Calling all Pentax DSLR users.

[snip]

Hi there.

I am a fairly eccentric user, not unlike some here on the forum I have a fairly extensive rangefinder system with three Voigt bodies and 6 lenses, I have a Hasselblad system with a body, three lenses and two backs. Also I have a large format view camera with several lenses and a whole galaxy of fixed lens cameras.

For my DSLR needs I have a Canon system which I have whittled down to an EOS 5D with BG-E4 and RRS L plate, 24-105L, 50/1.4 and 70-300 IS with Hoya Pro-1 filters in 77 and 58mm (UV and PL-CIR) Op-tech strap and cable release. I also have three flashes, a 580EX-II, 550EX and 430EX with a host of diffuser domes.

Now as much as this is a fine dslr system I can't justify it, I very rarely use it and only really take snapshots of my daughter with it. It's large, heavy and cumbersome to lug around and quite frankly has a fair amount of money tied up in it, not a good thing for something that gets used once in a blue moon.

I have another SLR system, a Praktica MTL-5 with a 28mm Mamiya, 50mm Zeiss Jena, 55mm Takumar, 135 Hanimex(not that great) and an equally almost awful but none the less entertaining 500mm of a brand that I forget.

Having had a look at the Pentax line of dslr's I have concluded that It might be a viable idea to sell all my Canon gear, that is the DLSR kit, the flashes and also the EOS 1V I almost never use anymore, the sale of that should net me something in the region of £2500 I reckon.

Following that I would purchase a Pentax DSLR, most likely a refurbished or used K10D, they seem good value, I would get the cheap zoom lens and a pentax M42 adaptor and I have seen that split prism focusing screens are available for this camera.

I understand that I would then be able to use all the lovely M42 lenses out there like the SMC takumars, This would be with stop down metering and manually dialing in aperture prior to taking a shot, should be easy with lenses that feature an A/M switch.

A few things I am unsure of is:

Will auto focusing work correctly with the split prism installed(using the kit zoom lens which would likely be my only auto focus lens)?

"Crippled KAF mount"
What is this about? Does it mean that PK lenses not bearing the "A" designation will not work without stop down metering? I don't quite understand the difference between SMC A and SMC M lenses I think.


My main reason for wanting to implement this change is to get a smaller more portable camera for my snap shooting needs and to be able to use the excellent and cheap old PK lenses with digital capture and also free up a lot of cash invested in the Canon system.

I use the Canon flashes for other cameras, on stands with radio triggers, I would purchase some manual flashes for this, like the Vivitar 283.

The main disadvantages would be smaller, dimmer viewfinder and image quality not quite the same as with the 5D, the latter is less important as a camera that never gets used won't make great pictures regardless of how great the sensor is.

Is this all madness or am I on to something here?

Best regards

Jan

 

[RF-Addict]

Why do you need a DSLR at all? You said yourself that all you use it for are snapshots - heck, any P&S camera can do that! Why not sell ALL your digital stuff and get a Canon G10 instead - keep one of your Canon flashes to use on the G10 and you are all set.

 

[ruby.monkey]

Will auto focusing work correctly with the split prism installed(using the kit zoom lens which would likely be my only auto focus lens)?

Yes.

"Crippled KAF mount"
What is this about? Does it mean that PK lenses not bearing the "A" designation will not work without stop down metering? I don't quite understand the difference between SMC A and SMC M lenses I think.

Yes. Only the A-lenses will be able to communicate selected aperture to the body.

This is not a big deal, since it's possible to set the body to stop down and set shutter speed with the press of a button.

You'll have to decide whether size is more important than viewfinder quality. The K???D series uses a pretty miserable pentamirror viewfinder which, even with a Katz Eye screen, is dim; the K??D uses a nice, bright pentaprism.

 

[Bnack]

I've used a K10D with an old 50mm 1.8 lens and it works beautifully with stop down metering. On the K10D the depth of field preview button is right on the shutter button so it's very convenient to do stop down metering once you get the hang of it. I believe the crippled K-mount was merely referring to some of the new lenses that lack an aperture ring. The idea being that you can't use it on any of their old film cameras. I think this really only applies to their lower end lenses they currently put out. Btw... the pentax limited primes are wonderful lenses if you wanted to spend a couple extra bucks on a fully functional autofocus prime.

 

[snip]

Yes.


Yes. Only the A-lenses will be able to communicate selected aperture to the body.

This is not a big deal, since it's possible to set the body to stop down and set shutter speed with the press of a button.

You'll have to decide whether size is more important than viewfinder quality. The K???D series uses a pretty miserable pentamirror viewfinder which, even with a Katz Eye screen, is dim; the K??D uses a nice, bright pentaprism.

Excellent, so Autofocus is not going to be a problem and since I was going to buy a K10D or possibly a 20D anyway and get a split prism.

Now the remaining thing that baffles me is.

PK-M vs PK-A

So the A variety transmits data electronically to the camera but the M variety will still allow me to meter wide open and automatically stop down when taking the shot or do I have to manually stop down before metering and taking the shot?

//Jan

 

[mcgrattan]

I can't speak for the K10D but the GX10 (samsung branded sister camera) that I have works flawlessly with manual focus lenses. I don't even miss the split screen as the focus indicator in the finder is very effective on all but the hardest subjects.

With manual aperture lenses there's a button you can configure, you press it and the camera automatically stops down, measures the exposure and then stops back up but with the exposure setting stored.

As already mentioned, the K10D/GX10 and K20D/GX20 have very good bright finders.

 

[snip]

Why do you need a DSLR at all? You said yourself that all you use it for are snapshots - heck, any P&S camera can do that! Why not sell ALL your digital stuff and get a Canon G10 instead - keep one of your Canon flashes to use on the G10 and you are all set.

I can't stand compact camera's, composing on a screen and the shutter lag drives me insane.

//Jan

 

[snip]

I can't speak for the K10D but the GX10 (samsung branded sister camera) that I have works flawlessly with manual focus lenses. I don't even miss the split screen as the focus indicator in the finder is very effective on all but the hardest subjects.

With manual aperture lenses there's a button you can configure, you press it and the camera automatically stops down, measures the exposure and then stops back up but with the exposure setting stored.

As already mentioned, the K10D/GX10 and K20D/GX20 have very good bright finders.

A button on the lens barrel, like the manual/auto switch found on many M42 lenses?

//Jan

 

[mcgrattan]

No, the button is near the shutter release. It's analogous to the old 'hypermanual' option in some film Pentaxes.

You press it and it stops the lens down, takes a light reading and automatically sets the shutter speed. It then opens up again. It's basically like a little automated trial exposure that the camera runs.

As long as the lighting doesn't change, you can then just shoot. This is with KM lenses. With M42 you have to manually stop the lens down, naturally.

 

[snip]

No, the button is near the shutter release. It's analogous to the old 'hypermanual' option in some film Pentaxes.

You press it and it stops the lens down, takes a light reading and automatically sets the shutter speed. It then opens up again. It's basically like a little automated trial exposure that the camera runs.

As long as the lighting doesn't change, you can then just shoot. This is with KM lenses. With M42 you have to manually stop the lens down, naturally.

Excellent, so all PK fit lenses will work smooth and semi automatically, the "A" designated ones will work "automatically" as in they meter wide open and with M42 (as I already knew) it's stop down metering as normal.

I think the last step before taking the plunge is to find a K10D to fondle and see if it fits in my clumsy mits.

//Jan

 

[mcgrattan]

There were some complaints of inconsistent metering with KM mount lenses on the K10D I think, when it was first launched.

I've never had any problems with my GX10.

 

[bmattock]

I have never had any problems with AF or metering with the split screen installed in my *ist DS, either. I bought mine in 2004, and have more than 100,000 shots taken with it. Still going strong. I'm pleased with it.

The way to tell the difference between a KA lens and a K lens is that the KA will have an "A" on the aperture ring, and it will have a series of electrical contacts on the rim of the lens where it mounts to the camera. M or manual K mount lenses do not.

Also - just in case - be careful buying lenses made for Ricoh's version of the A - they called it "R-K" and it has a "P" on the aperture ring where the "A" would be for a lens made for a Pentax.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentax_k_mount#.22Crippled.22_KAF_mount

R-K mount

The R-K mount is a variation on the original K mount by Ricoh. It supports Ricoh's own implementation of shutter priority and auto exposure modes, similar to the KA mount but much simpler. The only addition to the original K mount is a small pin at the bottom which tells the body when the aperture ring has been set to the "P" setting (similar to the "A" setting on Pentax KA lenses).

Warning: This pin will catch on the drive-shaft hole in KAF and KAF2 cameras when turning the lens to lock it in place. It will jam part way and depending on the characteristics of this pin, it may be quite difficult to remove the lens from the camera.

The R-K mount is used on Rikenon P lenses, Ricoh bodies that include the letter 'P' in their model number, and some non-Ricoh lenses. It is compatible with all other K-mount cameras and lenses when in manual or aperture-priority exposure modes, however the extra pin needs to be removed for safe use on autofocus Pentax cameras.

I have a few of these lenses, and the pin is generally quite easy to remove, but if you fail to do so, you can lock the lens to the body in a way that won't come off. Very ugly.

Also, buy a genuine Pentax brand M42 adapter. The clones, in my experience, are bad. One design (with a lip) won't allow focus to infinity (they often don't mention that in their ads) and the other can get jammed in the camera mount and not want to come out, or twist around inside when you try to tighten the lens down. Spend a few bucks, get the real adapter. It works LOTS better.

 

[snip]

I have never had any problems with AF or metering with the split screen installed in my *ist DS, either. I bought mine in 2004, and have more than 100,000 shots taken with it. Still going strong. I'm pleased with it.

The way to tell the difference between a KA lens and a K lens is that the KA will have an "A" on the aperture ring, and it will have a series of electrical contacts on the rim of the lens where it mounts to the camera. M or manual K mount lenses do not.

Also - just in case - be careful buying lenses made for Ricoh's version of the A - they called it "R-K" and it has a "P" on the aperture ring where the "A" would be for a lens made for a Pentax.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentax_k_mount#.22Crippled.22_KAF_mount



I have a few of these lenses, and the pin is generally quite easy to remove, but if you fail to do so, you can lock the lens to the body in a way that won't come off. Very ugly.

Also, buy a genuine Pentax brand M42 adapter. The clones, in my experience, are bad. One design (with a lip) won't allow focus to infinity (they often don't mention that in their ads) and the other can get jammed in the camera mount and not want to come out, or twist around inside when you try to tighten the lens down. Spend a few bucks, get the real adapter. It works LOTS better.

Thanks for the info and advise, I had intended to purchase an original adaptor from Pentax and have no intention of buying Ricoch lenses.

I will start looking for a 24 and 35mm PK lenses now and get a watch on for a K10D with a kit lens for around £250, should be doable.

Any alternatives to the Katz eyes screens?
//Jan

 

[bmattock]

Thanks for the info and advise, I had intended to purchase an original adaptor from Pentax and have no intention of buying Ricoch lenses.

I will start looking for a 24 and 35mm PK lenses now and get a watch on for a K10D with a kit lens for around £250, should be doable.

Any alternatives to the Katz eyes screens?
//Jan

I use a cheap generic eBay special. I suspect it was simply a focus screen for a film camera that was trimmed to size, as the split-image rf section appears huge. It was something on the order of $30 USD with shipping. Came in a cheap white cardboard box marked 'PANTAX'. I installed it upside-down first, which caused me some consternation, as it did not focus properly. Took it out, turned it over, it worked fine. Fortunately, the *ist DS was designed with a user-replaceable focus screen, just a fingernail to pop the holder open and take the old one out.

If someone wanted to argue that the Katz-Eye is better and worth the extra lucre, I'd be willing to believe them. But my el cheapo has served me well. Manual focus has become quite effective and I use it often in that manner, but AF is still just fine.

 

[rover]

Other than to satisfy the eccentric desire to use old Taks and MF lenses I would recommend selling your DSLR bodies and excess equipment and just pick up a digi Rebel.

But since you want to dabble in the old glass, I still recommend selling off some of your excess equipment and pick up a K2000 or new KM when it comes out and dabble away.

Sell the 1V and a flash and you can cover the cost of the Pentax camera and a Tak.

 

[DeeCee3]

K10D's Served Me Well

K10D's Served Me Well

I've enjoyed reading this thread since it proves that not ALL dSLR users are stuck on Nikon and Canon. I have several film RFs (including an M2) and a Pentax K10D that's a pleasure to use.

My son's a pro photographer with a fortune tied up in Nikon gear and guess which camera he won't do a wedding without? My K10D!! He always borrows it when he has an important wedding assignment, mainly because I have one of Pentax's own superb 50-200 zoom.

So Snip, go for it...it's a great camera. And would be even greater if it were only a bit lighter in weight.

dc3

 

[shadowfox]

Pardon my curiosity.

As a fellow old manual lens fan, I wonder since you already have a "full-frame" Canon 5D, why would you downgrade to crop-size Pentax K10D? I've seen the pictures from both, and I'm sorry, full-frame just kicks butt. 😀

Adapters for manual lenses cannot be more abundant if you stay with the EOS mount, M42, Exakta, Pentacon 6... I mean, how more exotic would you like to be.

If you let go of the battery grip and just use your 5D like a regular DSLR (can't do that with the 1D or 1Ds series), it's not much bigger than anything else out there, so not much size-saving from switching to another brand ... unless, you are switching to an Olympus E-420, now that one is tiny.

Oh, and lastly, you can get the EE-S screen to aid manual focusing on the 5D, too bad Canon didn't make the equivalent of the excellent EC-B split-prism focusing screen for 5D (grrrrr!)

 

[squirrel$$$bandit]

For me, the main advantage of the Pentax DSLR's is the in-body stabilization. Because it's in the camera itself, new lenses are cheaper than Canon's, and you get FULL STABILIZATION with OLD LENSES. I just bought a Pentax-A 70-210mm zoom, one of the best zooms Pentax has ever made, for $99, and it will have the functionality of a new lens (aside from AF).

You don't necessarily need a KatzEye for focusing. The cameras have a focus confirm square and beep, and this has always been more than enough for me, at least in good light. I'd highly recommend the K20D over the K10D...the price has gone down, and there are 14 million pixels, plenty for cropping.

Finally, you can get the screwmount adapters for $30 direct from Pentax. It's impossible to find on the site, so here's a link:

http://www.pentaxwebstore.com/detail/PTX+30120

 

[dlove5]

Is this all madness or am I on to something here?

It is all madness for sure, but it is fun madness. I have had a lot of fun using old M42 and K mount lenses. Some I had before I got my K10D, some I have picked up since.

Because my eyes are not the best, I bought the 1.2x eyepiece magnifier. That has helped me focus better. The focus confirmation isn't completely fool proof especially when shooting at 1.4 in low light.

 

[charjohncarter]

My K10D is basically a fixed lens DSLR, as I use only a 35mm FA lens. It is all I ever need. Because like you I only use it for family pictures or images for quick viewing. I would be surprised if you will ever see image quality difference between the to two cameras. You are not going to blow up to 24 by 36. And if you ever did you would use your 4x5 or Hassy.