Privacy and Respect in our Photos

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Thanks so much for posting this, I used to answer phones for the city editor and cut out Pogo for him, truly a gem. Still fresh today.

Thread reminds me to download the new "discrete" mode for my Leica, all I need now is some tan and long pants. ;-)

John

"We have met the enemy and he is us!"

 
Ahmed Poltroon said:
I was in the 4 train in Manhattan a few days ago, late at night.

A malodorous woman got up from her seat, dropped her dress, and deposited a huge steaming defecation in the middle of the floor of the subway car, just as casually as if she were in a bathroom. She was even reading a newspaper and picking her nose.

Nobody gawked, but they all quickly moved to the other side of the car, and went into another part of the train at the next station. The smell was overbearing.

I feel this display reflected a terrible lack of manners. Unfortunately, I was not equipped with a camera, the Nikon D700 would have been up to the job.
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Now that's a New Yorker!
 
Judging books by their covers, I'd say. Pity. There is always much more to a person than the way they look on the outside. To judge someone so is rather superficial.
 
Ahmed Poltroon said:
I was in the 4 train in Manhattan a few days ago, late at night.

A malodorous woman got up from her seat, dropped her dress, and deposited a huge steaming defecation in the middle of the floor of the subway car, just as casually as if she were in a bathroom. She was even reading a newspaper and picking her nose.
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....hence my request for a 'scratch'n sniff' feature to be added to the RFF user interface. :D
 
ClaremontPhoto said:
Now twice in a the past month foreign tourists have shown up here with big cameras and bad manners. We usually don't get tourists, but it's not difficult to spot somebody in shorts with lardy white skin and bad muscle tone and cannot speak a single word of Portuguese.

The first one I never saw in person. I just heard about him later. He asked for me by name, and he must have hacked off the cafe owner because he told the guy he'd never heard of me. The people in the cafe related the story to me the following day with glee. They sensed something had not been right, not least his camera 'as big as those ones you see on TV at football matches' they said. Why does he need such a big camera? I told them he sounded like a plonker and they all agreed.

Then a week later I was having a morning coffee, flicking through the newspaper, half watching the TV when another one turned up. Shorts, white skin, no language skills and an enormous Canon SLR with a lens big enough to take on a safari. He too asked after me and where I lived. He was standing right next to me. The cafe owner flicked his eyes very discreetly in my direction asking the question, and I signaled back 'No'.

This time I was able to watch plonker #2 (everybody later agreed it was a different guy) who was scoping out the room like as if he was at the zoo and deciding how to best photograph some interesting animals.

Bad attitude. Everybody decided to put up a newspaper barricade, or turn the other way, or walk to another cafe nearby. There was no way plonker #2 was going to get a photo of any of us.

If you, like myself, photograph people with dignity and show them respect and take an interest after the 1/60 at f5.6 have you personally ever successfully 'covered your tracks' so that idiots do not follow later and mess up big time? It's a serious question.
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For all of the criticism we Americans get for being preoccupied with superficiality and elitism, I think this thread speaks volumes.

I don't know if it's the pretentious attitude that big cameras are representative of excess and idiocy or even the sense of entitlement and esteem placed on "being a local", but I challenge you to apply the same level of judgment to yourself as you so generously do to others. You did not even meet the first individual and you labeled him as a plonker.

I just think it's tragically comical how this works:

- They see bar patrons as interesting photo subjects without getting to know them personally.

- You see other photographers and mock their appearance and gear without getting to know them personally.

How can you seriously think that you're in any place to judge them?
 
I don't necessarily agree with Jon's position or his attitude to photographic interlopers on his Manor, on first reading his post comes across as very parochial but it has kicked off an interesting thread which (as I suspect he intended) has flushed out the usual trolls.

The one thing that surprises me about alot of the contributions is the assumption that the lardy chaps with the snazzy cameras are American. I don't see any reference to the nationality of these folk in the OP. Am I missing something?
 
"Instead, treating them as objects of derision and scorn based upon your visual assessment only shows arrogance and contempt."
Quote by photomat

"Diversity"
 
Did I miss something? I am Austrian and counted myself in when it came to obnoxious tourists.
There is a special phenomenon "Big Country syndrome" it makes citizens of big counries feel like some kind of conquerors. Austria is small so before 1989 we used to succumb to the western country syndrome behaving like nabobs in communist countries.
When we are tourists our IQ drops about 40% our motoric skills fall to the level of a 3 year old. So cheesy white complexion and obnoxious behaviour is not an American monopoly.
"Being Austrian has an advantage: We are less!" ....Being Bulgarian is a mixed blessing....
 
kbg32 said:
I live in NYC. Who has manners???
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I once took a course in documentary photography in NYC, where the first assignment was to meet a stranger on the street in NY, and to end up photographing him in his home.

Now that's an exercise in quickly establishing rapport with your subject and trust in your motives. Only the students who had lots of time to devote to the exercise succeeded; all who did brought back amazing photos and stories.

From the stories the students told, I'm convinced that the subjects found the experience enriching and rewarding as well. While the OP's visitor might have failed the assignment through lack of rapport, the OP's attitude of prejudice and derision toward strangers tells me he would have failed miserably too; and he certainly lost the opportunity to meet someone from another land and culture.

::Ari
 
kermaier said:
While the OP's visitor might have failed the assignment through lack of rapport, the OP's attitude of prejudice and derision toward strangers tells me he would have failed miserably too; and he certainly lost the opportunity to meet someone from another land and culture.
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I searched Jon's description of how 'awful' the foreigners were. He said this:


Now twice in a the past month foreign tourists have shown up here with big cameras and bad manners.
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OK, so big cameras are rude, apparently, and so are bad manners. But we do not know specifically what bad manners Jon is talking about. So let's continue...

We usually don't get tourists, but it's not difficult to spot somebody in shorts with lardy white skin and bad muscle tone and cannot speak a single word of Portuguese.
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Ah, so if a tourist is heavy-set, white, flabby, and cannot speak Portuguese, they are 'rude'.

The first one I never saw in person. I just heard about him later. He asked for me by name, and he must have hacked off the cafe owner because he told the guy he'd never heard of me.
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No idea what he did to 'hack off' the cafe owner, but apparently it involved being fat and white.


The people in the cafe related the story to me the following day with glee. They sensed something had not been right, not least his camera 'as big as those ones you see on TV at football matches' they said. Why does he need such a big camera? I told them he sounded like a plonker and they all agreed.
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Again, same description. A 'plonker' is someone who carries a big camera.

Then a week later I was having a morning coffee, flicking through the newspaper, half watching the TV when another one turned up. Shorts, white skin, no language skills and an enormous Canon SLR with a lens big enough to take on a safari. He too asked after me and where I lived. He was standing right next to me. The cafe owner flicked his eyes very discreetly in my direction asking the question, and I signaled back 'No'.
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And again. White, shorts, can't speak Portuguese = rude.


This time I was able to watch plonker #2 (everybody later agreed it was a different guy) who was scoping out the room like as if he was at the zoo and deciding how to best photograph some interesting animals.
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This is the only reference I got that even remotely indicated that the person had done something objectionable besides just be an outsider - he 'scoped out the room' in a manner Jon found unacceptable.

Well, as I said earlier, I don't think this thread had anything to do with rudeness or foreigners. It was a chance for Jon to say "Look, I'm important! Foreigners seek me out and try to replicate my photographs!"

OK, Jon, we're all impressed.
 
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