photographer
I have completed five rolls of film [just about completed] by going through the 24 lenses in the three different mounts. So far, I have taken all photos with artificial light. I may take another batch of photos outdoors on the front porch the coming few days.
My set-up today was in the room, where I set up several stuffed animals as my models, with the background including trees and leaves in the backyard. The light was tricky as it was OK at first to take photos at available light, but then dark clouds moved in, and I had to turn on one ceiling light.
Then, after doing the entire drill, I was left with half-rolls, so I called Dana to the rescue. I set up more lights for consistency. With a promise for some chocolate, she sat patiently for one image per lens at 1.4/1.5 through the 24 lenses.
I squeezed in one photo taken with the Prominent Nokton plus a Contax adapter plus a Leica M adapter to see if the image still is OK or not. I could swear that I lost two f stops in light transmisison. Maybe it got darker in the room, but not by 2 stops.
For all practical purposes, I could stop now, but of course I won't!
Once I complete the few remaining negatives on each roll, I will have the five rolls developed and I will send them to our Roland for his touches.
I will at that time post a few sub-test results to keep you busy here.
My next test will be a J-3 vs. Canon 1.5 vs. Summilux on one roll. Who is the King, who is the Minister, and who is the Joker?
Can you tell the lenses apart by looking at those images?
I am not trying to put down the more expensive lenses. I love such lenses.
I just want to see if a Joe Shmoe photographer, as as I, can tell apart "general application " images taken by such lenses or not.
My set-up today was in the room, where I set up several stuffed animals as my models, with the background including trees and leaves in the backyard. The light was tricky as it was OK at first to take photos at available light, but then dark clouds moved in, and I had to turn on one ceiling light.
Then, after doing the entire drill, I was left with half-rolls, so I called Dana to the rescue. I set up more lights for consistency. With a promise for some chocolate, she sat patiently for one image per lens at 1.4/1.5 through the 24 lenses.
I squeezed in one photo taken with the Prominent Nokton plus a Contax adapter plus a Leica M adapter to see if the image still is OK or not. I could swear that I lost two f stops in light transmisison. Maybe it got darker in the room, but not by 2 stops.
For all practical purposes, I could stop now, but of course I won't!
Once I complete the few remaining negatives on each roll, I will have the five rolls developed and I will send them to our Roland for his touches.
I will at that time post a few sub-test results to keep you busy here.
My next test will be a J-3 vs. Canon 1.5 vs. Summilux on one roll. Who is the King, who is the Minister, and who is the Joker?
Can you tell the lenses apart by looking at those images?
I am not trying to put down the more expensive lenses. I love such lenses.
I just want to see if a Joe Shmoe photographer, as as I, can tell apart "general application " images taken by such lenses or not.
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raid
Dad Photographer
Those of you who kindly mailed me items for the test, please send me a pm or email with your preferred return mailing address and also type of return postage method [USPS priority mail/insurance/FEDEX]. I need also to know if you need your items as soon as possible back. In such a case, I will mail back the items the week after the fourth of July weekend.
Thanks.
Thanks.
raid
Dad Photographer
Happy Fourth of July to US members here.
I have just ended the formal testing of the lenses. I have seven rolls of 36 exposures that I will quickly get developed and scanned. Then I need to match each negative with a lens and aperture setting. That could take some extra time if I cannot clearly see the sequencing of lenses. Then, I will email Roland the scans for further work by him.
I may post some images here just to keep you busy until Roland can find the time to do the work on his site.
Most images are taken at 1.4/1.5 and at 2.8 for all lenses. Then, I took one roll of film at 1.4-2-2.8-4-5.6-8-11-16 for a Summilux M and a Canon 50/1.4 and for three J-3 lenses. Roger Hicks suggested to try taking a look at all aperture settings.
Cheers!
edited: I will tomorrow shoot with the newer Zeiss lenses. I am curious how well they will do.
I have just ended the formal testing of the lenses. I have seven rolls of 36 exposures that I will quickly get developed and scanned. Then I need to match each negative with a lens and aperture setting. That could take some extra time if I cannot clearly see the sequencing of lenses. Then, I will email Roland the scans for further work by him.
I may post some images here just to keep you busy until Roland can find the time to do the work on his site.
Most images are taken at 1.4/1.5 and at 2.8 for all lenses. Then, I took one roll of film at 1.4-2-2.8-4-5.6-8-11-16 for a Summilux M and a Canon 50/1.4 and for three J-3 lenses. Roger Hicks suggested to try taking a look at all aperture settings.
Cheers!
edited: I will tomorrow shoot with the newer Zeiss lenses. I am curious how well they will do.
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raid
Dad Photographer
My goal in this lens test is to give you a general overview of several fast 50mm lenses, with the possibility to see identical scenes side by side as captured by the twenty four lenses. I hope to have succeeded in checking for flare by shooting against a bare bulb light source. I also hope to test resolution by including in one scene a lit candle. Last time, Roland singled out the candle light for lens testing in his website follow-up work.
I tested mainly at wide open (1.4/1.5), plus at 2.8. I am assuming that at smaller apertures, most lenses do well.
Roger Hicks suggested to me to test at all apertures in an "ideal test", but he acknowlodged that it would be tedious. I took his advice, and I went back and singled out three lenses for a total aperture test (Summilux-M/Canon 50 1.4/J-3).
Seven rolls later, I still want to cover the Zeiss lenses for portraits.
I used a heavy Gitzo tripod to stabilize the three cameras for all photos. The Leica mount lenses may have an advantage here by me using the Bessa T with the extra rangefinder magnification. In contrast, the Contax IIIa was the worst of the three cameras for close-up work. The Nikon S was better, but no match for the Bessa T. This could be a factor to consider when viewing the results later on.
To assist my eyesight, I used a straw [dyed black] with the "models" on the table. I tried to get the straw alligned in the viewfinder, and this should have given me a high success rate in focusing correctly.
The available light was changing a lot, as clouds moved in and out, so I made sure to also have a source of artificial light.
I have fewer people portraits and more stuffed animals and dolls as my "models" this lens test. I may still get some portraits for selected lenses. It is not easy to ask someone to sit still until I complete using 24 lenses,and with three cameras!
I should get some interesting images back, hopefully.
I tested mainly at wide open (1.4/1.5), plus at 2.8. I am assuming that at smaller apertures, most lenses do well.
Roger Hicks suggested to me to test at all apertures in an "ideal test", but he acknowlodged that it would be tedious. I took his advice, and I went back and singled out three lenses for a total aperture test (Summilux-M/Canon 50 1.4/J-3).
Seven rolls later, I still want to cover the Zeiss lenses for portraits.
I used a heavy Gitzo tripod to stabilize the three cameras for all photos. The Leica mount lenses may have an advantage here by me using the Bessa T with the extra rangefinder magnification. In contrast, the Contax IIIa was the worst of the three cameras for close-up work. The Nikon S was better, but no match for the Bessa T. This could be a factor to consider when viewing the results later on.
To assist my eyesight, I used a straw [dyed black] with the "models" on the table. I tried to get the straw alligned in the viewfinder, and this should have given me a high success rate in focusing correctly.
The available light was changing a lot, as clouds moved in and out, so I made sure to also have a source of artificial light.
I have fewer people portraits and more stuffed animals and dolls as my "models" this lens test. I may still get some portraits for selected lenses. It is not easy to ask someone to sit still until I complete using 24 lenses,and with three cameras!
I should get some interesting images back, hopefully.
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